I never downshift. Is this actually bad?

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C

Clair de Lune

Banned
Sep 24, 2008
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For 5 years of driving my Mazda6i '03 manual, I've always went to neutral upon reaching desired speed and almost never downshifted. I see downshifting as pointless. If I'm going to stop, I put it in neutral and come to a stop. Why shift 5 times to get to a stop?

If I predict I'm going to stay in similar speed, I stay in current gear and coast

If I want to lower my speed, I just apply brake and proceed to re-engage to appropriate gear, matching the engine. I never do the engine brake, braking is always done by brake pedal.

No problems unless I'm:
a) missing something that's bad which I doubt (my car has 80k miles, no problems).
b) misusing the term of 'downshifting', I do shift lower when speed becomes slower, but I never engine brake myself, which what I understand as 'downshifting'.

Let me know your thoughts. :)

----

Moving this to the Garage

Moderator Eli
 
grohl

grohl

Platinum Member
Jun 27, 2004
2,849
0
76
I think the arguement is, you can wear your brakes or you can put wear on your clutch.

This is one of those "do you leave your computer on" questions where people swear by one thing or the other.

When I had a car with a 5 speed I sometimes downshifted...lots of city driving and felt like I was "saving the brakes"...I dunno.
 
Jeff7

Jeff7

Lifer
Jan 4, 2001
41,596
19
81
Originally posted by: grohl
I think the arguement is, you can wear your brakes or you can put wear on your clutch.

This is one of those "do you leave your computer on" questions where people swear by one thing or the other.

When I had a car with a 5 speed I sometimes downshifted...lots of city driving and felt like I was "saving the brakes"...I dunno.
Click to expand...
And aren't brake pads much much MUCH cheaper to replace than a transmission?


 
S

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
You REALLY need to be in the correct gear at all times (unless stopped) in case you need to make an emergency maneuver and need power to the wheels.

You don't HAVE to go through every gear when slowing down and I never do, but if I need acceleration to react to something I can without the .5 - 1 second delay.
 
Skeeedunt

Skeeedunt

Platinum Member
Oct 7, 2005
2,777
3
76
Well, as far as I know the term "downshift" encompasses any shift from a higher to lower gear. I don't know anyone who actively shifts through every gear as they come to a stop... that sounds insane... I generally just coast to a stop in gear and push the clutch in right at the end. If I'm coasting to a stop in neutral (which you generally aren't supposed to do), I might move the shifter through the gears as I decelerate, but won't actually put it into gear unless traffic picks up again.

As Jeff pointed out, I'd much rather put wear on cheap brake pads than the clutch. Downshifting without rev-matching may also put significant wear on the synchros/transmission/engine, though I'm not sure about that one.
 
Crusty

Crusty

Lifer
Sep 30, 2001
12,684
2
81
Originally posted by: spidey07
You REALLY need to be in the correct gear at all times (unless stopped) in case you need to make an emergency maneuver and need power to the wheels.

You don't HAVE to go through every gear when slowing down and I never do, but if I need acceleration to react to something I can without the .5 - 1 second delay.
Click to expand...

:thumbsup:

 
G

Goosemaster

Lifer
Apr 10, 2001
48,775
3
81
Originally posted by: Crusty
Originally posted by: spidey07
You REALLY need to be in the correct gear at all times (unless stopped) in case you need to make an emergency maneuver and need power to the wheels.

You don't HAVE to go through every gear when slowing down and I never do, but if I need acceleration to react to something I can without the .5 - 1 second delay.
Click to expand...

:thumbsup:
Click to expand...

:thumbsup:...especially if you have a small engine were a few thousand rpm could mean the difference between some sweat under you armpits and hitting a pedestrian cause you drive like an idiot and luck finally ran out (for everyone else)
 
Gunslinger08

Gunslinger08

Lifer
Nov 18, 2001
13,234
2
81
I'm not sure I can think of an "emergency maneuver" that requires acceleration instead of deceleration. Maybe if someone is coming up behind you extremely fast on a 1 lane road with barriers on both side, but that's about it.
 
S

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
Originally posted by: joshsquall
I'm not sure I can think of an "emergency maneuver" that requires acceleration instead of deceleration. Maybe if someone is coming up behind you extremely fast on a 1 lane road with barriers on both side, but that's about it.
Click to expand...

It's to avoid an accident - sometimes you have to slow down and some times you have to speed up to avoid or not cause one.

If somebody starts veering into your lane from the opposite side, slowing down would make the accident even worse. Instead, just speed up and let him miss you, behind you.
 
E

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
50,419
8
81
It's not bad.

It's causing (IMO) unnecessary wear on your brakes. You're probably also using slightly more fuel than you would normally(read: negligible).

Also, you don't need to shift 5 times to come to a stop.

If I'm cruising along at 55MPH in 5th and need to stop, I'll rev match to 5,000RPM and shift into 2nd.

If you do not rev match, you are saving wear on your clutch and transmission by not downshifting.

If you do, you are causing very little to no additional wear on your clutch and transmission by downshifting, all the while saving fuel and being better in control of your car. That means that your engine is in its powerband if you need to hit the gas again.

It goes like this.

55MPH in 5th > red light up ahead > rev match to ~4800RPM > shift to 2nd > coast > light turns green > accelerate back to 55MPH > shift back into 5th

Ideally, of course.
 
A

akshatp

Diamond Member
Oct 15, 1999
8,349
0
76
Originally posted by: DLeRium
the infamous braking vs engine braking threads are back?
Click to expand...

Yea. We should have a forum dedicated to just car questions.

Oh, wait..
 
J

jagec

Lifer
Apr 30, 2004
24,442
6
81
Originally posted by: angry hampster
I'll go 4th (top) -> 2nd -> Neutral when stopping on my motorcycle. No reason to run through all the gears, but I like having control over the bike.
Click to expand...

Wrong! You, like all motorcyclists, always shift through all of the gears...it's part of having a sequential transmission. You just don't let the clutch out in every gear.:p

Want to have more control? Leave it in 1st at the light and watch your mirrors. I've gotten rear-ended at a stop, not fun.

Originally posted by: Jeff7
Originally posted by: grohl
I think the arguement is, you can wear your brakes or you can put wear on your clutch.

This is one of those "do you leave your computer on" questions where people swear by one thing or the other.

When I had a car with a 5 speed I sometimes downshifted...lots of city driving and felt like I was "saving the brakes"...I dunno.
Click to expand...
And aren't brake pads much much MUCH cheaper to replace than a transmission?
Click to expand...

If we're assuming that people are using their equipment as wrongly as is physically possible, then to be fair you have to compare the cost of a transmission from idiotic gear-mashing to the cost of brake pads, rotors, calipers, lines, tires etc. from idiotic brake-riding and tire-locking.

Or we can just make a reasonable comparison where the "cost" of downshifting is slightly increased clutch wear (minimized with revmatching) compared to slightly increased brake pad wear without downshifting.
 
K

Kelvrick

Lifer
Feb 14, 2001
18,422
5
81
Originally posted by: jagec
Originally posted by: angry hampster
I'll go 4th (top) -> 2nd -> Neutral when stopping on my motorcycle. No reason to run through all the gears, but I like having control over the bike.
Click to expand...

Wrong! You, like all motorcyclists, always shift through all of the gears...it's part of having a sequential transmission. You just don't let the clutch out in every gear.:p

Want to have more control? Leave it in 1st at the light and watch your mirrors. I've gotten rear-ended at a stop, not fun.
Click to expand...

I usually give the brakes a couple flashes when that first car is going to stop behind me. Otherwise, if its a light I know or I can see the crossing lights, I'll pop it in N until I see a yellow.
 
M

makken

Golden Member
Aug 28, 2004
1,476
0
76
Originally posted by: spidey07
You REALLY need to be in the correct gear at all times (unless stopped) in case you need to make an emergency maneuver and need power to the wheels.

You don't HAVE to go through every gear when slowing down and I never do, but if I need acceleration to react to something I can without the .5 - 1 second delay.
Click to expand...

this.

90% of the time I come to a stop in second gear. You don't have to go through all of the gears when coming to a stop, just enough to keep the engine in the powerband as much as possible in case of emergencies.

Generally, I go 5->3->2 or 4->2, and just let the clutch in at about 10mph (just above 1k rpm in 2nd on my car). Try to rev match to save wear on the clutch. You don't have to be that precise, just stab the throttle to get the rpms up.
 
StageLeft

StageLeft

No Lifer
Sep 29, 2000
70,150
5
0
I essentially never downshift if I know I'm coming to a stop, either. I like to avoid wear particularly on the clutch, as brakes are intended for braking and do it best.
I'm not sure I can think of an "emergency maneuver" that requires acceleration instead of deceleration. Maybe if someone is coming up behind you extremely fast on a 1 lane road with barriers on both side, but that's about it.
Click to expand...
Yeah it's basically a non-event.
 
PingSpike

PingSpike

Lifer
Feb 25, 2004
21,754
599
126
I run through the gears with the clutch in the whole time while braking I guess. Not always, and I skip gears when it makes sense.
 
JulesMaximus

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,544
924
126
Originally posted by: Jeff7
Originally posted by: grohl
I think the arguement is, you can wear your brakes or you can put wear on your clutch.

This is one of those "do you leave your computer on" questions where people swear by one thing or the other.

When I had a car with a 5 speed I sometimes downshifted...lots of city driving and felt like I was "saving the brakes"...I dunno.
Click to expand...

And aren't brake pads much much MUCH cheaper to replace than a transmission?
Click to expand...

The amount of additional wear you place on your clutch if you downshift properly is very low.

Clutches wear out...brakes wear out...the only way to prevent that is to not drive your car.

Downshifting is one of those things you really should do, or at least be able to know how to do, if you drive a manual. Think of it this way, if someone is chasing you and you need to evade then you need to be in the correct gear when you hit the apex of every corner. The only way to do that is to downshift ahead of time.

Also, if you are driving down a long steep hill it is much better to do it in a lower gear to keep from riding your brakes.
 
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