I pity Ben Carson and others like him even more now...

[MongGrel]

Please define the black experience/what it means to grow up black.

You're just entering another poster in the forums territory that I won't name as he has not posted in thread and that is verbotten.

It's prove it time.

Rant, rant.

Your looking a bit ignorant again.

 

[disappoint]

Hamburgerboy. Let me help you out a little bit. Because you seem to be intelligent enough to argue your point despite finding yourself in a position of weakness. I don't want to see intelligent posters banned for making racist statements if they add to the discussion and make it interesting and bring attention to what I think is an important concept to understand.

It turns out that we have learned quite a bit about the human mind that few people are aware of. I'd like to bring some awareness to the table because it may help people live better lives if they understand themselves better.

The human mind can only handle a finite amount of information at a time. Due to this limitation it resorts to deletion, distortion and generalization to cope with this limitation. This is the source of those stereotypes, generalizations that you and others have made.

To answer your question about why it's insulting: People naturally dislike when you assume they are a certain way because of their skin color, race, religion, creed whatever. They dislike it because in their case, it may be a false assumption. This may give many people a false view of a person if they accept these generalizations to be true for all people of a race.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Hamburgerboy. Let me help you out a little bit. Because you seem to be intelligent enough to argue your point despite finding yourself in a position of weakness. I don't want to see intelligent posters banned for making racist statements if they add to the discussion and make it interesting and bring attention to what I think is an important concept to understand.

It turns out that we have learned quite a bit about the human mind that few people are aware of. I'd like to bring some awareness to the table because it may help people live better live is they understand themselves better.

The human mind can only handle a finite amount of information at a time. Due to this limitation it resorts to deletion, distortion and generalization to cope with this limitation. This is the source of those stereotypes, generalizations that you and others have made.

To answer your question about why it's insulting: People naturally dislike when you assume they are a certain way because of their skin color, race, religion, creed whatever. They dislike it because in their case, it may be a false assumption. This may give many people a false view of a person if they accept these generalizations to be true for all people of a race.

Where did I make any comment about the particular way a particular person was? All I said was that Carson is correct when he says his upbringing was far more typical of a "black experience" than Obama's was. How each of them responded to their own upbringings and surroundings is a completely different issue. Where did I generalize any individuals? I stated that black people are significantly poorer than white people on the whole; that's a fact.

 

[MongGrel]

And You're still not Moonbeam V2.0, as hard as you try disappoint.

 

[MongGrel]

I'm off to other things, later.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

You're just entering another poster in the forums territory that I won't name as he has not posted in thread and that is verbotten.

It's prove it time.

Rant, rant.

Your looking a bit ignorant again.

If you Google 'the black experience' you can find many articles written by black people about what that means to them. Some common elements...

1. Having descended from slave ancestors
2. Frequently confronted with racism
3. Frequently confronted with violence in the ghettos
4. Poverty, especially relative to those of other ethnic background
5. Poor public schools

Guess how many of those apply to Carson? Guess how many of those apply to Obama?

 

[disappoint]

And You're still not Moonbeam V2.0, as hard as you try disappoint.

I am not nor have I ever been trying to act like any other poster including Moonbeam. Moonbeam's posts sometimes are artfully vague. Mine are more direct as I see it. He is a fine individual poster with his own perceptions of reality and ways of expressing himself which make him unique and interesting.

You are making the same mistake of attacking someone's individuality that a racist would make, just in a completely different way. But it's still attacking my individuality and I don't appreciate it.

But I realize you are doing it to get me to address an issue you think is important that you want me to talk about, rather than to insult me by calling me a copy cat. So it doesn't really bother me one bit, but it is distracting others attention from the topic at hand by being off topic.

 

[disappoint]

Where did I make any comment about the particular way a particular person was? All I said was that Carson is correct when he says his upbringing was far more typical of a "black experience" than Obama's was. How each of them responded to their own upbringings and surroundings is a completely different issue. Where did I generalize any individuals? I stated that black people are significantly poorer than white people on the whole; that's a fact.

Is it really a fact? Do you have the data of net worth of all of the black people and all of the white people you are talking about?

If you think that matters though you're missing the point.

I've said it before and I'll say it again because you either missed it or misunderstood:

Even if you have the data to prove that it is true that a greater number of black people are significantly poorer than white people on the whole, to use your exact words; the point I'm making is this:

You are generalizing which insults the individuality of people for whom the generalization does not apply.

Unlike Rubio who ran out of talking points and just repeated himself over and over again I do not enjoy repeating myself. I refer you to the previous posts I made that go into more detail on how or why stereotypes are insulting to individuals for whom they do not apply.

 

[ivwshane]

Please define the black experience/what it means to grow up black.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/no-white-people-will-neve_b_7875608.html

https://www.minnpost.com/community-voices/2008/05/black-experience-america

http://www.diversitybestpractices.com/news-articles/what-authentic-black-experience

There is no one black experience. But a common theme is that black people are treated differently simply because they are black. To understand the black experience you would have to be aware of the advantages you have because you are white.

 

[MongGrel]

I am not nor have I ever been trying to act like any other poster including Moonbeam. Moonbeam's posts sometimes are artfully vague. Mine are more direct as I see it. He is a fine individual poster with his own perceptions of reality and ways of expressing himself which make him unique and interesting.

You are making the same mistake of attacking someone's individuality that a racist would make, just in a completely different way. But it's still attacking my individuality and I don't appreciate it.

But I realize you are doing it to get me to address an issue you think is important that you want me to talk about, rather than to insult me by calling me a copy cat. So it doesn't really bother me one bit, but it is distracting others attention from the topic at hand by being off topic.

I'm just making an observation.

There are no issues with you I care about really.

Yep, I'm a hard core racist you really nailed me on that one.

Flail away dude.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Is it really a fact? Do you have the data of net worth of all of the black people and all of the white people you are talking about?

If you think that matters though you're missing the point.

I've said it before and I'll say it again because you either missed it or misunderstood:

Even if you have the data to prove that it is true that a greater number of black people are significantly poorer than white people on the whole, to use your exact words; the point I'm making is this:

You are generalizing which insults the individuality of people for whom the generalization does not apply.

Unlike Rubio who ran out of talking points and just repeated himself over and over again I do not enjoy repeating myself. I refer you to the previous posts I made that go into more detail on how or why stereotypes are insulting to individuals for whom they do not apply.

http://www.businessinsider.com/heres-median-income-in-the-us-by-race-2013-9

Show me where I applied a generalization to an individual. Until then, you're full of shit and I'll keep asking you to repeat yourself until you give an honest answer to my questions, unless you think no one can ever make any kind of comment about experiences/qualities about any arbitrary group.

"How DARE you say women are raped more often than men! You're trivializing men that are raped, and insulting women that haven't been raped!"

Is that what you believe?

There is no one black experience. But a common theme is that black people are treated differently simply because they are black. To understand the black experience you would have to be aware of the advantages you have because you are white.

Your first link is irrelevant; I am not purporting to have any kind of personal understanding of the "black experience", I'm simply saying that Carson does. From your other two links...

"I remember the first time that I was called a ******. This is the black experience in America."

"I remember too many of my male friends gunned down in the streets and knifed at parties before they were old enough to grow facial hair. This is the black experience in America."

"I remember torn-up textbooks, broken lockers and crowded classrooms. This is the black experience in America."

"My Urban Suburban classmates often criticized me for the way I spoke or dressed or the music I listened to or for just not being “black enough.” I didn’t realize it at the time, but this was likely the only way these kids knew how to express the feelings they shared with Rose. They were envious of what I had—two parents, a big yard to play in, the opportunity to take music, dance, tennis and horseback-riding lessons."

Looks pretty clear to me. People often see the black experience as something more than simply having black skin, but experiencing struggles that plague black communities far more than other ethnic groups. As evidenced from the black woman with a middle-class upbringing, many of her black peers did not see much in common in her with their own experiences. Thanks for making my point.

 

[ivwshane]

It's clear you are too stupid to understand the point. Have a good night!

http://www.businessinsider.com/heres-median-income-in-the-us-by-race-2013-9

Show me where I applied a generalization to an individual. Until then, you're full of shit and I'll keep asking you to repeat yourself until you give an honest answer to my questions, unless you think no one can ever make any kind of comment about experiences/qualities about any arbitrary group.

"How DARE you say women are raped more often than men! You're trivializing men that are raped, and insulting women that haven't been raped!"

Is that what you believe?



Your first link is irrelevant; I am not purporting to have any kind of personal understanding of the "black experience", I'm simply saying that Carson does. From your other two links...

"I remember the first time that I was called a ******. This is the black experience in America."

"I remember too many of my male friends gunned down in the streets and knifed at parties before they were old enough to grow facial hair. This is the black experience in America."

"I remember torn-up textbooks, broken lockers and crowded classrooms. This is the black experience in America."

"My Urban Suburban classmates often criticized me for the way I spoke or dressed or the music I listened to or for just not being “black enough.” I didn’t realize it at the time, but this was likely the only way these kids knew how to express the feelings they shared with Rose. They were envious of what I had—two parents, a big yard to play in, the opportunity to take music, dance, tennis and horseback-riding lessons."

Looks pretty clear to me. People often see the black experience as something more than simply having black skin, but experiencing struggles that plague black communities far more than other ethnic groups. As evidenced from the black woman with a middle-class upbringing, many of her black peers did not see much in common in her with their own experiences. Thanks for making my point.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

A stupid liberal showing his white privilege when he denies a black man his right to explain the black experience as he experienced it, just because he happens to be a Republican. You sleep well too.

 

[MongGrel]

A stupid liberal showing his white privilege when he denies a black man his right to explain the black experience as he experienced it, just because he happens to be a Republican. You sleep well too.

Says the guy with the Nazi uniform Schultz avatar

Yeah I know, it's just an avatar...

 

[ivwshane]

A stupid liberal showing his white privilege when he denies a black man his right to explain the black experience as he experienced it, just because he happens to be a Republican. You sleep well too.

He didn't just describe his experience you fucking moron, he also denied another black man's experience just because it wasn't the same as his! It was an utterly retarded comment to make and you aren't smart enough to get it!

 

[disappoint]

http://www.businessinsider.com/heres-median-income-in-the-us-by-race-2013-9

Show me where I applied a generalization to an individual. Until then, you're full of shit and I'll keep asking you to repeat yourself until you give an honest answer to my questions, unless you think no one can ever make any kind of comment about experiences/qualities about any arbitrary group.

"How DARE you say women are raped more often than men! You're trivializing men that are raped, and insulting women that haven't been raped!"

Is that what you believe?

No that isn't what I believe. That statement that you made is not racist nor stereotyping.

You seem to be experiencing some anger due to a perceived threat. I have already mentioned I am not your adversary when I wrote I don't want to see you banned. Your mind focused on the word banned, and you experienced fear leading to your anger.

I have been honest, forthcoming, insightful and even your advocate to the best of my ability as I see it.

I think you should get some rest as it will do you some good. It's been a long day for your mind today and as I mentioned before the human mind can only process a finite amount of information. If you find yourself confused or not able to understand that is an indication that your mind requires rest so it can process what it has learned. So that it can utilize it's useful methods of deletion, distortion and generalization to deal with too much information to process all at once.

Thank you for an interesting conversation that I hope will benefit others and even yourself if you choose to read it again. Remember I mentioned deletion? Your mind will naturally forget what it feels it didn't need when you sleep. It will also distort and generalize. Take care. Try to understand when you are more able.

 

[MongGrel]

No that isn't what I believe. That statement that you made is not racist nor stereotyping.

You seem to be experiencing some anger due to a perceived threat. I have already mentioned I am not your adversary when I wrote I don't want to see you banned. Your mind focused on the word banned, and you experienced fear leading to your anger.

I have been honest, forthcoming, insightful and even your advocate to the best of my ability as I see it.

I think you should get some rest as it will do you some good. It's been a long day for your mind today and as I mentioned before the human mind can only process a finite amount of information. If you find yourself confused or not able to understand that is an indication that your mind requires rest so it can process what it has learned. So that it can utilize it's useful methods of deletion, distortion and generalization to deal with too much information to process all at once.

Thank you for an interesting conversation that I hope will benefit others and even yourself if you choose to read it again. Remember I mentioned deletion? Your mind will naturally forget what it feels it didn't need when you sleep. It will also distort and generalize. Take care. Try to understand when you are more able.

You're still trying to be Moonbeam V2.0 rather you admit it or not.

Have a nice rest of the day.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Says the guy with the Nazi uniform Schultz avatar

Yeah I know, it's just an avatar...

General Burkhalter.

He didn't just describe his experience you fucking moron, he also denied another black man's experience just because it wasn't the same as his! It was an utterly retarded comment to make and you aren't smart enough to get it!

Cool, let me know when a woman that was raped has no right to differentiate her experience from a woman that took a woman's studies lecture, when both say they grew up in a rape culture. Or how about when a person from a middle-class background tries to describe their financial struggles; a person that grew up in dire poverty SURELY has no right to comment on that.

No that isn't what I believe. That statement that you made is not racist nor stereotyping.

You seem to be experiencing some anger due to a perceived threat. I have already mentioned I am not your adversary when I wrote I don't want to see you banned. Your mind focused on the word banned, and you experienced fear leading to your anger.

I have been honest, forthcoming, insightful and even your advocate to the best of my ability as I see it.

I think you should get some rest as it will do you some good. It's been a long day for your mind today and as I mentioned before the human mind can only process a finite amount of information. If you find yourself confused or not able to understand that is an indication that your mind requires rest so it can process what it has learned. So that it can utilize it's useful methods of deletion, distortion and generalization to deal with too much information to process all at once.

Thank you for an interesting conversation that I hope will benefit others and even yourself if you choose to read it again. Remember I mentioned deletion? Your mind will naturally forget what it feels it didn't need when you sleep. It will also distort and generalize. Take care. Try to understand when you are more able.

I've said nothing even remotely ban-worthy in this discussion and have had a few short bans here and there so no, that was not the focus of it.

Again, answer this question: "Where did I make any comment about the particular way a particular person was?"

Until you do, you're not saying anything of value. ivwshane is a class-A libtard, but at least he can read and engage in an argument.

 

[MongGrel]

Yeah, about close enough, I haven't watched Hogans Heros in many decades.

Sorry about that one.

Klinkkkkkkkkkk !!!!!!

 

[disappoint]

I've said nothing even remotely ban-worthy in this discussion and have had a few short bans here and there so no, that was not the focus of it.

As far as you are aware that was not the focus of it. I'm not surprised that information is outside of your awareness.

Again, answer this question: "Where did I make any comment about the particular way a particular person was?"

Until you do, you're not saying anything of value. ivwshane is a class-A libtard, but at least he can read and engage in an argument.

That question has already been answered. Also outside of your awareness.

Oh so according to you am I having problems engaging in an argument? Now which do you think that might be? Deletion, distortion or generalization on your part?

Have you ever read some of your very old posts? Were you surprised at what you posted and wondered what you were thinking when you posted it? You are not alone. You ever wonder why that is?

Tell me again how what I post is of no value and if you think you've convinced me or most of the people reading this thread.

 

[MongGrel]

Ah, more people that exist outside of your "awareness"

You must be a fun guy at parties.

If you've ever been to one even.

 

[disappoint]

Ah, more people that exist outside of your "awareness"

You must be a fun guy at parties.

You want to try reading it again until you realize your reading comprehension skills failed you?

You can't win you know. Have you realized that yet? If you keep trying to win you'll seem like Donald Trump. Do you like Donald Trump? Do you wish to be like him?

 

[MongGrel]

You want to try reading it again until you realize your reading comprehension skills failed you?

You can't win you know. Have you realized that yet? If you keep trying to win you'll seem like Donald Trump. Do you like Donald Trump? Do you wish to be like him?

I'm not trying to "win" anything

 

[HamburgerBoy]

As far as you are aware that was not the focus of it. I'm not surprised that information is outside of your awareness.



That question has already been answered. Also outside of your awareness.

Oh so according to you am I having problems engaging in an argument? Now which do you think that might be? Deletion, distortion or generalization on your part?

Have you ever read some of your very old posts? Were you surprised at what you posted and wondered what you were thinking when you posted it? You are not alone. You ever wonder why that is?

Tell me again how what I post is of no value and if you think you've convinced me or most of the people reading this thread.

I'm aware that you're having great fun with this. Rock on bro. :thumbsup:

 

[John Connor]

How many of you are a brain surgeon, has a brother that's a rocket scientist and also won a Presidential medal of freedom all the while growing up in humble beginnings.

If you don't fit this description then STFU.