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Question I need some help with my case cooling.

Tmansdc

Junior Member
Mar 19, 2019
9
0
11
Right now I'm looking at getting a third-party am4 backplate from amazon, two 140mm case fans, and a new cpu cooler. I only have $100 for all this. I see that the am4 backplate on amazon doesn't work too well with stock wraith coolers but I'm planning on getting an aftermarket cooler.

I got $100 in refund/account balance on amazon so I want to get this stuff on amazon. What I'm looking forward to getting is thermal grizzly cryonaut, two 140mm case fans (one for the top of the case and one for the front. Mobo only supports three fans and one is already being used for the rear exhaust fan.), and a cpu cooler. The questions I have is:

When installing the two case fans, what would be the best way to use them? Should they both be exhaust fans, intake fans, or should one be an intake fan and one be an exhaust fan? Also what's the best position to install them at? I'm thinking center for both.
Last time I tried a tower cpu cooler my gpu got about 10 celsius warmer than it did with the stock downdraft/top down cpu cooler. Will the two fans I'm getting help mitigate that? Did I install the cpu cooler wrong? I got a stock rtx 2070 super so the fans can get a bit loud with temperature and the cooling isn't the best. Yes I should have gotten an aftermarket version but oh well.
What is the best cpu cooler I can get for under $50?
Will this be sufficient enough to secure/mount the cooler? (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07C2BXDQM/ref=psdc_2998409011_t1_B0168H15DO) (https://www.amazon.com/Mounting-Plate-AMD-Socket-AM4/dp/B06X9VF8TN?ref_=ast_bbp_dp)


This was my first build. I have a ryzen 5 3600x, 32gb 2x16 ddr4 3200 t-force vulcan ram, 256gb nvme ssd, stock founders edition rtx 2070 super, asus tuf gaming x570 wifi board, evga 650w 80+ gold gq psu, a deepcool matrexx 50 case, and a nf-a12x25 2000rpm pwm fan for the rear exhaust case fan which is my only case fan. I hope I didn't do any permanent damage. What else can I do? Could reseating the cpu help with the heat? I spent like $1300 on this computer and it ran fine for the first month. Should have never redid the cooler. It was working OK before.
 

UsandThem

Super Moderator
May 4, 2000
11,450
1,962
136
Right now I'm looking at getting a third-party am4 backplate from amazon, two 140mm case fans, and a new cpu cooler. I only have $100 for all this. I see that the am4 backplate on amazon doesn't work too well with stock wraith coolers but I'm planning on getting an aftermarket cooler.
I haven't heard that the stock back-plate doesn't work well with stock coolers. My large Noctua cooler uses the stock back-plate on my motherboard, and I have no concerns about buying another type.
When installing the two case fans, what would be the best way to use them? Should they both be exhaust fans, intake fans, or should one be an intake fan and one be an exhaust fan? Also what's the best position to install them at? I'm thinking center for both.
Depending on the case, most people have the fans in the front pull in cool air, and exhaust hot air out of the back of the case. You would to place the fans where they blow across your video card and CPU, however the middle works almost as well.
What is the best cpu cooler I can get for under $50?
Why not save the money and use the stock cooler?
I hope I didn't do any permanent damage. What else can I do? Could reseating the cpu help with the heat? I spent like $1300 on this computer and it ran fine for the first month. Should have never redid the cooler. It was working OK before.
Maybe you used too much or too little paste. Clean it off and do again.

I doubt you did any damage (I remember your first post here about falling asleep from gaming). CPUs are designed to throttle down when they get too hot, and an additional 10c isn't that much.
 

Tmansdc

Junior Member
Mar 19, 2019
9
0
11
Is this good advice? (From another forum)


You can also look at the Scythe Fuma 2, its an excellent cooler as well but it's slight harder to install and takes up more room. On the plus side it comes with a backplate and currently a 5% off coupon on Amazon. I would still swap 120x25 fans with the cooler and your Noctua A12 exhaust fan.

I would still go with three solid 140mm fans over two "better" 140mm fans for lower temps. If you want to "upgrade the fans" some options to look at

Noctua P-14 redux, the 900rpm 3-pin is silent and offers very good performance while the PWM versions offer up to 1200rpm, 1500rpm, or 1700rpm performance if needed. All are around $15. You can look at the Noctua A14 & 15 lines but having owned both series of fans mentioned the A14 & 15 primarily offer more goodies (splitter, rubber fan mounts, low noise adapters, etc.,) then necessarily better performance then the redux series.

Phanteks SP - series - I've owned four of these both led and non led. They are well built and performance wise they are great but they are loud compared to Noctua, you here a "motor whine" noise even at 900rpm. I'm a noise freak so I found it irritating and replaced them with Noctua fans.

If you want to buy a better 140mm fan I would put that one over the HSF for outake and use two solid 140mm fans for front intake
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
13,464
2,929
136
@Tmansdc

First off, I would nix any plans to buy a 3rd-party backplate for your board unless an HSF you buy requires it.

Secondly, many users either like "positive pressure" or "windtunnel" strategies for their cooling. Under your circumstances, I would opt for "positive pressure" - lots of intakes in different positions, with maybe one or two exhaust fans on the back/top of your case. Try populating all three intake positions on the front of your case, and then use two exhaust fans - one in the rear position, and one in the rear/top position. You can run more fans with an external fan controller or even a simple fan splitter. Unless noise is an issue, a simple fan splitter that runs off a molex or SATA power cable and runs multiple fans at 100% speed is good enough. If the fans are silent at 100% then who cares? Alternatively, some fans, like these:


let you daisy-chain the PWM function. You could have your three intake fans run off one fan header and retain full PWM functionality. That 5-pack would cover your entire case.

You can try Kryonaut if you like, but unless you are using a top-end HSF with it, I wouldn't bother. Stick to something cheap(er) like MX4. I love Kryonaut - don't get me wrong. It's all about squeezing out the last ounce of performance (without using a metal TIM) once you've covered all the other bases. Odds are, you are not going to cover all the other bases for $100.

As for an HSF . . . you'll have to tell us how that stock HSF is performing right now to give us some idea of how much extra cooling you really need. But if you get the fan pack I recommended above, that gives you maybe $50 left on your budget if you choose to get a little MX4, assuming you even need it. Which you might not. Do you have any paste already?
 

Tmansdc

Junior Member
Mar 19, 2019
9
0
11
Yeah I'm going to have to get one with a backplate. Plus it seems like I have no way to open the front of my case so I only have the top and rear exhaust fans. I could probably put two exhaust fans on top or maybe an intake towards the front most part of the top of the case and an exhaust fan towards the furthest rear part of the top of the case as well.


I am just using the stock cooler on top of a 40x40mm innovation cooling graphite pad. I'm getting up to 76 celsius just by browsing the internet and doing college work. I've optimized windows 10 following a guide from Tech Yes City and have absolutely nothing else running in the background.


It seems like I cannot open the front of my case which is a bummer. Until I get two 140mm fans for the top (Or since I can't open the front maybe I'll get 200mm fans now an intake for the front most part of the top of the case and an exhaust for the furthest rear part of the case)


Until I get the 140/200 top case fans I stuck the fan that came with my case in the middle of the top as an exhaust fan. It's doing ok. Don't think it's helping temperatures much though.


And nope, no paste whatsoever.
 
Last edited:

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
13,464
2,929
136
You're using a graphite pad? Weird. Okay, here are my recommendations:

a). Call tech support and figure out how to open up the front of the case. Your case supports 3 intake, and that's your preferred config. Until you fix that, I would not recommend realigning your case fans. That's your #1 priority.
b). Get some MX4. It's easy to apply, and those graphite pads . . . look, I would not mess with one of those. Really. Alternatively you can just use the paste that ships with your new HSF to save some money. It will be adequate for your setup. MX4 will probably be a bit better. Probably.
c). If you want a new HSF, get this thing:


For the price, I do not think you will get better cooling. It should include its own mounting hardware, including the backplate. Do not mess with some other backplate from a different manufacturer. Just stick with the TR mount hardware. Looks like it comes with Thermalright TF4 paste. At 9.5W/mK it isn't great, but it's okay. Thermalright's TF8 is better, so I'm not sure why they wouldn't give you that instead. Cheap bastards.
 

VirtualLarry

Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
45,445
4,029
126
Yep, "everybody" (enthusiasts) should have:
1) a bootable USB flash drive with Windows 10 installer (created using MCT)
2) a bootable USB flash drive with Linux (Mint, or Ubuntu, or another popular distro)
3) a tube of thermal paste, MX4 is relatively inexpensive, non-conductive/capacitive, and spreads easily, and overall, works well. (It's what I use these days.)
4) a spare PSU, of sufficient wattage to run your main rig, should you need to replace or diagnose a PSU failure
5) a set of screwdrivers, suitable for working on PCs. (Can be found at the dollar store, believe it or not. Depending on your grade of dollar store, I guess.)
6) (optional) a DVM/DMM, for checking voltages, and shorts, and battery voltage for the CMOS battery.
7) (optional) spare CMOS batteries. (If you work on PCs, especially older ones.) (Can be found at dollar stores, or pharmacies.)
 

UsandThem

Super Moderator
May 4, 2000
11,450
1,962
136
Well, this thread has had some interesting twist and turns. :oops:

Like DrMrLordX stated, that case can support 3 x 140mm fans in the front.

Additionally, like he mentioned, get rid of of the graphite pad, and buy some regular thermal paste. Forget buying an aftermarket backplate as well.

You are making this a lot harder than it needs to be.

11.jpg
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
13,464
2,929
136
Looks good. You may not need that fan splitter since those fans you ordered can daisy chain PWM signals on their own. You'll see when they arrive. You plug fan #1 into fan #2, and then fan #2 into Fan #3, and then fan #3 into a motherboard fan header. That gets all your front intakes onto one header, and you control them via a single PWM signal (they all wind up running the same speed).
 

Tmansdc

Junior Member
Mar 19, 2019
9
0
11
Ah crud really? Oh well if not I'll have them for the future. Not too worried about $8 enough to send them back. Well I might if I don't need them.


Thank you all very much for your help!
 

Tmansdc

Junior Member
Mar 19, 2019
9
0
11
I haven't gotten my new cpu cooler yet but I got the fans. I installed two 140mm fans as exhaust on the top of the case but it didn't make a difference! In fact my cpu is acting just like it did and my gpu is actually idling at 31 to 33 now when it used to idle at 27 to 29.


Also I couldn't install my front case fans because I just cannot remove the front case. I looked up two videos and seen that they put the glass part back on after installing the fans. Is there a way I can get longer screws or something and mount them from the reverse side? Or if I can't should I send back the fans and just get two higher quality 140mm case fans with more airflow, static pressure, etc. And just make the fan closer to the front an intake and leave the one closer to the rear as an exhaust fan?


Thank you very much. I should probably look up how to undervolt my cpu because just running steam and chrome goes up to the low 80s temp wise.
 

UsandThem

Super Moderator
May 4, 2000
11,450
1,962
136
Thank you very much. I should probably look up how to undervolt my cpu because just running steam and chrome goes up to the low 80s temp wise.
No, you should take your case to a PC repair shop, or watch the Deepcool build video again in post #9 to learn how to remove your front panel.


If you can't figure out how to add front intake fans, there's not any point doing anything else to your PC.
 

EliteRetard

Diamond Member
Mar 6, 2006
5,999
820
136
I haven't gotten my new cpu cooler yet but I got the fans. I installed two 140mm fans as exhaust on the top of the case but it didn't make a difference! In fact my cpu is acting just like it did and my gpu is actually idling at 31 to 33 now when it used to idle at 27 to 29.

*snip*
That case looks like it has very limited front intake, barely any vents there and only on the sides. Those front side vents force a 90 degree change in airflow which further reduces airflow by a large amount (I recall it was like 30-50%). My theory is that because you now have all the good vent holes as exhaust they're fighting for airflow, including your GPU which is a reference exhaust blower style. Even if you add fans to the front they may not do anything, being forcibly limited by the poor front case ventilation (like trying to suck a steak through a straw).

Might be worth experimenting with the fan placement/direction. Perhaps having the three back/top fans as intake will be a better option for that case. That would probably push some of the CPU heat into the GPU, but more fresh air available might remove more heat and reduce temps. Maybe try one or two top intake with the rear as exhaust. Could you mod the case and add vents through the bottom and PSU shroud (and mount fans there)?

I do agree with others though, I think the primary heat issue with your CPU is due to the thermal pad. They may have ten times better heat transfer (per mm/inch) than paste, but are literally hundreds/thousands of times thicker. Ideally you'd have two well polished flat surfaces and just a few molecules thick of thermal paste between them.

If you do manage to remove the front to install fans try installing them "inside", so you'd still see the metal frame and screw heads through the glass. If you install the fans "outside" nearest the glass (screws from inside the case) there may not be enough room between the glass for them to get any air at all. In either situation I would set those fans to low speed (maybe 600 RPM) because higher speed probably wont be able to draw additional air, it will just make more noise and wear out the fans faster (fan motors can overheat in low airflow situations). I would even suggest leaving a gap around two front fans, place one a bit below the top and another like half a fan space below that. Two fans should be able to pull everything available through that limited front vent, and leaving space open around those fans will allow them to get airflow/volume from inside the case as necessary...mixing in with the fresh intake.
 

UsandThem

Super Moderator
May 4, 2000
11,450
1,962
136
I forgot to add, I noticed you have posted these same questions, word for word, on multiple sites.

Everyone tells you the same thing, yet you don't seem to listen to any of them. So I'm not sure if your posts are even serious at this point.

https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/two-more-questions-about-case-fans-and-temps.260366/
https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/1114206-got-four-questions-about-my-desktop-computer-case-fans-and-cpu-cooler/?tab=comments#comment-12970829
https://forums.tomshardware.com/threads/i-need-some-help-with-case-pc-cooling.3535513/
www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/comments/dlrjrg/two_more_questions_about_cooling_and_case_fans/

From what I gather, you can select parts for a PC, build the PC, find and post across multiple hardware forums, but you can't pull the panel from the front of your case? Yeah, I'm just not buying it. :rolleyes:
 

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