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I pity Ben Carson and others like him even more now...

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disappoint

Lifer
Dec 7, 2009
10,148
378
126
How many of you are a brain surgeon, has a brother that's a rocket scientist and also won a Presidential medal of freedom all the while growing up in humble beginnings.

If you don't fit this description then STFU.
What if we don't fit that description but decide not to STFU? Will you become angry? Again?

Does your command to STFU apply to you as well if you don't fit that description or are you somehow exempt from your own commands?
 

MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,751
3,064
121
John has probably just been drinking the White Russia coffee additive again like it is a drink, who knows.

...
 

cubby1223

Lifer
May 24, 2004
13,525
42
86
Clueless!

Let me help you out a little. If a white boy grew up in a black neighborhood surrounded by black people would you say he experienced what is was like to be black?

I await luls.
The white boy in your example has the better opportunity to directly observe and learn the "black experience" in America, than a black child growing up in Hawaii & Indonesia who has to rely on second-hand stories.

Your argument is just as stupid as claiming the "white experience" is all about privilege and power and wealth and acceptance, then saying a random white person growing up in Afghanistan fully understands and experienced this same "white experience".

Sometimes you present yourself very well, other times you're an emotional wreck of illogical crap hellbent on insulting people into submission when you believe you're right but can't form a solid argument. Today we have the illogical crap version of ivwshane. Please return to us the better version of you, it is so much more pleasant to read.
 
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brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
19,263
10,071
136
It means exactly what I meant, that we didn't see them as different. Can ya handle that, just maybe, their parents taught them respect and how to act respectable? Both brothers grew up to be successful in their endeavors. We're still friends today.
That's mighty white of you.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
25,073
9,946
136
Those gifs show the commentator dude as clearly misrepresenting Carson. Black =/= black America =/= "the black experience". Carson may be attacking a strawman, and growing up in an environment where your identity is completely different from those around you could have its own problems, but on the face of what was said, it's true. It's not just a "poor" thing either, although that obviously runs concomitant with being black in America; Obama grew up in Hawaii and Indonesia, two places with virtually no black people around.
I don't care where you were raised. Getting pulled over for a DWB pretty much answers the question
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
28,199
8,044
136
The white boy in your example has the better opportunity to directly observe and learn the "black experience" in America, than a black child growing up in Hawaii & Indonesia who has to rely on second-hand stories.

Your argument is just as stupid as claiming the "white experience" is all about privilege and power and wealth and acceptance, then saying a random white person growing up in Afghanistan fully understands and experienced this same "white experience".

Sometimes you present yourself very well, other times you're an emotional wreck of illogical crap hellbent on insulting people into submission when you believe you're right but can't form a solid argument. Today we have the illogical crap version of ivwshane. Please return to us the better version of you, it is so much more pleasant to read.
LOL tell us again how one experience represents the black experience better than the other. I'm curious to hear the reply from a white guy telling us what's representitive of a black persons experience. Maybe you can do a search like hamburger guy and find all sorts of experiences and then come back and proudly proclaim that YOU know what's representitive of a black persons experience.
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
28,199
8,044
136
General Burkhalter. :)



Cool, let me know when a woman that was raped has no right to differentiate her experience from a woman that took a woman's studies lecture, when both say they grew up in a rape culture. Or how about when a person from a middle-class background tries to describe their financial struggles; a person that grew up in dire poverty SURELY has no right to comment on that.

You mean like how carson just dismissed Obamas experience because it wasn't like his own? Lol! It's amazing how you can come to the same conclusion as me and yet fail so miserably at being able to apply it to carson.


I've said nothing even remotely ban-worthy in this discussion and have had a few short bans here and there so no, that was not the focus of it.

Again, answer this question: "Where did I make any comment about the particular way a particular person was?"

Until you do, you're not saying anything of value. ivwshane is a class-A libtard, but at least he can read and engage in an argument.
You, for some unknown fucking reason, seem to think that because carson says his black experience is more representitive of black lives then that must mean it's true. Well I suggest you tell the 70% who don't live in poverty that they aren't black! And then you can tell the 65% of black people who weren't in a gang that they too aren't black or haven't experienced the "true" black experience. I'm sure that will go over well!


To cement the point even further: I suppose you are white, however, unless you grew up in a trailer park where your dad beat your mother and fucked your sister and you made advances towards animals while in the back of a car that was on the front lawn on blocks where clan rallies were held every Sunday night where you would play the jug for them, unless you grew up and married your cousin, you don't represent the true white experience. I say this because a white guy I know who is now a well respected lawyer, said that was his experience and if you didn't experience what he experienced then you aren't white.

Of course, we all know you will agree with him and concede that he is "whiter" than you, right?
 

Ventanni

Golden Member
Jul 25, 2011
1,421
127
106
I'm not voting for any presidential candidate that pulls a race card. Sorry, I'm just not buying it, and I have zero respect for anybody who does this. I'm not a huge fan of Obama's presidency, but for Ben Carson to say that about Obama is just a low blow. It's reaching, it's desperate, and it's disrespectful.

"Sorry man, you're just not black enough, but I am."

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/02/ben-carson-obama-was-raised-white-219657
 

blankslate

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2008
8,467
422
126
I'm just glad he's not a Rocket Scientist...

"C'mon it's not rocket science..."

"would it matter if it was?"

even now I'm wondering how hard neurosurgery can be...



______________
 

HamburgerBoy

Lifer
Apr 12, 2004
27,116
318
126
You, for some unknown fucking reason, seem to think that because carson says his black experience is more representitive of black lives then that must mean it's true. Well I suggest you tell the 70% who don't live in poverty that they aren't black! And then you can tell the 65% of black people who weren't in a gang that they too aren't black or haven't experienced the "true" black experience. I'm sure that will go over well!

To cement the point even further: I suppose you are white, however, unless you grew up in a trailer park where your dad beat your mother and fucked your sister and you made advances towards animals while in the back of a car that was on the front lawn on blocks where clan rallies were held every Sunday night where you would play the jug for them, unless you grew up and married your cousin, you don't represent the true white experience. I say this because a white guy I know who is now a well respected lawyer, said that was his experience and if you didn't experience what he experienced then you aren't white.

Of course, we all know you will agree with him and concede that he is "whiter" than you, right?
There are many experiences a white person, a black person, a gay person, etc can have. I'm not saying there is a singular black experience, but as I've already pointed out, "the black experience" is a term used by black Americans with very particular connotations. Sure, there's always a spectrum at play. A black kid could grow up in a stable middle-class family in a white neighborhood, avoiding certain negative experiences, but still dealing with racism, "DWB" as Homer mentioned above, etc. Others could grow up in Gary, Indiana.

The "white experience" you described is not one I experienced, correct, I've thankfully lived a pretty comfy life. I personally wouldn't use that term to describe it simply because it would be confusing; the "black experience" is already a well-used term by black writers to describe particular circumstances of their lives. To those people, a white experience would be given breaks when pulled over by cops, not being shot when you try to pull a cell phone out of a pocket, not being killed by gangs just off of your high school campus, etc. However, I don't really care about the semantics of what phrase you use to describe it. The "white trailer trash experience" certainly is another kind of experience; a white guy that grows up surrounded by meth-addicts and Klansmen has a drastically different experience from my own. Carson contributed easily enough context in the op to show what he's referring to; a kind of poverty, culture, etc found to particularly effect certain black communities.

I decided to look up the transcript that this all came from, and I think Carson was pretty clear about where he was going with it.

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/02/full-transcript-politicos-glenn-thrush-interviews-ben-carson-219644

DR. CARSON: Yeah, well, I mean, but what happened in Flint is a failure of people at multiple levels from the local level to the national level, and what we need to do is dissect that situation, analyze it very carefully, and take the lessons from it that will never allow that to happen again. But, at the same time, it is absolutely essential that we make those people whole.

GLENN THRUSH: But you don't think that there's a certain historical and institutional racism that led to that outcome? Like, you know, they let the pipes rot.

DR. CARSON: Let me put it this way: If that were going on in an affluent black community, it would have not gone on.

GLENN THRUSH: Do you think it's a combination of the race and the poverty?

DR. CARSON: And the influence.
GLENN THRUSH: The experience of being‑‑let's just stop it at January 20, 2009, right. Was that significant for you? As somebody who sat and watched that‑‑I was there, I was in the crowd, right?

DR. CARSON: Mm‑hmm.

GLENN THRUSH: It was a pretty interesting moment in American history, right? Did you derive any joy out of that? Any sense of pride? How did you sort of‑‑how did you process that?

DR. CARSON: You know, I did not. I mean, like most Americans, I was proud that we broke the color barrier when he was elected, but I also recognize that his experience and my experience are night-and-day different. He didn't grow up like I grew up by any stretch of the imagination.
If you want to say that Carson sounds like a sore loser or something, fine, whatever. It goes without saying that Obama, putting aside what anyone thinks of his actual politics, is a very smart and accomplished guy and worked as hard as anyone to become President. Even if he was the most privileged black guy in the world, plenty of others could have taken their opportunity and just coasted through life on it. Despite that, the context shows that Carson was speaking from the perspective of being able to identify with Obama, and that he sees class and upbringing as greater hurdles than skin color alone.
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
11,679
1,941
126
I just like that he's running his campaign against someone who isn't even running. Good example of resource management.
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
28,199
8,044
136
There are many experiences a white person, a black person, a gay person, etc can have. I'm not saying there is a singular black experience, but as I've already pointed out, "the black experience" is a term used by black Americans with very particular connotations. Sure, there's always a spectrum at play. A black kid could grow up in a stable middle-class family in a white neighborhood, avoiding certain negative experiences, but still dealing with racism, "DWB" as Homer mentioned above, etc. Others could grow up in Gary, Indiana.

The "white experience" you described is not one I experienced, correct, I've thankfully lived a pretty comfy life. I personally wouldn't use that term to describe it simply because it would be confusing; the "black experience" is already a well-used term by black writers to describe particular circumstances of their lives. To those people, a white experience would be given breaks when pulled over by cops, not being shot when you try to pull a cell phone out of a pocket, not being killed by gangs just off of your high school campus, etc. However, I don't really care about the semantics of what phrase you use to describe it. The "white trailer trash experience" certainly is another kind of experience; a white guy that grows up surrounded by meth-addicts and Klansmen has a drastically different experience from my own. Carson contributed easily enough context in the op to show what he's referring to; a kind of poverty, culture, etc found to particularly effect certain black communities.

I decided to look up the transcript that this all came from, and I think Carson was pretty clear about where he was going with it.

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/02/full-transcript-politicos-glenn-thrush-interviews-ben-carson-219644





If you want to say that Carson sounds like a sore loser or something, fine, whatever. It goes without saying that Obama, putting aside what anyone thinks of his actual politics, is a very smart and accomplished guy and worked as hard as anyone to become President. Even if he was the most privileged black guy in the world, plenty of others could have taken their opportunity and just coasted through life on it. Despite that, the context shows that Carson was speaking from the perspective of being able to identify with Obama, and that he sees class and upbringing as greater hurdles than skin color alone.
No its not, if it was then the first three pages of Google would all say the same thing, they don't, therefore you and carson are wrong. There is no singular black experience so to claim that the presidents experience isn't a real black experience is total bullshit. Carson claiming his experience is representative is also bullshit. Carson's experience is his own and there may be other black people that have/had a similar experience, full stop!

The fact that you don't understand this isn't surprising, you are white, the fact that you keep saying the same shit despite evidence to the contrary, well that speaks to your character.
 

disappoint

Lifer
Dec 7, 2009
10,148
378
126
John has probably just been drinking the White Russia coffee additive again like it is a drink, who knows.

...
Well you'll have to forgive him for that, you see he has been continually sexually harassed by his boss.

Although he is self employed...
 

HamburgerBoy

Lifer
Apr 12, 2004
27,116
318
126
No its not, if it was then the first three pages of Google would all say the same thing, they don't, therefore you and carson are wrong. There is no singular black experience so to claim that the presidents experience isn't a real black experience is total bullshit. Carson claiming his experience is representative is also bullshit. Carson's experience is his own and there may be other black people that have/had a similar experience, full stop!

The fact that you don't understand this isn't surprising, you are white, the fact that you keep saying the same shit despite evidence to the contrary, well that speaks to your character.
Did you read the transcript I posted? Why should Carson feel pride in Obama's accomplishment when he felt he had nothing in common with Obama's experience?
 

John Connor

Lifer
Nov 30, 2012
22,848
613
121
What if we don't fit that description but decide not to STFU? Will you become angry? Again?

Does your command to STFU apply to you as well if you don't fit that description or are you somehow exempt from your own commands?

Exhibit A.


Well you'll have to forgive him for that, you see he has been continually sexually harassed by his boss.

Although he is self employed...
You're a clear cut case of a know nothing charlatan. In John Connor's book of Standards & Practices when you're told to STFU, it has good reason and you do it!

Little shit.
 

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,100
586
126
We had a black family that lived in our neighborhood when I was growing up. I hung out with the two brothers and went through high school with them. Their father was an officer in the military and they were as affluent as most others in the neighborhood. These friends of mine were pretty white for black people. We played ball in the streets, ate at each others houses, went on outings together, had birthday parties together, went to the lake and water skied and numerous other activities. We didn't know race and didn't treat each other any way but equal.
Was Cliff Huxtable your neighbor?
 

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,100
586
126
Did you read the transcript I posted? Why should Carson feel pride in Obama's accomplishment when he felt he had nothing in common with Obama's experience?
So, basically what you're saying is that black people who grew up middle class have no clue what being black is, even though they are black? They've never known racism, never been poor, and as such cannot relate to what people like Ben Carson (a true black person) refer to as the black experience? o_O


That's basically it in a nutshell?
 

Londo_Jowo

Lifer
Jan 31, 2010
17,304
158
106
londojowo.hypermart.net
Ohh the humanity an Uncle Tom Republican trying to say he had more of a black experience than a mixed race person that spent much of his formative years with his white grandparents.
 

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