i-ram and vista

semo

Senior member
Dec 24, 2004
292
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we all know that i-ram helps boot xp faster but the difference isn't huge compared to a fast hdd.

i wonder what is the difference with vista. is it much much faster booting vista from i-ram or just "meh... it's better i guess" like it was with xp. how about linux?

and finally, will there be i-ram 2?
 

Rubycon

Madame President
Aug 10, 2005
17,768
485
126
That card that takes ram chips and plugs into a SATA port?

Yawn, they should make a PCI-E 8X or higher version that takes a TON of DDR. A board the size of an 8800GTX could probably hold 128GB ECC FBDIMM. Expensive but speed is never cheap. ;)
 

semo

Senior member
Dec 24, 2004
292
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yeah sata and probably the fpga chip are big bottlenecks but sata ii was just coming out when i-ram was first released. hopefully i-ram 2 will fix this and allow for higher density modules and ddr2 (ddr seems to be more expensive and consume more power, i think).
 

SuperNaruto

Senior member
Aug 24, 2006
997
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forget iram/iram2... i think vista needs around 16gb minimum.. thats 4 in raid 0.. hard to get 4 iram in pc...

better off using the new ssd drives.. not as fast but faster than most hdd..

im currently using 8gb iram for win xp boot... its not bad.. but hard to fit 3 in a slot..
 

semo

Senior member
Dec 24, 2004
292
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i thought you could install vista on 8 gb (2 i-rams in raid 0). i'm pretty sure that if i-ram 2 comes out it will allow for at least 2gb per slot. with vista's better usage of memory (and more need for it) we might see some pretty good deals this year.

you have to remember that for a new product on it's first iteration, i-ram could not have had much refinement and it did a pretty good job considering the only real alternative (afaik) is/was the hyperdrive but the cost is just stupid.
 

Souka

Diamond Member
Sep 25, 2000
4,728
1
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Hyperdrive..... eight DDR1 4GB modules?


Hmm... did a quick look on NewEgg... I don't see such a mem stick.... I did find DDR2 server modules.....
 

semo

Senior member
Dec 24, 2004
292
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probably there were some 4gb ddr modules but ddr is dying quickly so they're probably phasing the top end out. i don't know but anyway, the cost of that hyperdrive alone is that of more than 2 or more fully loaded i-ram modules.

so nobody knows if i-ram will have successor?
 

SuperNaruto

Senior member
Aug 24, 2006
997
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they prototyped iram2, but from paper to production is totally different.. especially when it only doubles from 4 to 8 gb... ssd will certainly kick it out of the water..

ssd comes in 16/32/64/128 + sizes.. they're smaller, raidable and in native sata format...

iram 2 was to fit in a 5.25 slot.. there is some problem with providing power when the unit is off..

iram uses pci slot to charge the onboard battery that dies after 1 year.. i had 2 of mine replaced under gigabytes 1 year warranty already... ssd will not lose your data when you power off...
 

semo

Senior member
Dec 24, 2004
292
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Originally posted by: bob4432
Originally posted by: semo
with vista's better usage of memory (and more need for it)

:confused:

i was talking about vista's aggressive caching that tries to use as much memory as possible (unlike xp that will manage to page to disk no matter how much memory you install or how much is unused). haven't tried it myself but superfetch sounds like a great idea and should have been implemented well before vista.

and finally vista needs more memory than xp but that's expected from a newer os and the added features and superfetch. iirc, superfetch will free up memory space if needed by removing cached apps that aren't being used at that moment.

don't have to believe me: link
 

bob4432

Lifer
Sep 6, 2003
11,719
44
91
Originally posted by: semo
Originally posted by: bob4432
Originally posted by: semo
with vista's better usage of memory (and more need for it)

:confused:

i was talking about vista's aggressive caching that tries to use as much memory as possible (unlike xp that will manage to page to disk no matter how much memory you install or how much is unused). haven't tried it myself but superfetch sounds like a great idea and should have been implemented well before vista.

and finally vista needs more memory than xp but that's expected from a newer os and the added features and superfetch. iirc, superfetch will free up memory space if needed by removing cached apps that aren't being used at that moment.

don't have to believe me: link

it is not a believe or not believe situation, just reading about the necessary requirements makes me sick....if things go well with the 360 i will be running linux for the pc before too long
 

Matthias99

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2003
8,808
0
0
ssd comes in 16/32/64/128 + sizes.. they're smaller, raidable and in native sata format...

Also much slower STR (at least for flash-based devices... RAM+HDD ones are fast, but even more expensive and require batteries to save your data to disk during a power hit.)

NAND Flash also has lifespan issues that make it a bad choice for some applications. High-end SSDs use flash memory that's more immune to this, but they are brutally expensive.
 

fire400

Diamond Member
Nov 21, 2005
5,204
21
81
SCSI Express is coming out soon. I-RAM personally are for those that have the money for it. A Raptor would be another move if you didn't want to use up any daugher card slots.
 

bob4432

Lifer
Sep 6, 2003
11,719
44
91
Originally posted by: fire400
SCSI Express is coming out soon. I-RAM personally are for those that have the money for it. A Raptor would be another move if you didn't want to use up any daugher card slots.

scsi express???? why would they be putting out a new scsi version/type when sas is so new? do you have any information about it as google doesn't really bring anything up....
 

semo

Senior member
Dec 24, 2004
292
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0
scsi provides a fast interface. you can attach the slowest storage device to scsi and it will still be slow. i-ram is a fast storage device with consumer grade interface. so comparing scsi and i-ram (if that's what you were doing) is like comparing apples and oranges.

and yeah, what is scsi express anyway.
 

zephyrprime

Diamond Member
Feb 18, 2001
7,512
2
81
Originally posted by: semo
i was talking about vista's aggressive caching that tries to use as much memory as possible (unlike xp that will manage to page to disk no matter how much memory you install or how much is unused). haven't tried it myself but superfetch sounds like a great idea and should have been implemented well before vista.
I have vista and it will still page to disk. Paging to disk isn't really a bad thing.
 

fire400

Diamond Member
Nov 21, 2005
5,204
21
81
Originally posted by: bob4432
Originally posted by: fire400
SCSI Express is coming out soon. I-RAM personally are for those that have the money for it. A Raptor would be another move if you didn't want to use up any daugher card slots.

scsi express???? why would they be putting out a new scsi version/type when sas is so new? do you have any information about it as google doesn't really bring anything up....

good one, but as we can see today, technology is moving rapidly. what most people see is what is directly in front of them instead of what the whitepapers hold in multibillion dollar companies. it's like comparing Jane's Information guide to what is offered on CNN.net

well you won't be able to find it so easily. it's more closed than the pci-sig teams. you need to be a priority member of development functions to know any of this. the internet has a lot of stuff, but it doesn't have "everything." if you search hard enough with good credentials motherboard manufacturers have their eyes on new interconnects that will be more mainstream for integraetd and newly developed SCSI controllers that will be an option if SATA isn't a desired option in the time to come. maybe it won't happen, maybe it will. but if you have the money and knowledge, I don't see why enthusiasts today would avoid SCSI technology in a good speed array setup, anyhow. nonetheless, SCSI is on the roadmap. fibre channel will also be more mainstream someday.

4x74GB 15K's in an LSI 1+0 can cost 700 dollars. ten years from now, it will cost less than 70 dollars.

DDR RAM is cheap enough anyway to give i-ram a decent shot without losing too much and the benefits are interesting. ten years from now, it'll be like how we see PC100 RAM today, come to think of it.

good luck boys and girs.
 

Jiggz

Diamond Member
Mar 10, 2001
4,329
0
76
i-Ram is dead. Samsung is already selling the SSD 16B and 32 GB drives in Asia and Europe for less than $300 and $450.00 respectively!
 

bob4432

Lifer
Sep 6, 2003
11,719
44
91
Originally posted by: fire400
Originally posted by: bob4432
Originally posted by: fire400
SCSI Express is coming out soon. I-RAM personally are for those that have the money for it. A Raptor would be another move if you didn't want to use up any daugher card slots.

scsi express???? why would they be putting out a new scsi version/type when sas is so new? do you have any information about it as google doesn't really bring anything up....

good one, but as we can see today, technology is moving rapidly. what most people see is what is directly in front of them instead of what the whitepapers hold in multibillion dollar companies. it's like comparing Jane's Information guide to what is offered on CNN.net

well you won't be able to find it so easily. it's more closed than the pci-sig teams. you need to be a priority member of development functions to know any of this. the internet has a lot of stuff, but it doesn't have "everything." if you search hard enough with good credentials motherboard manufacturers have their eyes on new interconnects that will be more mainstream for integraetd and newly developed SCSI controllers that will be an option if SATA isn't a desired option in the time to come. maybe it won't happen, maybe it will. but if you have the money and knowledge, I don't see why enthusiasts today would avoid SCSI technology in a good speed array setup, anyhow. nonetheless, SCSI is on the roadmap. fibre channel will also be more mainstream someday.

4x74GB 15K's in an LSI 1+0 can cost 700 dollars. ten years from now, it will cost less than 70 dollars.

DDR RAM is cheap enough anyway to give i-ram a decent shot without losing too much and the benefits are interesting. ten years from now, it'll be like how we see PC100 RAM today, come to think of it.

good luck boys and girs.

well i guess i will have to wait and see if you are full of sh!t or full of information ;)
 

Zap

Elite Member
Oct 13, 1999
22,377
2
81
Originally posted by: semo
so nobody knows if i-ram will have successor?

I hope so because even though I probably won't ever get one, it's interesting to read about and of course drool over. Wouldn't an I-RAM type device be really nice if it...

-Fits into a drive bay
-Can hold many, many modules of any size
-Uses DDR2 (can now get 1GB modules for under $50)
-Uses standard SATA 3.0GB
-Is affordable, meaning RAM is the limiting cost factor and not the device itself
-Internally can run RAM in "dual channel" type operation for increased performance

Originally posted by: Jiggz
i-Ram is dead. Samsung is already selling the SSD 16B and 32 GB drives in Asia and Europe for less than $300 and $450.00 respectively!

SSD is interesting in that they won't lose data and they're faster than mechanical HDD, but I think I-RAM would still be faster overall, maybe substantially if they "update" the design.
 

Jiggz

Diamond Member
Mar 10, 2001
4,329
0
76
Originally posted by: bob4432
Originally posted by: fire400
Originally posted by: bob4432
Originally posted by: fire400
SCSI Express is coming out soon. I-RAM personally are for those that have the money for it. A Raptor would be another move if you didn't want to use up any daugher card slots.

scsi express???? why would they be putting out a new scsi version/type when sas is so new? do you have any information about it as google doesn't really bring anything up....

good one, but as we can see today, technology is moving rapidly. what most people see is what is directly in front of them instead of what the whitepapers hold in multibillion dollar companies. it's like comparing Jane's Information guide to what is offered on CNN.net

well you won't be able to find it so easily. it's more closed than the pci-sig teams. you need to be a priority member of development functions to know any of this. the internet has a lot of stuff, but it doesn't have "everything." if you search hard enough with good credentials motherboard manufacturers have their eyes on new interconnects that will be more mainstream for integraetd and newly developed SCSI controllers that will be an option if SATA isn't a desired option in the time to come. maybe it won't happen, maybe it will. but if you have the money and knowledge, I don't see why enthusiasts today would avoid SCSI technology in a good speed array setup, anyhow. nonetheless, SCSI is on the roadmap. fibre channel will also be more mainstream someday.

4x74GB 15K's in an LSI 1+0 can cost 700 dollars. ten years from now, it will cost less than 70 dollars.

DDR RAM is cheap enough anyway to give i-ram a decent shot without losing too much and the benefits are interesting. ten years from now, it'll be like how we see PC100 RAM today, come to think of it.

good luck boys and girs.

well i guess i will have to wait and see if you are full of sh!t or full of information ;)

I bet my bottom dollar it's the former rather than the latter!