I tried to support Chrysler... but dayum... bring on Honda! (or Toyota)

[rudder]

So my wife's 2003 Dodge Caravan is missing at idle and during acceleration. So she takes it to the shop and reports back that we have bad spark plugs and a ripped hose (cant remember what she said exactly)... cha-ching $450. I bet all those bastards and the dealership would just clean the fuel injectors and send her on her way. The only reason I took it to the dealer is because I though it was an issue with the fuel injectors since it does not stutter at highway speeds (i am no mechanic so maybe). Unless you blow a cylinder or something... the 70K mile warranty is useless. Plus the gas cap won't hold a seal and is causing problems.

But its not just the crap quality of a car that is falling apart at 54K miles... its the whole car support system. I know I am in for a fight what I go pick the van up from the dealer and take it to my brother-in-laws shop.

I also own a Honda civic (bought used with 30K and came with a 100,000 mile warranty). At 146K miles it is purring along. Other that scheduled maintainence, I have put in zero for repairs (this after $8000 of body work resulting from 2 incidents that were not my fault). On top of that I have taken it for maintainence at a Honda dealer... and they treat you very nice. Dealing with the shop manager has never been an issue as opposed to pulling teeth with the Dodge guy. Plus the Honda place has couches, wireless, muffins, hot coffee, and cable compared with a day old pot of coffee and a fuzzy television which forces you to read last years American Hunter magazine. Honda just genuinely cares about customer service.

This was my first new car I bought since 9/11. I read reviews and researched... and it felt like the right thing to buy a car from the big 3. Once bitten twice shy.


cliffs:
bought dodge caravan
caravan falls apart at 54K miles
dodge sucks along with their dealers
Going to support the 5000 U.S. workers at the Toyota plant in Mississippi.

 

[OutHouse]

my 1995 GMC 1500K started falling apart at around 70K. just little things, like a door handle busted off, a spring broke under the driver seat. the passenger seat stop sliding al the way forward. window washer fluid started to leak.

just stupid sh*t.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Not surpising. I used to rent those crappy vans. We used to hope they'd make it through the weekend without stranding our customers with transmission problems. The Ford Aerostar was even worse...

 

[iamwiz82]

Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

 

[jhayx7]

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

So she takes it to the shop and reports back that we have bad spark plugs and a ripped hose (cant remember what she said exactly)... cha-ching $450.

Re-read the post. Spark Plugs + hose should not have been over $150.

I think he was pointing out how bad they stuck it in his prison wallet without any hello jelly.

 

[rudder]

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

According to the manual they don't need to be changed until 80k miles (and come to think of it... the Honda still has original plugs in it). Plus I dont even think it is the spark plugs otherwise I would have this issue all the time. So I am thinking its the fuel injectors. But this is not the first issue with the van... just part of an ongoing saga.

 

[iamwiz82]

Originally posted by: jhayx7

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

So she takes it to the shop and reports back that we have bad spark plugs and a ripped hose (cant remember what she said exactly)... cha-ching $450.

Re-read the post. Spark Plugs + hose should not have been over $150.

I think he was pointing out how bad they stuck it in his prison wallet without any hello jelly.

I did re-read it. I also read where he doesn't even know what was done. I cannot think of many hoses that have 6-8 hours of labor involved in replacing them.

 

[nakedfrog]

Huh. My 2004 Sebring is over 66k miles and it's doing just fine. My friend drove his 99 Stratus until it had 100k miles, then traded it in on a Chrysler Minivan so he could haul large items around.

 

[Aikouka]

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
I did re-read it. I also read where he doesn't even know what was done. I cannot think of many hoses that have 6-8 hours of labor involved in replacing them.

When working on my Talon, I could replace just about any hose in in around an hour (after thinking about the hoses on the car and where they're located). Although, that may be because the only thing you may ever have to take out to access a hose would be the battery + holder. The only difficult hose I could think of would be the oil cooler ring coolant hose.. because unless you take off the oil filter, that is a PITA to get on and off. One time my turbo coolant line broke on me. I pulled a pre-bent hose from an older intake manifold, cut it up (it was the right angle, just a little too long), and in 5 minutes, I replaced the coolant hose . I never really helped my dad when he did any work on my Mom's Caravans (she had a 1994 one and a ... 2001 one I believe), so I don't know much about them at all... other than we always had transmission problems with the 1994 van.

EDIT: Forgot a parenthesis.

EDIT 2: Actually, I bet the AC hoses would've been unpleasant to change.

 

[CrackRabbit]

Originally posted by: iamwiz82

Originally posted by: jhayx7

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

So she takes it to the shop and reports back that we have bad spark plugs and a ripped hose (cant remember what she said exactly)... cha-ching $450.

Re-read the post. Spark Plugs + hose should not have been over $150.

I think he was pointing out how bad they stuck it in his prison wallet without any hello jelly.

I did re-read it. I also read where he doesn't even know what was done. I cannot think of many hoses that have 6-8 hours of labor involved in replacing them.

The hose may not of taken that long but getting to the back three spark plugs on a transversely mounted V-6 could be a large chunk of it.
Probably had to drop the motor to just get to them.
With that said my GF's 2001 PT Cruiser has only had one issue that wasn't caused by her running it into something or someone running into her, a faulty EGR valve.

 

[RU482]

wow, good for you

 

[rudder]

Originally posted by: iamwiz82

Originally posted by: jhayx7

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

So she takes it to the shop and reports back that we have bad spark plugs and a ripped hose (cant remember what she said exactly)... cha-ching $450.

Re-read the post. Spark Plugs + hose should not have been over $150.

I think he was pointing out how bad they stuck it in his prison wallet without any hello jelly.

I did re-read it. I also read where he doesn't even know what was done. I cannot think of many hoses that have 6-8 hours of labor involved in replacing them.

Nothing was done... it was just a quote. My point is the dodge sucks, i think its the fuel injectors and the dealer is probably trying to scam my wife.

Edited to add another point: I used to not mind doing my own maintainence... but now I am busier and have more money, I pay someone else. I am just amazed about the lack of quality in this dodge mini van. Its babied by the wife, regular scheduled maintainence items are taken care of... yet I was quoted $450 to repair something in a car that has 54K miles versus my awesome running civic.

You may be a mechanic.. super for you... you may like Dodge cars... double good for you. My next car will be a honda or toyota.

 

[Ktulu]

Originally posted by: rudder

Originally posted by: iamwiz82

Originally posted by: jhayx7

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

So she takes it to the shop and reports back that we have bad spark plugs and a ripped hose (cant remember what she said exactly)... cha-ching $450.

Re-read the post. Spark Plugs + hose should not have been over $150.

I think he was pointing out how bad they stuck it in his prison wallet without any hello jelly.

I did re-read it. I also read where he doesn't even know what was done. I cannot think of many hoses that have 6-8 hours of labor involved in replacing them.

Nothing was done... it was just a quote. My point is the dodge sucks, i think its the fuel injectors and the dealer is probably trying to scam my wife.

Dodge sucks or the dealer sucks?

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

Have you tried to change the 3 plugs on the backside of the Caravan engine?

You have to unbolt the engine and tilt the engine forward to get to the plugs.

 

[rudder]

Originally posted by: Ktulu

Originally posted by: rudder

Originally posted by: iamwiz82

Originally posted by: jhayx7

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

So she takes it to the shop and reports back that we have bad spark plugs and a ripped hose (cant remember what she said exactly)... cha-ching $450.

Re-read the post. Spark Plugs + hose should not have been over $150.

I think he was pointing out how bad they stuck it in his prison wallet without any hello jelly.

I did re-read it. I also read where he doesn't even know what was done. I cannot think of many hoses that have 6-8 hours of labor involved in replacing them.

Nothing was done... it was just a quote. My point is the dodge sucks, i think its the fuel injectors and the dealer is probably trying to scam my wife.

Dodge sucks or the dealer sucks?

both suck.. the van is crap and the dealership is an ass to deal with. Never had that problem at an Honda dealer I have visited.

 

[Turin39789]

Wait, so you don't even know what the problem is and haven't been charged anything?

 

[mitaiwan82]

had a '93 Chrysler Town and Country in the family until a few years ago...the thing ran pretty well in the 120k we had - only big repair was a failed automatic transmission, but that was covered under warranty. Also had great memories in the minivan in high school

 

[Ktulu]

Originally posted by: rudder

Originally posted by: Ktulu

Originally posted by: rudder

Originally posted by: iamwiz82

Originally posted by: jhayx7

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

So she takes it to the shop and reports back that we have bad spark plugs and a ripped hose (cant remember what she said exactly)... cha-ching $450.

Re-read the post. Spark Plugs + hose should not have been over $150.

I think he was pointing out how bad they stuck it in his prison wallet without any hello jelly.

I did re-read it. I also read where he doesn't even know what was done. I cannot think of many hoses that have 6-8 hours of labor involved in replacing them.

Nothing was done... it was just a quote. My point is the dodge sucks, i think its the fuel injectors and the dealer is probably trying to scam my wife.

Dodge sucks or the dealer sucks?

both suck.. the van is crap and the dealership is an ass to deal with. Never had that problem at an Honda dealer I have visited.

Well I doubt Honda or Toyota are immune from shady dealerships or bad products.

 

[thedarkwolf]

Oh my god the spark plugs and a hose need replacing at 50k miles. Burn it.

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: rudder

Originally posted by: Ktulu

Originally posted by: rudder

Originally posted by: iamwiz82

Originally posted by: jhayx7

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

So she takes it to the shop and reports back that we have bad spark plugs and a ripped hose (cant remember what she said exactly)... cha-ching $450.

Re-read the post. Spark Plugs + hose should not have been over $150.

I think he was pointing out how bad they stuck it in his prison wallet without any hello jelly.

I did re-read it. I also read where he doesn't even know what was done. I cannot think of many hoses that have 6-8 hours of labor involved in replacing them.

Nothing was done... it was just a quote. My point is the dodge sucks, i think its the fuel injectors and the dealer is probably trying to scam my wife.

Dodge sucks or the dealer sucks?

both suck.. the van is crap and the dealership is an ass to deal with. Never had that problem at an Honda dealer I have visited.

My '97 Dakota has over 100k mile, and aside from regular maintenance, I am not aware of much problems. Original engine, original parts it seems (bought it used around 87k i think, could have been 93, hell don't know anymore...), still purrs. Just the purr is a little different and there are a few things that need to be fixed, mostly in the exhaust line though. heard the water pump or something or other needs replaced around the 100k mark, may be reason for some of the noise I hear that doesn't sound normal to my ears.
plus the guy before me had a hitch, and between 97 and 04 (mostly just 97 and 03, bought it spring 04, who knows how long it was at the used car lot), it had close to 90k miles put on it. Obviously drove it long ways with whatever was on that hitch. Still alive.

Never dealt with a Dodge dealer though. but i would never hate an entire auto company because of bad experiences with a dealer. Understandable after the van, however.

 

[Rage187]

I always bought GM products, every single one was on it's last leg by 100,000 miles.

Bought 2 2007 Honda Civics and I am done with American Cars. And yes I knwo they are built in america.

 

[iamwiz82]

Originally posted by: rudder

Originally posted by: iamwiz82

Originally posted by: jhayx7

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

So she takes it to the shop and reports back that we have bad spark plugs and a ripped hose (cant remember what she said exactly)... cha-ching $450.

Re-read the post. Spark Plugs + hose should not have been over $150.

I think he was pointing out how bad they stuck it in his prison wallet without any hello jelly.

I did re-read it. I also read where he doesn't even know what was done. I cannot think of many hoses that have 6-8 hours of labor involved in replacing them.

Nothing was done... it was just a quote. My point is the dodge sucks, i think its the fuel injectors and the dealer is probably trying to scam my wife.

Edited to add another point: I used to not mind doing my own maintainence... but now I am busier and have more money, I pay someone else. I am just amazed about the lack of quality in this dodge mini van. Its babied by the wife, regular scheduled maintainence items are taken care of... yet I was quoted $450 to repair something in a car that has 54K miles versus my awesome running civic.

You may be a mechanic.. super for you... you may like Dodge cars... double good for you. My next car will be a honda or toyota.

I just bought a Toyota two weeks ago. I just get annoyed when people bitch and moan over a maintenance item. Spark plugs go bad, and according to the maintenance schedule I am looking at, they are to be replaced at 30,000 miles. Honda recommends the exact same interval for the Civic.

Have you tried to change the 3 plugs on the backside of the Caravan engine?

You have to unbolt the engine and tilt the engine forward to get to the plugs.

IIRC, you can get to them by removing the wiper tub and assemblies.

 

[radioouman]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Spark plugs are regular maintenance items. They are $2/each at the auto parts store. You take your Honda in for it's regular maintenace, why not the van?

Have you tried to change the 3 plugs on the backside of the Caravan engine?

You have to unbolt the engine and tilt the engine forward to get to the plugs.

Not true. You can get to them by removing the windshield cowl and using a long extension with a universal joint. It helps if you have another guy underneath to guide the socket onto the plug.

The newer 3.3/3.8 engines have a different intake plenum design so that it is easier to get to the rear of the engine.

My parent's owned one of the first '96 Caravans, and they just got rid of it last fall. It had 155,000 miles on it, and of course it lasted 11 years. My '93 Dakota has 215,000 miles on it, my '94 has 140,000 miles on it, and my 2002 Sebring has 87,000 miles on it. Other than very minor items, these have all been reliable vehicles, and I appreciate the significantly cheaper cost to buy them (used) than comparable Hondas/Toyotas.

 

[AgaBoogaBoo]

I agree on the point of customer service and ease of the whole process, not to mention you don't have minor things everywhere bugging you. It's like getting a wound, and then noticing 50 little things, aka pouring salt on the wound

My 91 Accord has 191k miles on it now or something like that? Love the thing and wouldn't trade it in for most anything in the price range. When I buy a car from Honda or Toyota, I know that it's been overengineered, a hose here or there probably means nothing and it's been designed to run without it if need be. Basically, it's 17 years old and there hasn't been much done to it aside from regular oil changes, brake pads, tires, etc.

 

[Fenixgoon]

my mom has a 2003 (i think) chrysler town and country with no problems whatsoever, IIRC