I helped kill judges and cops, and I helped blow up buidlings

[Spendthrift]

the child porn thing was just the analogy i used because it has an underground criminal ring and expliots children as does drug trafficking (albeit in different ways).

as for europe and other enlightened countries...

most of the EU has not legalized drugs, maybe there is a reason for that. however the two countries that i am aware of are holland and sweden (i believe).

i dont know about sweden (cause i havent been there), but amsterdam is not exactly what i want america to become. not to mention the fact that theyve only legalized marijuana and hard drugs are still illegal.

you faulted me for my analogy with kiddie porn and yet you say that drug legalization "HAS worked in Europe and other "enlightened" countries" when in fact only soft drugs (marijuana) have been legalized and only a few countries have adopted this policy. thats hardly conclusive proof upon which america should be expected stop the war on all drugs.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Spendthrift
the child porn thing was just the analogy i used because it has an underground criminal ring and expliots children as does drug trafficking (albeit in different ways).

Well, I am glad you stopped with that terrible analogy.

as for europe and other enlightened countries...

most of the EU has not legalized drugs, maybe there is a reason for that. however the two countries that i am aware of are holland and sweden (i believe).

The US influence and their stupid war's influence extends pretty far. However, even England is getting sick of this "war" and is considering decriminalizing pot.

i dont know about sweden (cause i havent been there), but amsterdam is not exactly what i want america to become. not to mention the fact that theyve only legalized marijuana and hard drugs are still illegal.

They have legalized cannabis and largely decriminalized other drug "use" . . . their emphasis is on helping people who want to kick harder drugs do so easily . . . and without sending them to prison.

you faulted me for my analogy with kiddie porn and yet you say that drug legalization "HAS worked in Europe and other "enlightened" countries" when in fact only soft drugs (marijuana) have been legalized and only a few countries have adopted this policy. thats hardly conclusive proof upon which america should be expected stop the war on all drugs.

The "conclusive proof" is America's failure in its war on people. And I don't believe I asked for all drugs to be made legal - rather I spoke of decriminalization.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Spendthrift
amused one - your logic could be applied to a number of things.

we will never win the war against child pornography and its "illegality only creates a highly dangerous underground black market."

so heck, guess we should legalize it and that way the money wont go to the underground porn shops and whatever else theyre connected with.

There is a distinct difference. Child porn causes direct harm to unwilling victims. Drug use does not. Drugs were outlawed in a vain attempt to save people from themselves. It has failed miserably just as every other similar law has... meanwhile, the vain attempts to enforce such laws have cost us more and more of our individual rights.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Spendthrift
some drug users are victims just as children in child porn are.

do you really believe that all drug users are informed adults who make rational decisions to use drugs and can quit anytime they choose?

what about the kids who start using because of peer pressure or because they dont know/realize the impact that drugs will have on their life?


and the argument was never about whether it is a victimless crime or not. it was about whether government intervention creates an underground black market and avoiding that by making things legal.

Please, produce one person in the US over 5 that has not been told drugs are bad for them.

Drug users, no matter their age, are victims of nothing more than their own irresponsibility.

I know, I was addicted to cocaine in high school. And it was no one's fault but mine.

And yes, the more the government bans, the more illegal markets it creates. This becomes especially acute when the thing banned is addictive. Banning things such as drugs, alcohol, tobacco and prostitution has historically -- and in every case -- always created more problems than it cured... and ultimately lead to an erosion of individual freedoms.

 

[Amused]

most of the EU has not legalized drugs, maybe there is a reason for that. however the two countries that i am aware of are holland and sweden (i believe).

i dont know about sweden (cause i havent been there), but amsterdam is not exactly what i want america to become. not to mention the fact that theyve only legalized marijuana and hard drugs are still illegal.

Hard drugs have been decriminalized for the most part in the Netherlands. And guess what? Abuse rates are lower than ours. Moreover, their crime rate dropped dramatically afterwards.