I need XP pro network help please

Johnbear007

Diamond Member
Jul 1, 2002
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Ok, I have XP pro on two machines, with a USR router/print server sharing a DSL connection

Internet works perfectly


I can't get the computers to see each other.... the werd thing is, when I go to Show Work Group Computers, the computers don't even see themselves. And yes, they are both set to the same workgroup. However, why wouldnt they even see themselves as part of the workgroup?

I have tried with both TCP/IP and NETBEUI

I want it set up with netbeui however.

Right now I have

File and printer sharing bound to ONLY netbeui

and Netbeui AND TCP/IP are bound to the Client for microsoft networks

and advice is greatly appreciated.
 

Fencer128

Platinum Member
Jun 18, 2001
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Are the machines on the same subnet (NetBIOS not being a routable protocol)?

Cheers,

Andy
 

Johnbear007

Diamond Member
Jul 1, 2002
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If Netbeui is not routable, then how does that matter? Sorry I don't understand exactly.

Is this configured within the TCP/IP protocal options? Because thats the only place I see subnet options

I can change the subnet mask, but right now it's set up to do all of that automatically.
 

Fencer128

Platinum Member
Jun 18, 2001
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Originally posted by: Johnbear007
If Netbeui is not routable, then how does that matter? Sorry I don't understand exactly.

Is this configured within the TCP/IP protocal options? Because thats the only place I see subnet options

I can change the subnet mask, but right now it's set up to do all of that automatically.

Sorry - yes, I was thinking TCP/IP. (I'm not a big fan of NetBEUI - though I admit it can work well for file sharing on a small network). Careful not to confuse NetBIOS with NetBEUI though.

NetBEUI is based on the NetBIOS protocol. NetBIOS supplies the file sharing ablility we find so handy. NetBIOS uses SMB, which I believe is not routable (ie a router won't forward it) and so it can't pass between IP subnets.

Back to your problem...

Can you ping one machine from the other?

Have both machines been assigned computer names?

I'm pretty sure this can be solved fairly simply.

Cheers,

Andy

EDIT: If you'd like to do it via IP - I pretty sure I can definitely get that working.
 

JackMDS

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 25, 1999
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Since both computers are Good with the Internet I would assume that you Hardware is OK.

Your description of the Initial Binding sound reasonable. You can check your setting in this page.

Link: Set NetBEUI as the Default Sharing Protocol in WinXP.

You problem is probably a result of "Bad" Sharing settings.

Log to the following page, scroll down, in the middle (yellow hi-lited) you will find info, and links to solve sharing problems.

Link: Basic Networking
 

Johnbear007

Diamond Member
Jul 1, 2002
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Originally posted by: JackMDS
Since both computers are Good with the Internet I would assume that you Hardware is OK.

Your description of the Initial Binding sound reasonable. You can check your setting in this page.

Link: Set NetBEUI as the Default Sharing Protocol in WinXP.

You problem is probably a result of "Bad" Sharing settings.

Log to the following page, scroll down, in the middle (yellow hi-lited) you will find info, and links to solve sharing problems.

Link: Basic Networking

Yes NETBEUI is already set as the Default protocol. I also have simple file sharing enabled, although at one point I did not. Simple file sharing is enabled on both computers now.


Yes, I can ping one machine from the other. I've been through those pages once, but I will review them again,.


Any other ideas?
 

mboy

Diamond Member
Jul 29, 2001
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Dump Netbui, it is an outdated protocol.

Make sure u have print/file sharing checked off of course, make sure the XP firewall is off. You arent using anything like ZA or another software firewall right?
Final thing to check is make sure u have something sahred out on the pc's. NOthing shared means they aint showin up!
 

JackMDS

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 25, 1999
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Originally posted by: mboy
Dump Netbui, it is an outdated protocol.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Any real technical reason not to use NetBEUI for small Network?

Ethernet is 30 years old this week should we dump it too?

May be we should switch to PowerLine or BlueTooth they are both new.
 

mboy

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Jul 29, 2001
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On a small network, it could be used (large network it is slow with too many re broadcasts), BUT, why even bother using it? Becasue it isnt routable over the internet? Their are better ways to secure your data.

Ethernet is old, but not outdated. Netbui is. WHo do you know that REALLy uses Netbui? Maybe some home users, thats about it. It doesnt even come intsalled with windows anymore.
 

Johnbear007

Diamond Member
Jul 1, 2002
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Originally posted by: mboy
On a small network, it could be used (large network it is slow with too many re broadcasts), BUT, why even bother using it? Becasue it isnt routable over the internet? Their are better ways to secure your data.

Ethernet is old, but not outdated. Netbui is. WHo do you know that REALLy uses Netbui? Maybe some home users, thats about it. It doesnt even come intsalled with windows anymore.

how can you make your datat more secure than to make it unsharable on the net?
 

mboy

Diamond Member
Jul 29, 2001
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Well, that majkes it pretty damn secure, but a properly set up firewall apliance, using IPsec on your LAN etc, is a god way. Too many people here fall back on Netbui when they cant figure out how to make TCP/IP work. Adding netbui just adds headache to the equation. I am certainly no fan of any type of defualt M$ install, but they dont even load Netbui by defualt anymore, they make u go looking for it.

Bottom line is unless you have a very specific reason to use Netbui, why bother? LEarn how to use and secure tcp/ip and you will be much better off then using Netbui as a crutch.
 

Johnbear007

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Jul 1, 2002
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Originally posted by: mboy
Well, that majkes it pretty damn secure, but a properly set up firewall apliance, using IPsec on your LAN etc, is a god way. Too many people here fall back on Netbui when they cant figure out how to make TCP/IP work. Adding netbui just adds headache to the equation. I am certainly no fan of any type of defualt M$ install, but they dont even load Netbui by defualt anymore, they make u go looking for it.

Bottom line is unless you have a very specific reason to use Netbui, why bother? LEarn how to use and secure tcp/ip and you will be much better off then using Netbui as a crutch.

I understand what you are saying. The reason I want to use netbeui is for peace of mind. However, I do need to have this system ready to lan.

I will try to set it up with just TCP/IP once again

Could you please give me some advice on securing it? Right now I have my hardware router, and then I run Zone Alarm on all the machines (and no, I havent had it on during all this trouble shooting, its been off)

I can't afford to buy any hardware /software right now though.
 

Johnbear007

Diamond Member
Jul 1, 2002
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One thing I can't figure out though

Why don't this computers even see themselves as part of the network?

I just put a third machine on and it works, I can see it from ONE of my other machines, but even the machine that CAN see and interact with it, STILL can't see itself.
 

mboy

Diamond Member
Jul 29, 2001
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file and print sharing is enbled? U hactually have something on the drive shared out? Make sure the firewall in XP and ZA is off for sure. ZA can cause all kinds of networking headaches.
 

Johnbear007

Diamond Member
Jul 1, 2002
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Ok here is my new status:

I now have it setup with TCP/IP and:

Two of the machines see each other and interact flawlessly.

One machine can't see anything, inlcuding itself. All settings SEEM to be the same. and all three are running XP pro, all updated, drviers etc.


Is there a way to totally clear all network settings in XP ? in 98 and 2000 I could just remove everything and start fresh. Here I can't do that.


Also... how am I going to make this network secure?