I think Witcher 3 has ruined/set the bar for any other RPG for me

[mikeymikec]

I bought Dragon Age: Inquisition as a Christmas present for my wife; she likes to watch me play that kind of game.

I'm not sure whether my main criticism of the game is the standardised "gather 56 crimson nirnroot and be rewarded with a bag of random loot", or the fact that I just spent 45 MINUTES managing my inventory and upgrading stuff at the Undercroft, mostly due to the unnecessarily complicated procedure of upgrading armour and weapons.

W3 really puts the player in the life of the main character in that he picks up a problem to solve, NPCs have realistic expressions and character, the villagers often each have their own characters and interpersonal relationships (which often aren't strictly speaking necessary), and sometimes the life of a Witcher is getting appreciated for clearing out whatever horde has scared the villagers away, or sometimes getting insulted and generally shat on by the local populace because that's what being an outsider is like. Or if you run into a quest without checking all the angles that you can end up making a decision based on ignorance with unintended consequences, or even in hindsight you did everything right and it still didn't have a happy ending. That's lifelike.

One really odd thing about DAI is that I think I may have bought one or two items from merchants, but 99% of the other upgrades I've done were due to things I looted/discovered, and this ever-increasing bag of gold I have seems to have no purpose, even though I'm pretty sure I'm at least halfway through the game by now!

 

[tidy]

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[[DHT]Osiris]

I bought Dragon Age: Inquisition as a Christmas present for my wife; she likes to watch me play that kind of game.

I'm not sure whether my main criticism of the game is the standardised "gather 56 crimson nirnroot and be rewarded with a bag of random loot", or the fact that I just spent 45 MINUTES managing my inventory and upgrading stuff at the Undercroft, mostly due to the unnecessarily complicated procedure of upgrading armour and weapons.

W3 really puts the player in the life of the main character in that he picks up a problem to solve, NPCs have realistic expressions and character, the villagers often each have their own characters and interpersonal relationships (which often aren't strictly speaking necessary), and sometimes the life of a Witcher is getting appreciated for clearing out whatever horde has scared the villagers away, or sometimes getting insulted and generally shat on by the local populace because that's what being an outsider is like. Or if you run into a quest without checking all the angles that you can end up making a decision based on ignorance with unintended consequences, or even in hindsight you did everything right and it still didn't have a happy ending. That's lifelike.

One really odd thing about DAI is that I think I may have bought one or two items from merchants, but 99% of the other upgrades I've done were due to things I looted/discovered, and this ever-increasing bag of gold I have seems to have no purpose, even though I'm pretty sure I'm at least halfway through the game by now!

I can honestly say that inventory management is one of the biggest issues so many RPGs have. I cannot tell you how many hours in my life have been spent staring at a 3x6 grid of garbage trying to figure out what is for who, what is vendorable because it's intended to be vendored trash, what things might be needed in a quest somewhere, why I never have enough inventory/bag space for normal, everyday 'doing the things' in the game, etc.

Playing through Dragon's Dogma: Dark Arisen right now, I'm like five hours in and the inventory management is driving me batshit insane. I'm LOVING the game, but jfc I should not have to spend 20 minutes in town doing *stuff* every 2 hours, due to the clunkiness of the UI.

 

[kypron77]

Yeah, they need to completely eliminate inventory wrangling in new games. There's no excuse in 2017 to be going cross-eyed trying to line up your doo-dads and figure out what you can get rid of. I think I even made a rage thread a while ago about inventories. But The Witcher 3 did patch the weight restriction and allow unlimited stacking of crafting materials in an organized page, if I remember correctly, and for that reason alone it's already better than TES games with their 30 page lists of junk. (Why can't I pick up this weapon? Oh right I have 1000 pounds of toy cars and sewing machines)

 

[Zenoth]

I'm not sure if I'm in the minority about this, but even when it comes to BioWare's own standards without comparison to games from other developers I thought that Inquisition was inferior to DA Origins. The main story arc was far better in Origins (of course, it's my opinion), but my main complaints about Inquisition resides with the Inquisitor. I felt absolutely zero connection with my character throughout the entire game. In fact, the best moment of the game for me was when I saw my Hawk appear.

That's because even if DA2's foundations was meager and rushed out of the gates it still did something better than Inquisition, which was to give us (well, for me anyway it was the case) a protagonist that we could care about. What I loved about both DA Origins and DA2 was how the protagonist had his/her own Origin before the main game starts, which helps better understand the character in the long run (and it obviously helped me doing actual role-play in my head much more efficiently). Now, granted, the "origin intro" of DA2 was overall rather short and cringe-worthy in comparison to the great actual unique Origin stories of the first game. But it still did 'a job' that just wasn't there in Inquisition at all.

That's also obviously something that The Witcher series has done very well. You don't need to read the books, and even if you start with The Witcher 3 you still have a lot of meat around the bones when it comes to understanding the character that you play as. In Inquisition, creating "my own character" was more cosmetic than anything else, it had very little substance and origin/individual-based information to go with the character's past. So yeah even for BioWare I'd say that what "set the bar" was DA Origins, and some parts of DA2 even did a better job than Inquisition. Now, don't get me wrong, Inquisition was a solid game; I didn't 'hate' it per se. But Inquisition - ultimately - was very forgettable (especially the antagonist, which ended up as the worst villain in BioWare's games history in my book).

And, back to the main point of your thread, I do agree that TW3 has indeed set up the bar pretty high. And I think that only Cyberpunk 2077 has a chance to meet it and even surpass it. I highly doubt that Elder Scrolls 6, ME Andromeda, or the next Dragon Age will be able to ever come close to what they'll do with that game, let alone even get anywhere close to the masterpiece that is TW3.

 

[DrunkenSano]

Is it worth playing on console or should Witcher 3 be played on PC only?

 

[StinkyPinky]

The game itself is amazing, not just the graphics. So if your only option is a console then by all means play it on one. It's a great game.

 

[bystander36]

The Witcher 3 Inventory management isn't really all that new. It's just recent RPG's have built their inventory management around console games, and PC versions have suffered with their inventory UI.

Anyway, the Witcher 3 was well done, especially for an open world game, but I'd be very happen to see more Dragon Age Origin style games too. I don't think every game needs to transition to open world, but if they do, at least do it well. Dragon Age Inquisition was pretty good, but it didn't need to be open world, and the controls were pretty terrible. I much preferred DAO's controls.

 

[zinfamous]

Yes, it will be tough, certainly for RPGs, to live up to Witcher 3. because of this, I'm not that excited for TES VI, but I am excited for Cyberpunk 20whatever. With FO 4, I think you accept that Bethesda just isn't going to be doing anything revolutionary with that formula. And not that it's the worst thing, it's just that you get tired of the same game being released.

And I still like TES and will certainly play the shit out of TES VI, even if it is really no different than Skyrim. I think TES and Witcher are just very different types of games in the end, and I appreciate them for their strengths. TES is actually better with immersion, exploration, and even those random sidequests that only happen through serious exploration. I don't think Bethesda gets enough credit for the level of detail they put into designing those little discoveries you make: the empty camp with scattered goods, a letter between two lovers, a nearby bear cave with a sleeping bear, kill bear, discover corpse of lovers. Stuff like that, all over the world. Witcher series stories are just outright superior in plot and execution, which is obviously an important part of any RPG.

 

[frozentundra123456]

The golden age of bioware RPGs is long past. They haven't made an outstanding RPG since ME1/DAO, imo. I thought W3 was very good game, but not quite up to the classics from Bioware like Baldurs gate, NWN, and even KOTOR 1. DAI was technically well done, but it just seemed like for the entire game something was missing, and it never really drew me in or made me really care about the characters.

 

[Igo69]

Wait for Cyberpunk 2077 that is being made by Witchers . They said it is going to be bigger than Witcher

 

[renz20003]

I think the UI is clunky, and the controls need some major tweaking from the stock configuration.

Overall it's a fantastic game.

 

[mikeymikec]

I think the UI is clunky, and the controls need some major tweaking from the stock configuration.

Overall it's a fantastic game.

DAI or W3?

 

[renz20003]

DAI or W3?

W3

 

[PlanetJosh]

It's heading that way for me as well referring to the thread title. Helped along further by Witcher 3 looking better visually than a modded Skyrim, imo. And looking better than just about any other Rpg. The graphics being one part of the whole Rpg gaming experience for most players.

 

[shortylickens]

Deus Ex ruined other games for me.

Its all been drivel since then.

 

[tidy]

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[clok1966]

I must have been hit in the head, I loved W1, and W2 was almost as good, W3 lost me after a few hours. Its a old JPRPG with a pretty skin (very pretty). Arrived at the first inn, talked to people and found I was TRAPPED, cant leave till i figure out what dialog option i missed. Nothing shuts a game immersion factor off more than locking a person in a room till they talk to somebody the right way. it reminded me of the old JPRPGs where having 100 people in a town who all talked. But only 5 had info to move the story along, the other 95 where game filler, flesh out the world so to speak, but in all actuality where just a time sink to make the game last longer. To be fair there where not even close to that many people in that inn, and most where worth talking too, but locking me in till I talk correctly, sorry.. bad design. I'm guessing I'm missing the great game behind those locked doors, i must be as I keep hearing its great. But there are so many games that haven't locked m in a room I am playing them. I know its petty, such a small thing, but I keep thinking why not just have that door open close whenever I want, i miss the quest, advancement of story, i have to go back, that's on me, don't decide for me. I know I will play it someday, and comeback here and POST what a fool I have been, all because of a locked door.

 

[bystander36]

I must have been hit in the head, I loved W1, and W2 was almost as good, W3 lost me after a few hours. Its a old JPRPG with a pretty skin (very pretty). Arrived at the first inn, talked to people and found I was TRAPPED, cant leave till i figure out what dialog option i missed. Nothing shuts a game immersion factor off more than locking a person in a room till they talk to somebody the right way. it reminded me of the old JPRPGs where having 100 people in a town who all talked. But only 5 had info to move the story along, the other 95 where game filler, flesh out the world so to speak, but in all actuality where just a time sink to make the game last longer. To be fair there where not even close to that many people in that inn, and most where worth talking too, but locking me in till I talk correctly, sorry.. bad design. I'm guessing I'm missing the great game behind those locked doors, i must be as I keep hearing its great. But there are so many games that haven't locked m in a room I am playing them. I know its petty, such a small thing, but I keep thinking why not just have that door open close whenever I want, i miss the quest, advancement of story, i have to go back, that's on me, don't decide for me. I know I will play it someday, and comeback here and POST what a fool I have been, all because of a locked door.

That's typical RPG mechanics. W1, and W2 both had moments where you had to come up with the right dialog options to advance on with the story. The same is the case with DA and it's sequels, and every RPG I can think of that has a strong story line. There are always moments you have to figure out to advance. You are also in the prologue town, where the game is still holding your hand to get you started. Once out of that area, the game becomes an open world game that has an optional main story line to follow (though there is 1 or 2 story options that give you access to more regions).

 

[clok1966]

That's typical RPG mechanics. W1, and W2 both had moments where you had to come up with the right dialog options to advance on with the story. The same is the case with DA and it's sequels, and every RPG I can think of that has a strong story line. There are always moments you have to figure out to advance. You are also in the prologue town, where the game is still holding your hand to get you started. Once out of that area, the game becomes an open world game that has an optional main story line to follow (though there is 1 or 2 story options that give you access to more regions).

I remember areas locked, but never a room, but memory is selective when you get old And i know my patients for "filler" has all but disappeared. And its odd, I cant get enough of the exploration in the Fallout/elder scroll games, i know its just another cave with no story advancement, but it was behind a BUSH! nobody else ever found it (ya right). I don't like restrictions, I get edge of map stuff, it just a necessary evil. I guess maybe after the open world games who let you at level one find a level 60 mob, a game that locked me in annoyed me (far more than it should have). Witcher has a small learning curve and the tutorial at start is done well, I do need to take another stab at it, but I'm 10+ hours into a Orc campaign in Total war: Warhammer and my strange obsession with Craft the World (dont even look, deceptively simple, yet a massive time sink i cant put down). I know Witcher 3 must be good, and once I unlock that damn door I will find out.

 

[bystander36]

I remember areas locked, but never a room, but memory is selective when you get old And i know my patients for "filler" has all but disappeared. And its odd, I cant get enough of the exploration in the Fallout/elder scroll games, i know its just another cave with no story advancement, but it was behind a BUSH! nobody else ever found it (ya right). I don't like restrictions, I get edge of map stuff, it just a necessary evil. I guess maybe after the open world games who let you at level one find a level 60 mob, a game that locked me in annoyed me (far more than it should have). Witcher has a small learning curve and the tutorial at start is done well, I do need to take another stab at it, but I'm 10+ hours into a Orc campaign in Total war: Warhammer and my strange obsession with Craft the World (dont even look, deceptively simple, yet a massive time sink i cant put down). I know Witcher 3 must be good, and once I unlock that damn door I will find out.

In the tutorial, it does have you locked in the room until you do the steps needed to get out. The reality is, that inn, is the end of the tutorial in a sense. Once you leave it, the game opens up. Once you leave that region, the games becomes 100 times larger and pretty much open world as large as any other out there. If you advance the story, you gain access to a couple more regions that will double or triple the world.

If you like open world games, The Witcher 3 is one of the most well done. Give it a go, do the inn, finish that region's main story (or do a lot of the side quests which help you get skills fast), and you'll be in open world bliss. That zone is very similar to The Witcher 1's first town, which many also disliked, but if you move past it, the game really gets good.

 

[GoodRevrnd]

snip

I actually liked W3 for the fact that it limits you. The open world RPG can be fun, but it's so overdone and too often results in a bland experience. When you start locking things down a bit you have more opportunities to tell a well crafted story. And frankly, I think even W3 suffered a bit from how open it was. I haven't finished yet, but being a completionist sucked some of the fun out of it and I got bogged down about midway through in Novigrad.

 

[bystander36]

I actually liked W3 for the fact that it limits you. The open world RPG can be fun, but it's so overdone and too often results in a bland experience. When you start locking things down a bit you have more opportunities to tell a well crafted story. And frankly, I think even W3 suffered a bit from how open it was. I haven't finished yet, but being a completionist sucked some of the fun out of it and I got bogged down about midway through in Novigrad.

As a completionist, open world games are definitely an issue. That's one habit you will have to overcome if RPG's continue down the road they have been in the past several years. The best part of W3 is that you have a solid story to follow, and a great optional open world. Open world games should not be treated with the idea of completing every quest, otherwise you'll go mad.

 

[zinfamous]

I must have been hit in the head, I loved W1, and W2 was almost as good, W3 lost me after a few hours. Its a old JPRPG with a pretty skin (very pretty). .

um...

no.

 

[GodisanAtheist]

Having finally beaten Witcher 3 along with its associated DLCs, I generally agree with OP's premise.

The game, and frankly the series itself has been a great blend of drama, humor, intrigue, fantasy etc that its really a helluva masterwork to top. Its really not dissimilar from the Mass Effect trilogy from that perspective, and its no surprise ME Trilogy is considered one of the best series in gaming too (until Andromeda anyway).

Even CDPR, as we know now, stumbled hard with CP2077 which really failed to live up to expectations from a lot of different perspectives.

Unlike the ME trilogy, I do hope the next Witcher game keeps a lid on Geralt's story as well as the existing world state. Sometimes its best to just let things lie and start fresh with a huge time jump into the future (or a new Galaxy in ME's case).