I think my Mazda is finally donezo... or maybe not? What would you do?

[z1ggy]

I've posted about this car a lot in the past 2 years or so, because it's been a PITA. Here's the current situation now: Car won't start. Oh easy you say just got get a battery and be on my way... Well I did and it still barely starts up. OK so alternator right? Well fine, but also my CEL is STILL ON and saying minor evap leak, even after replacing the gas cap, purge valve & canister. To replace some other parts, I was quoted $600 and the alternator is $430. It feels like I'm just chasing the solution and tossing money at a 9 year old car with 155k on it. I'm now looking at minimum $1000 more to keep the car on the road.

So I'm at the point where I'm really thinking about ditching it. But... with a CEL and the car struggling to start or flat out not starting, can I even sell it? Is it worth spending another $1,000 (just spent $1,800 on it in Sept for new tires, alignment, rear shocks and the EVAP system parts) in hopes that I can keep using it problem free or just put money into it so I can sell it? KBB says the car is worth between $1,800 and $4,200 in "Fair" condition. I'm guessing I'd get offers at the low end because the radio and speakers do not work plus there's some minor cosmetic blemishes on the front bumper. It doesn't seem prudent to put another $1,000 in when I might only get $1800 back, and who knows how long it might take to sell. If I did get rid of it, could be easier to just hand it off to a dealer for $800 or something and be done with it?

I know it's generally always better to keep the old car running but I feel like this car could be turning into a money pit.

 

[Torn Mind]

Nothing like a crappy mechanic to sell you a battery and alternator when a car has no problems with them. I mean, a starter and battery do not actually need an alternator to just start the car. They should have a jump pack on site.

Could be a mouse ate the wiring or the starter is worn out.

I would put that dog down.

The lifecycle of a car with Ford genes(2011 is the last year Mazda 3s shared Ford parts) is that at the end of its consumer-grade life, it is a mechanic's special with some complicated but not-too-complicated issue manifests itself by bricking the car. Parts are buried in the tightest nook and cranny, so a first-time DIY neophyte will be hammered with a lot of labor just to reach a part.

A mechanic could fancy your vehicle and give it new life but for your purpose, it's not worth the money.

Personal-but-not-personal story:
Former tenant of my mom had a 2007 Mazda 3 with 120-140k. Power steering pump was broke and he could not or would not allocate funds to get it fixed. Sat for four years and we had to get rid of it because neighbors snitched to the county plus a tree killed its body. Sat on the most rural of our lot of properties.

You can try private party selling first just to see if there are any takers on Facebook, etc.

 

[pauldun170]

LOL - Sounds bout right for a Mazda.
You getting this puppy?

Intermittent slow/hard start after short trips?

I have a 2010 Mazda 3 GS Sport with 150,000km. Not a car expert by any means so I apologize in advance. Have been Googling this problem for weeks and can't seem to find a solution. We began noticing start-up issues even in mild Ontario temperatures (hovering around 0-5C) at the beginning of...

www.torontomazda3.ca

Mazda 3 P0456: Meaning, Causes, How to Fix

One of the most common trouble codes with the Mazda 3 is the P0456 code. This trouble code references a number that is given to you when you plug your 3 into an OBDII scanner. P0456 Indicates that …

www.700r4transmissionhq.com

Unless its a Miata or RX-*, sell at the 10 year mark.

 

[pauldun170]

Nothing like a crappy mechanic to sell you a battery and alternator when a car has no problems with them. I mean, a starter and battery do not actually need an alternator to just start the car. They should have a jump pack on site.

Could be a mouse ate the wiring or the starter is worn out.

I would put that dog down.

The lifecycle of a car with Ford genes(2011 is the last year Mazda 3s shared Ford parts) is that at the end of its consumer-grade life, it is a mechanic's special with some complicated but not-too-complicated issue manifests itself by bricking the car. Parts are buried in the tightest nook and cranny, so a first-time DIY neophyte will be hammered with a lot of labor just to reach a part.

A mechanic could fancy your vehicle and give it new life but for your purpose, it's not worth the money.

Personal-but-not-personal story:
Former tenant of my mom had a 2007 Mazda 3 with 120-140k. Power steering pump was broke and he could not or would not allocate funds to get it fixed. Sat for four years and we had to get rid of it because neighbors snitched to the county plus a tree killed its body. Sat on the most rural of our lot of properties.

You can try private party selling first just to see if there are any takers on Facebook, etc.

Found memories of my Mazda MX-6 power steering pump failing.
Was poor and in school so I just drove until I could afford the replacement. My arms and core got super strong that year.
Fortunately easy to replace once I got the pump.

 

[z1ggy]

Nothing like a crappy mechanic to sell you a battery and alternator when a car has no problems with them. I mean, a starter and battery do not actually need an alternator to just start the car. They should have a jump pack on site.

Could be a mouse ate the wiring or the starter is worn out.

I would put that dog down.

The lifecycle of a car with Ford genes(2011 is the last year Mazda 3s shared Ford parts) is that at the end of its consumer-grade life, it is a mechanic's special with some complicated but not-too-complicated issue manifests itself by bricking the car. Parts are buried in the tightest nook and cranny, so a first-time DIY neophyte will be hammered with a lot of labor just to reach a part.

A mechanic could fancy your vehicle and give it new life but for your purpose, it's not worth the money.

Personal-but-not-personal story:
Former tenant of my mom had a 2007 Mazda 3 with 120-140k. Power steering pump was broke and he could not or would not allocate funds to get it fixed. Sat for four years and we had to get rid of it because neighbors snitched to the county plus a tree killed its body. Sat on the most rural of our lot of properties.

You can try private party selling first just to see if there are any takers on Facebook, etc.

Yeah the mechanic tested both my battery and alternator, and said they were good but suggested I replace them anyway. I got a new battery because it was free (warranty) but the alternator could maaaaybe not be working 100%? I had to get the car jumped by AAA twice, and one mechanic tested the alternator for me too, and said it was fine.

I agree, probably a ground issue somewhere that's draining the battery... which will probably be impossible to totally fix.

Funny you talked about power steering... One day about a year ago, i was driving the car and randomly my power steering cut out as I was driving around a corner, nearly crashed my car into a pole... I had to muscle it for dear life. Brought it in and there was a little leak... had it fixed.

LOL - Sounds bout right for a Mazda.
You getting this puppy?

Intermittent slow/hard start after short trips?

I have a 2010 Mazda 3 GS Sport with 150,000km. Not a car expert by any means so I apologize in advance. Have been Googling this problem for weeks and can't seem to find a solution. We began noticing start-up issues even in mild Ontario temperatures (hovering around 0-5C) at the beginning of...

www.torontomazda3.ca

Mazda 3 P0456: Meaning, Causes, How to Fix

One of the most common trouble codes with the Mazda 3 is the P0456 code. This trouble code references a number that is given to you when you plug your 3 into an OBDII scanner. P0456 Indicates that …

www.700r4transmissionhq.com

Unless its a Miata or RX-*, sell at the 10 year mark.

Hmm seems pretty prevalent in older mazda then. I had a smoke test done TWO YEARS ago when this started and no leaks were detected, but we replaced the purge valve anyway and gas cap. Fixed the issue for about one month, then it came back. I was lucky that it was good long enough to get my emissions passed. Right now I'm 2 months over due and if I'm pulled over, its a $100 fine and possible revocation of the registration... and technically up to 30 days in jail lol.

 

[pauldun170]

If it's a starting issue with a fresh, fully charged battery I have doubts that it has anything to do with the alternator. Alternator comes into play after the fact.
If the battery is fully charged, I would expect the engine to turn over normally.
With a fresh battery, is it turning over normally or is it struggling to turn over?
Does it sounds like it "wants to start", as if fuel is getting to cylinder every couple of cranks but it just never catches?

 

[Gardener]

If your battery is draining while your car is parked, get a battery disconnect switch.

 

[z1ggy]

If it's a starting issue with a fresh, fully charged battery I have doubts that it has anything to do with the alternator. Alternator comes into play after the fact.
If the battery is fully charged, I would expect the engine to turn over normally.
With a fresh battery, is it turning over normally or is it struggling to turn over?
Does it sounds like it "wants to start", as if fuel is getting to cylinder every couple of cranks but it just never catches?

So the original battery was fine until 2 weeks ago. It would struggle to start, but eventually start, then one day it reeeally struggled, started... then when I went to start the car up a few hours later, it was DEAD. Like... dead as a doorknob, wouldn't even turn anything over and my windows wouldn't even go down.

Fast forward to this week, finally got a braaaand new battery. Install it... first time turning ignition on and it starts up pretty easily no real issues. Let it run for a bit, shut off. Few seconds later I check just to make sure it's fine and it struggles to turn over for like 1-2seconds, then starts. Let run for a bit... shut off. I didn't like that so I went for a 3rd time and it reeeallly struggled for like 4 seconds, then finally started.

Not sure if I didn't let the car run long enough between start ups such that the battery didn't get recharged at all, but I didn't think a brand new battery would have an issue starting up in succession like that.

 

[Meghan54]

So the original battery was fine until 2 weeks ago. It would struggle to start, but eventually start, then one day it reeeally struggled, started... then when I went to start the car up a few hours later, it was DEAD. Like... dead as a doorknob, wouldn't even turn anything over and my windows wouldn't even go down.

Fast forward to this week, finally got a braaaand new battery. Install it... first time turning ignition on and it starts up pretty easily no real issues. Let it run for a bit, shut off. Few seconds later I check just to make sure it's fine and it struggles to turn over for like 1-2seconds, then starts. Let run for a bit... shut off. I didn't like that so I went for a 3rd time and it reeeallly struggled for like 4 seconds, then finally started.

Not sure if I didn't let the car run long enough between start ups such that the battery didn't get recharged at all, but I didn't think a brand new battery would have an issue starting up in succession like that.

Kinda depends upon how long that new battery has been sitting on the shelf. Sorta why I always throw a new battery on my charger after purchase. Have never found one fully charged.

 

[Paperdoc]

Battery and alternator are the first items to check when it's hard to turn the engine over. But CHECK is the proper word. REPLACE is an expensive way to test!

I dealt with this one time years ago with a 2004 Mazda 3 hatchback, and I liked that car a lot! Problem emerged mid-winter when really cold, so battery was the main suspect. However, I found if I used jumper cables to attach from a new battery in a running second car, PLUS a THIRD portable "spare to start" battery, no big improvement. So I consulted my favourite mechanic and he said it likely was worn bearings in the starter motor so it could not turn fast enough. Got a replacement motor and took it to his garage. Replacing that solved all the problem. He showed me the old starter: the output shaft end near the drive gear would wobble in its hole about ¼"!

 

[z1ggy]

Battery and alternator are the first items to check when it's hard to turn the engine over. But CHECK is the proper word. REPLACE is an expensive way to test!

I dealt with this one time years ago with a 2004 Mazda 3 hatchback, and I liked that car a lot! Problem emerged mid-winter when really cold, so battery was the main suspect. However, I found if I used jumper cables to attach from a new battery in a running second car, PLUS a THIRD portable "spare to start" battery, no big improvement. So I consulted my favourite mechanic and he said it likely was worn bearings in the starter motor so it could not turn fast enough. Got a replacement motor and took it to his garage. Replacing that solved all the problem. He showed me the old starter: the output shaft end near the drive gear would wobble in its hole about ¼"!

Yeah the starter is also another culprit. My issue is though that it started up with some struggle, was driven 25 minutes then sat for only 90 minutes and when I came back, it was as dead as dead could be. It might have been a perfect storm of all 3 components starting to fail.

Is there a chance the alternator could be partly dead/dying? I would assume these are DC design, which means they'd have brushes and obviously bearings. Chance those bearings are failing and/or the brushes are worn down too much and won't spark?

 

[Torn Mind]

Yeah the starter is also another culprit. My issue is though that it started up with some struggle, was driven 25 minutes then sat for only 90 minutes and when I came back, it was as dead as dead could be. It might have been a perfect storm of all 3 components starting to fail.

Is there a chance the alternator could be partly dead/dying? I would assume these are DC design, which means they'd have brushes and obviously bearings. Chance those bearings are failing and/or the brushes are worn down too much and won't spark?

A voltmeter can check for a couple basic things.

Proper voltage can be around 14-14.5 volts.

It can also check for AC voltage for diode failure. Alternators convert AC to DC similar to a computer PSU. If you see even 1 Volt of AC, a diode has gone toast.

Brushes can last 200k. I have not experienced brush failure yet but I would presume such a failure would cause a 0 volt output condition since there is no physical connection between brush and metal.

I have experienced diode failures. Storing a car outside in humid conditions kills diodes. I suppose the plastic is not water vapor proof.

 

[pauldun170]

So the original battery was fine until 2 weeks ago. It would struggle to start, but eventually start, then one day it reeeally struggled, started... then when I went to start the car up a few hours later, it was DEAD. Like... dead as a doorknob, wouldn't even turn anything over and my windows wouldn't even go down.

Fast forward to this week, finally got a braaaand new battery. Install it... first time turning ignition on and it starts up pretty easily no real issues. Let it run for a bit, shut off. Few seconds later I check just to make sure it's fine and it struggles to turn over for like 1-2seconds, then starts. Let run for a bit... shut off. I didn't like that so I went for a 3rd time and it reeeallly struggled for like 4 seconds, then finally started.

Not sure if I didn't let the car run long enough between start ups such that the battery didn't get recharged at all, but I didn't think a brand new battery would have an issue starting up in succession like that.

That sounds like the alternator.

Unfortunately, it would appear that you have to bite the bullet.
Get into a condition where it runs and passes inspection and sell it.
Even if it's only chump change once you factor in recent repair costs, you can at least apply that to your next car.

It's a little dissapointing considering the age of the car but considering the mileage and the Mazda factor I'd say it might be the year to part ways.

 

[z1ggy]

That sounds like the alternator.

Unfortunately, it would appear that you have to bite the bullet.
Get into a condition where it runs and passes inspection and sell it.
Even if it's only chump change once you factor in recent repair costs, you can at least apply that to your next car.

It's a little dissapointing considering the age of the car but considering the mileage and the Mazda factor I'd say it might be the year to part ways.

Yeah It's prrrrobably an alternator failing and I'm less concerned about that. Much more worried about EVAP code because I've already changed the big 3 culprits (front purge valve, gas cap, canister) with still issue. If changing the rear solenoid doesn't work... the other possibilities are muuuch more scary to think about (physical crack in fuel tank, maybe leaking fuel pump, random leak in one of the lines).

 

[pauldun170]

What drivetrain do you have? 2.0 or 2.5?

 

[z1ggy]

What drivetrain do you have? 2.0 or 2.5?

2.5

 

[z1ggy]

Good news, the car started today on the first try without much struggle. Drove it 20 minutes... it sat about 10 mins then I started it again without struggle.

EVAP code will pop up again soon so Im thinking about listing it for sale while the damn thing starts up. Maybe I'll get lucky and get $2,000.

 

[Ken g6]

First, quit buying new car batteries. If it is the alternator, you should at least get and hook up a trickle charger, so the car won't die after driving for awhile. Maybe get a portable jump starter too, in case it does die, but that's probably not worth the cost.

If the trickle charger works, maybe you could call it a plug-in hybrid electric vehicle? 😛 (Not really.)

 

[pete6032]

Good news, the car started today on the first try without much struggle. Drove it 20 minutes... it sat about 10 mins then I started it again without struggle.

EVAP code will pop up again soon so Im thinking about listing it for sale while the damn thing starts up. Maybe I'll get lucky and get $2,000.

Take it to a repair place and ask them to do smoke test. Will cost $200-$300. That will help you isolate the problem. If the problem is easy to fix then fix it. Or you can sell the car and if the buyer asks you can tell them what needs to be done.

 

[maluckey1]

Kinda depends upon how long that new battery has been sitting on the shelf. Sorta why I always throw a new battery on my charger after purchase. Have never found one fully charged.

Exactly!!! The truth about car batteries is that they are NOT fully charged when new. Put the new battery on a float charger (Battery Tender Jr is 25 bucks at Walmart) overnight. Your battery and wallet will thank you. Some cars can be very picky about battery charging. In an older car, it can already have terminal and even cable corrosion. Add a partially charged battery to the situation and the situation gets dicey at best.

M