I HATE CAMPUS CRUSADE!!

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Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: Vic
I just wish that the kids here would realize that these zealots do NOT represent mainstream Christianity.
True, mainstream Christians aren't Fund A Mental Cases or Evanga Whackos. Unfortunately those Wankers make the most noise and are the biggest pests so they give all Christians a bad name.
 

Gurck

Banned
Mar 16, 2004
12,963
1
0
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Originally posted by: Connoisseur
Originally posted by: HotChic
1. She wasn't trying to "force" you to do anything. If you had said "no thanks" and walked away, there's a darn good chance she would have left you alone.

2. Know that from her perspective, she's doing something nice. If you find her intent to be of any value, she intended well.

3. I didn't see any arrogance in what she said to you - she talked about her reasons for thinking her religion was correct. I don't see that she put your religion or any other down in any way. In fact, you're doing more putting down than she did.

Furthermore, I personally thought it was arrogant of her to come up to me. Once again, going back to the cook analogy. Let's say we both made apple pie: I like mine, and you like yours. But then I tell you, out of the blue, that you should make your apple pie just like mine because mine is the best way to make it, wouldn't that be arrogant of me? If cooking isn't your strong suite, then just picture any other situation which you WOULD feel strongly about.

You are an idiot. Christians don't think that their religion is correct. They KNOW it is, through faith. Sh!t man, in her eyes, she was trying to save your soul. She was being incredibly generous, from her point of view. If you don't agree, then walk away.

By that logic, he'd be doing her a great favor by kicking her ass, or better yet, finishing her off for good. Not very palatable when the shoe's on the other foot, now is it? :( At least have the balls to admit what we both know; that you think you're better than other people and thus have more rights because you're christian. Since I don't think, but rather know you'll twist this around, I'll point out something logic should tell you in the first place, but unfortunately won't - that I say this not becuase you're christian, but because you're defending unsolicited marketing.
 

Gunslinger08

Lifer
Nov 18, 2001
13,234
2
81
Originally posted by: Gurck
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Originally posted by: Connoisseur
Originally posted by: HotChic
1. She wasn't trying to "force" you to do anything. If you had said "no thanks" and walked away, there's a darn good chance she would have left you alone.

2. Know that from her perspective, she's doing something nice. If you find her intent to be of any value, she intended well.

3. I didn't see any arrogance in what she said to you - she talked about her reasons for thinking her religion was correct. I don't see that she put your religion or any other down in any way. In fact, you're doing more putting down than she did.

Furthermore, I personally thought it was arrogant of her to come up to me. Once again, going back to the cook analogy. Let's say we both made apple pie: I like mine, and you like yours. But then I tell you, out of the blue, that you should make your apple pie just like mine because mine is the best way to make it, wouldn't that be arrogant of me? If cooking isn't your strong suite, then just picture any other situation which you WOULD feel strongly about.

You are an idiot. Christians don't think that their religion is correct. They KNOW it is, through faith. Sh!t man, in her eyes, she was trying to save your soul. She was being incredibly generous, from her point of view. If you don't agree, then walk away.

By that logic, he'd be doing her a great favor by kicking her ass, or better yet, finishing her off for good. Not very palatable when the shoe's on the other foot, now is it? :( At least have the balls to admit what we both know; that you think you're better than other people and thus have more rights because you're christian.

I'm not a Christian.
And no, I don't see how that follows from my logic.
 

Gunslinger08

Lifer
Nov 18, 2001
13,234
2
81
Originally posted by: Gurck
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Originally posted by: Connoisseur
Originally posted by: HotChic
1. She wasn't trying to "force" you to do anything. If you had said "no thanks" and walked away, there's a darn good chance she would have left you alone.

2. Know that from her perspective, she's doing something nice. If you find her intent to be of any value, she intended well.

3. I didn't see any arrogance in what she said to you - she talked about her reasons for thinking her religion was correct. I don't see that she put your religion or any other down in any way. In fact, you're doing more putting down than she did.

Furthermore, I personally thought it was arrogant of her to come up to me. Once again, going back to the cook analogy. Let's say we both made apple pie: I like mine, and you like yours. But then I tell you, out of the blue, that you should make your apple pie just like mine because mine is the best way to make it, wouldn't that be arrogant of me? If cooking isn't your strong suite, then just picture any other situation which you WOULD feel strongly about.

You are an idiot. Christians don't think that their religion is correct. They KNOW it is, through faith. Sh!t man, in her eyes, she was trying to save your soul. She was being incredibly generous, from her point of view. If you don't agree, then walk away.

By that logic, he'd be doing her a great favor by kicking her ass, or better yet, finishing her off for good. Not very palatable when the shoe's on the other foot, now is it? :( At least have the balls to admit what we both know; that you think you're better than other people and thus have more rights because you're christian. Since I don't think, but rather know you'll twist this around, I'll point out something logic should tell you in the first place, but unfortunately won't - that I say this not becuase you're christian, but because you're defending unsolicited marketing.

You have no valid claim to privacy while walking around a college campus. Illegal unsolicited marketing would only include coming into your home... which crazy denominations, like Jehovah's Witnesses, do.
 

Gurck

Banned
Mar 16, 2004
12,963
1
0
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Originally posted by: Gurck
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Originally posted by: Connoisseur
Originally posted by: HotChic
1. She wasn't trying to "force" you to do anything. If you had said "no thanks" and walked away, there's a darn good chance she would have left you alone.

2. Know that from her perspective, she's doing something nice. If you find her intent to be of any value, she intended well.

3. I didn't see any arrogance in what she said to you - she talked about her reasons for thinking her religion was correct. I don't see that she put your religion or any other down in any way. In fact, you're doing more putting down than she did.

Furthermore, I personally thought it was arrogant of her to come up to me. Once again, going back to the cook analogy. Let's say we both made apple pie: I like mine, and you like yours. But then I tell you, out of the blue, that you should make your apple pie just like mine because mine is the best way to make it, wouldn't that be arrogant of me? If cooking isn't your strong suite, then just picture any other situation which you WOULD feel strongly about.

You are an idiot. Christians don't think that their religion is correct. They KNOW it is, through faith. Sh!t man, in her eyes, she was trying to save your soul. She was being incredibly generous, from her point of view. If you don't agree, then walk away.

By that logic, he'd be doing her a great favor by kicking her ass, or better yet, finishing her off for good. Not very palatable when the shoe's on the other foot, now is it? :( At least have the balls to admit what we both know; that you think you're better than other people and thus have more rights because you're christian.

I'm not a Christian.
And no, I don't see how that follows from my logic.

I, and many others, hate evangelists. I feel that they do it because they're secretly very unhappy and insecure about their religion. There's strength in numbers, and adding to their ranks helps them to make the leap of "faith" that they can't quite make otherwise. Therefore I truly feel that both they and the world around them would be better off if they weren't there, and that I'd be doing both them and the world a favor by hastening their departure from this world. That's how it follows from your logic. You want me to tie your shoes for you too?
 

Gunslinger08

Lifer
Nov 18, 2001
13,234
2
81
Originally posted by: Gurck
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Originally posted by: Gurck
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Originally posted by: Connoisseur
Originally posted by: HotChic
1. She wasn't trying to "force" you to do anything. If you had said "no thanks" and walked away, there's a darn good chance she would have left you alone.

2. Know that from her perspective, she's doing something nice. If you find her intent to be of any value, she intended well.

3. I didn't see any arrogance in what she said to you - she talked about her reasons for thinking her religion was correct. I don't see that she put your religion or any other down in any way. In fact, you're doing more putting down than she did.

Furthermore, I personally thought it was arrogant of her to come up to me. Once again, going back to the cook analogy. Let's say we both made apple pie: I like mine, and you like yours. But then I tell you, out of the blue, that you should make your apple pie just like mine because mine is the best way to make it, wouldn't that be arrogant of me? If cooking isn't your strong suite, then just picture any other situation which you WOULD feel strongly about.

You are an idiot. Christians don't think that their religion is correct. They KNOW it is, through faith. Sh!t man, in her eyes, she was trying to save your soul. She was being incredibly generous, from her point of view. If you don't agree, then walk away.

By that logic, he'd be doing her a great favor by kicking her ass, or better yet, finishing her off for good. Not very palatable when the shoe's on the other foot, now is it? :( At least have the balls to admit what we both know; that you think you're better than other people and thus have more rights because you're christian.

I'm not a Christian.
And no, I don't see how that follows from my logic.

I, and many others, hate evangelists. I feel that they do it because they're secretly very unhappy and insecure about their religion. There's strength in numbers, and adding to their ranks helps them to make the leap of "faith" that they can't quite make otherwise. Therefore I truly feel that both they and the world around them would be better off if they weren't there, and that I'd be doing both them and the world a favor by hastening their departure from this world. That's how it follows from your logic. You want me to tie your shoes for you too?

Then go right ahead and blow them all away.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: Gurck

I, and many others, hate evangelists. I feel that they do it because they're secretly very unhappy and insecure about their religion. There's strength in numbers, and adding to their ranks helps them to make the leap of "faith" that they can't quite make otherwise. Therefore I truly feel that both they and the world around them would be better off if they weren't there, and that I'd be doing both them and the world a favor by hastening their departure from this world. That's how it follows from your logic. You want me to tie your shoes for you too?
Damn I agree they can be as annoying as a rash on your bunghole but you really let them get to you. I always found them easy to avoid and never has one crashed any party I attended.
 

J Heartless Slick

Golden Member
Nov 11, 1999
1,330
0
0
Originally posted by: Connoisseur
So I'm walking to class yesterday in Rutgers minding my own business and whistling a nice tune. Suddenly, this Chinese girl says "Excuse me, you have a minute?". Being a nice guy and assuming she needs info or something I say "sure". She then starts "I was wondering, are you Christian?". "Crap" I said to myself. I knew where this is going. But, once again, being a nice guy, I said "No, I'm Hindu." This sparked a eulogy from this girl about how Christ said that worshipping him is the only way to reach god and how Christ's message is so great and awesome. She went ON and ON about how all of Christ's prophecies came true and about how all people should worship God through the church and Christ. I didn't really feel like going to class on time so I made the mistake of starting an argument with her about the veracity of the Bible and why she feels the need to make everybody come to her church. But she just kept going ON and ON about how worshipping through Christ will give me a great sense of peace and hapiness and crap. Long story short, she asked me my name and phone number (both of which I gave her were completely fake) and she gave me a little info sheet which I chucked in the garbage 10 seconds later. Utter waste of 45 minutes.

I HATE Campus Crusade and all those other religious people (not just Christian) who feel the need to try and make you convert. These are the types of people that give their respective religions a bad name. Christianity I think is the worst of these religions cause their members are the most active on my campus as far as trying to "recruit" people. If you know anybody who's in one of these groups PLEASE PLEASE, give them a swift kick in the nuts. If they're female, just kick em in the @$$. If any of the aforementioned groups are listening:I hate you people with a passion. YOU make my life less happy. You idiots just can't learn to live and let live.

Next time just say:

"No thank you" and walk away.
 

Gurck

Banned
Mar 16, 2004
12,963
1
0
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: Gurck

I, and many others, hate evangelists. I feel that they do it because they're secretly very unhappy and insecure about their religion. There's strength in numbers, and adding to their ranks helps them to make the leap of "faith" that they can't quite make otherwise. Therefore I truly feel that both they and the world around them would be better off if they weren't there, and that I'd be doing both them and the world a favor by hastening their departure from this world. That's how it follows from your logic. You want me to tie your shoes for you too?
Damn I agree they can be as annoying as a rash on your bunghole but you really let them get to you. I always found them easy to avoid and never has one crashed any party I attended.

Not really, I get the occasional joho at my door and politely tell them no thanks. I've never gotten anything in return but a polite 'have a good one' as they go on their way. I'm arguing principle and paradigm here though; it's not cool, and the reason it continues is it's socially acceptable while the same thing but with any other religion (or lack thereof) is not. My half-experiment (wasn't my only reason, rest assured) yesterday proved this; I was branded a troll for a post discussing atheism by many of the same people who defended the nut for quoting the bible in another thread.
 

Connoisseur

Platinum Member
Sep 14, 2002
2,470
1
81
Everybody seems to think that it's the 45 minutes I wasted that's giving me the problem. I freely admit that the wasted time was my fault. That doesn't bother me one bit. The class time I was missing during this useless conversation was irrelevant to me. No, what made me angry was her message. She told me this message right from the start and I felt the need to defend my religion... and waste some time. So stop telling me: "The time you wasted was your fault". The time doesn't matter. I don't care about the time. I would gladly waste another 45 minutes in a conversation to skip class. The point is her message. I detest people who are so close minded as to think they're "saving" me from my religion. Exactly what the hell is wrong with Hinduism? I don't recall a clause where we're supposed to sacrifice children every Thursday? Or were we supposed to defecate on the bodies of our dead relatives? If that's the case, then I'm screwed. I don't understand why someone would come up to me trying to convert me from a religion that shares the same basic tenants of their own (be good, respect elders, don't kill, practice prayer etc. etc.) in favor of such an asinine reason as "But you've gotta do it through CHRIST or else it doesn't matter".
 

Gunslinger08

Lifer
Nov 18, 2001
13,234
2
81
Originally posted by: Connoisseur
Everybody seems to think that it's the 45 minutes I wasted that's giving me the problem. I freely admit that the wasted time was my fault. That doesn't bother me one bit. The class time I was missing during this useless conversation was irrelevant to me. No, what made me angry was her message. She told me this message right from the start and I felt the need to defend my religion... and waste some time. So stop telling me: "The time you wasted was your fault". The time doesn't matter. I don't care about the time. I would gladly waste another 45 minutes in a conversation to skip class. The point is her message. I detest people who are so close minded as to think they're "saving" me from my religion. Exactly what the hell is wrong with Hinduism? I don't recall a clause where we're supposed to sacrifice children every Thursday? Or were we supposed to defecate on the bodies of our dead relatives? If that's the case, then I'm screwed. I don't understand why someone would come up to me trying to convert me from a religion that shares the same basic tenants of their own (be good, respect elders, don't kill, practice prayer etc. etc.) in favor of such an asinine reason as "But you've gotta do it through CHRIST or else it doesn't matter".

Well, that's exactly the idea behind Christianity. Good morals are nice (which most major religions share), but being good and following tradition isn't really what Christianity is about. That's Judaism. Christians believe that they are only saved through the belief of Jesus as God, who bore a cross, was tortured, and died for their own sins. They believe that anyone who does not believe Christ died for them (personally) can not go to Heaven.

This is why Christians are evangelical.
 

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
22,994
779
126
I wonder if campus crusade knows the negative connotations of the word 'crusade', heh
 

Gurck

Banned
Mar 16, 2004
12,963
1
0
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Well, that's exactly the idea behind Christianity. Good morals are nice (which most major religions share), but being good and following tradition isn't really what Christianity is about. That's Judaism. Christians believe that they are only saved through the belief of Jesus as God, who bore a cross, was tortured, and died for their own sins. They believe that anyone who does not believe Christ died for them (personally) can not go to Heaven.

This is why Christians are evangelical.

Lol, doyou really tell yourself this? Christians are evangelical because at some point in the history of the religion, a shady individual or group associated with the church realized what power numbers held and pushed a radical interpretation of the bible which made it OK to preach & convert, often forcibly. Members, telling themselves they were doing good deeds, thrived on fulfilling the genetic impulse for power & control over others, and passed this down over time.
 

Gunslinger08

Lifer
Nov 18, 2001
13,234
2
81
Originally posted by: Gurck
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Well, that's exactly the idea behind Christianity. Good morals are nice (which most major religions share), but being good and following tradition isn't really what Christianity is about. That's Judaism. Christians believe that they are only saved through the belief of Jesus as God, who bore a cross, was tortured, and died for their own sins. They believe that anyone who does not believe Christ died for them (personally) can not go to Heaven.

This is why Christians are evangelical.

Lol, doyou really tell yourself this? Christians are evangelical because at some point in the history of the religion, a shady individual or group associated with the church realized what power numbers held and pushed a radical interpretation of the bible which made it OK to preach & convert, often forcibly. Members, telling themselves they were doing good deeds, thrived on fulfilling the genetic impulse for power & control over others, and passed this down over time.

NOTE: I am not a Christian, as stated earlier.

Have you actually studied Christianity and been to churches and spoken with Christian leaders? Learn before you judge.
 

Gurck

Banned
Mar 16, 2004
12,963
1
0
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Originally posted by: Gurck
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Well, that's exactly the idea behind Christianity. Good morals are nice (which most major religions share), but being good and following tradition isn't really what Christianity is about. That's Judaism. Christians believe that they are only saved through the belief of Jesus as God, who bore a cross, was tortured, and died for their own sins. They believe that anyone who does not believe Christ died for them (personally) can not go to Heaven.

This is why Christians are evangelical.

Lol, doyou really tell yourself this? Christians are evangelical because at some point in the history of the religion, a shady individual or group associated with the church realized what power numbers held and pushed a radical interpretation of the bible which made it OK to preach & convert, often forcibly. Members, telling themselves they were doing good deeds, thrived on fulfilling the genetic impulse for power & control over others, and passed this down over time.

NOTE: I am not a Christian, as stated earlier.

Have you actually studied Christianity and been to churches and spoken with Christian leaders? Learn before you judge.

Your religion isn't my concern and has no bearing on the discussion. I have indeed studied the unbiased history of christianity; it's a large factor in my above statement.
 

illustri

Golden Member
Mar 14, 2001
1,490
0
0
for all the faults i could list of the various sects of christianity, the stunning fact remains that comprised altogether, they form the largest "organized" religion in the world... for this alone you have to respect the tenacity of their mission

like many things in life, organized religion is a business scheme: increasing converts to the brand is expansion, ecumenicanism is merging, and the various protestant fragmentation is diversification, all work toward the benefit of the organization

always jesus, good to the last god, mohammed says just do it, like a good neighbor buddha is there, and krishna takes a licking and keeps on ticking
 

Gunslinger08

Lifer
Nov 18, 2001
13,234
2
81
Originally posted by: Gurck
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Originally posted by: Gurck
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Well, that's exactly the idea behind Christianity. Good morals are nice (which most major religions share), but being good and following tradition isn't really what Christianity is about. That's Judaism. Christians believe that they are only saved through the belief of Jesus as God, who bore a cross, was tortured, and died for their own sins. They believe that anyone who does not believe Christ died for them (personally) can not go to Heaven.

This is why Christians are evangelical.

Lol, doyou really tell yourself this? Christians are evangelical because at some point in the history of the religion, a shady individual or group associated with the church realized what power numbers held and pushed a radical interpretation of the bible which made it OK to preach & convert, often forcibly. Members, telling themselves they were doing good deeds, thrived on fulfilling the genetic impulse for power & control over others, and passed this down over time.

NOTE: I am not a Christian, as stated earlier.

Have you actually studied Christianity and been to churches and spoken with Christian leaders? Learn before you judge.

Your religion isn't my concern and has no bearing on the discussion. I have indeed studied the unbiased history of christianity; it's a large factor in my above statement.

Well then, you understand that 2nd Corinthians, which is the basis for evangelism, was written by Paul sometime between 50 and 70 A.D., long before the idea of a hierarchical Church (aka, the Catholic Church).
 

Gurck

Banned
Mar 16, 2004
12,963
1
0
Originally posted by: illustri
for all the faults i could list of the various sects of christianity, the stunning fact remains that comprised altogether, they form the largest "organized" religion in the world... for this alone you have to respect the tenacity of their mission
You do? :confused: I see them as a lot like AOL; preying on the weakminded. The two hold equal positions in their field (largest in the world).

like many things in life, organized religion is a business scheme: increasing converts to the brand is expansion, ecumenicanism is merging, and the various protestant fragmentation is diversification, all work toward the benefit of the organization
Agreed, pretty much my point. And, like a business with no restraint, christianity has turned to questionable tactics.
 

Isla

Elite member
Sep 12, 2000
7,749
2
0
I just tell them the story about the blind men and the elephant... about how they all were touching a different part of the elephant and argued about what it was. One thought it was a fan (the ear), one thought it was a tree (the leg), one thought it was a rope (the tail) one thought it was a great snake (the trunk). Then I tell them that I believe that each religion is experiencing their own point of view of what "God" is, and that I don't believe in arguing about it since it has everything to do with perception.

And if they don't leave me alone, I tell them to get their head out of the elephant's arse. :p ;)
 

eakers

Lifer
Aug 14, 2000
12,169
2
0
did the chapter of your school take part in the "i agree with <insert name here>" thing that happened at all the universities here in the fall?

god that was annoying.
 

Zenmervolt

Elite member
Oct 22, 2000
24,512
21
81
Originally posted by: Connoisseur
No, what made me angry was her message. She told me this message right from the start and I felt the need to defend my religion... and waste some time. So stop telling me: "The time you wasted was your fault". The time doesn't matter. ... The point is her message. I detest people who are so close minded as to think they're "saving" me from my religion.
You're exactly right. How dare she have faith and belief in her religion. How dare she feel that what she believes is right. Everything should be completely relative and we should know no right from wrong since what one person thinks is wrong another person might think is right.

I don't care what religion you are, if you believe _at all_ that _any_ other religion could possibly be correct, then you have no faith in your religion and therefore should not care if someone else thinks it's not right since by admitting non-exclusivity you are yourself admitting that your religion is not right. (And yes, this applies to Eastern religions as well, even Buddhism which, for all its inherent freedom, does say that the only way to escape from Samsara is the Eightfold Path.)

ZV
 

Isla

Elite member
Sep 12, 2000
7,749
2
0
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: Connoisseur
No, what made me angry was her message. She told me this message right from the start and I felt the need to defend my religion... and waste some time. So stop telling me: "The time you wasted was your fault". The time doesn't matter. ... The point is her message. I detest people who are so close minded as to think they're "saving" me from my religion.
You're exactly right. How dare she have faith and belief in her religion. How dare she feel that what she believes is right. Everything should be completely relative and we should know no right from wrong since what one person thinks is wrong another person might think is right.

I don't care what religion you are, if you believe _at all_ that _any_ other religion could possibly be correct, then you have no faith in your religion and therefore should not care if someone else thinks it's not right since by admitting non-exclusivity you are yourself admitting that your religion is not right. (And yes, this applies to Eastern religions as well, even Buddhism which, for all its inherent freedom, does say that the only way to escape from Samsara is the Eightfold Path.)

ZV


Actually, this works great for me because I believe that we all want to connect with something Greater and that we all come from a perspective that is shaped by the culture/ethnicity we grew up in. That IS my religion... to do my best based on the experiences I am given, and have faith that others will try to do the same, and not worry whether or not any of us is 'correct'.

:)
 

illustri

Golden Member
Mar 14, 2001
1,490
0
0
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: Connoisseur
No, what made me angry was her message. She told me this message right from the start and I felt the need to defend my religion... and waste some time. So stop telling me: "The time you wasted was your fault". The time doesn't matter. ... The point is her message. I detest people who are so close minded as to think they're "saving" me from my religion.
You're exactly right. How dare she have faith and belief in her religion. How dare she feel that what she believes is right. Everything should be completely relative and we should know no right from wrong since what one person thinks is wrong another person might think is right.

I don't care what religion you are, if you believe _at all_ that _any_ other religion could possibly be correct, then you have no faith in your religion and therefore should not care if someone else thinks it's not right since by admitting non-exclusivity you are yourself admitting that your religion is not right. (And yes, this applies to Eastern religions as well, even Buddhism which, for all its inherent freedom, does say that the only way to escape from Samsara is the Eightfold Path.)

ZV

thats a crock of crap, you don't need to disparage another's religion to have faith in your own, you don't need to pretend your neighbor is wrong just because your beliefs are so weak they don't withstand competition