I fixed the ATI 9800 garbled screen problem tonight...

[JTJB]

Hello all, I fixed the ATI 9800 garbled screen problem tonight.

This problem has plagued me for quite sometime as I could run the card flawlessly at boot up most times, but it seemed that if I even breathed on the card or brushed it in the slightest, the screen would get garbled. I grabbed the card while it was running in the PC and I could easily manipulate the intensity of the garbled pixels on my video display by simply flexing the PCB in the motherboard while it was running. This led me to one conclusion. Poor solder contact somewhere on the card.

I removed the fan and heatsink from the card and placed it into a PREHEATED oven set to 385F (solder melts around 364F). I left the video card in the oven until I could smell the solder fumes PLUS another five minutes for good measure. I then shut the oven off, opened the door and let it cool down. After that, I re-applied thermal paste to the GPU and heatsink, re-attached the fan and plugged it in. Viola! NO MORE GARBLED SCREEN!!

NOTE: DO NOT AGITATE YOUR OVEN AT ANYTIME DURING THE BAKING PROCESS AS YOU CAN EASILY DISLODGE A COMPONENT WHILE THE SOLDER IS VISCOUS!!

In all fairness, I got my "oven" idea from other people on the net having success fixing their XBOX 360's Red Ring Of Death (RROD) problems by wrapping them in a towel for 20 minutes causing them to internally overheat and cause the low quality solder all over the motherboard to remelt and fuse any "cold solder" joints that had cracked from frequent cooling and heating cycles back to the mainboard.

I suspect this series of video cards was prone to cold solder joint cracking, similar to what MANY XBOX 360's have been experiencing

 

[lavaheadache]

lol, nothing like home cooking.... Reminds me of the blanket trick I performed on my 360.... worked like a charm

 

[Spikesoldier]

thats awesome, im going to remember this one for my bag of tricks when things go wrong.

 

[lavaheadache]

Originally posted by: lavaheadache
lol, nothing like home cooking.... Reminds me of the blanket trick I performed on my 360.... worked like a charm

edit*** how did the plastic on the vga and dvi connectors hold up to the heat?

 

[JTJB]

Good Question Lava,

There was absolutely ZERO deviation of the plastics physical properties.

 

[Quiksilver]

Yeah.... this thread needs a giant "WARNING: DO NOT TRY THIS AT HOME, IF YOU DO AND YOU FUCK UP I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE" warning...

 

[JTJB]

If one is skeptical, simply dig an old card whether it is a PCI video, modem, network, etc, out of your component junk drawer with some plastic connectors on it and try it first if you are nervous.

Look, if you are reading a forum like this for hardware solutions you are not some guy who buys assembled PC's from Dell or Best Buy and drops it off at the whiz kids house next door when he gets it full of spyware.

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: JTJB
Look, if you are reading a forum like this for hardware solutions you are not some guy who buys assembled PC's from Dell or Best Buy and drops it off at the whiz kids house next door when he gets it full of spyware.

Actually I think we DO have some people here who aren't tech wizards.

 

[JTJB]

One more note to those who are considering this solution:

YOU MUST remove the heatsink/fan assembly BEFORE placing it in the oven.

This is NOT an option!

The pressure exerted by the fasteners holding the heatsink to the GPU would pull the GPU to the board as soon as the solder melted effectively welding your GPU to the PCB in a nice puddle of solder.

The chips on these video cards are attached via ball grid array "BGA". The GPU and the memory modules sit atop tiny balls of solder, there are NO little pins that go into the PCB, hence there is very little contact area between the board and the chippery. This is why cold solder joints tend to occur from this form of technology.

New Bell / Dish network satellite receivers are now using BGA as it makes it very hard for hackers to follow traces from point A to point B and "patch" in to their mainboards because the TSOPS have no little "legs" sticking out of them like they used to.

BGA also saves precious space on PCB's by negating the "legs" so you can expect to see more and more of this technology as components shrink smaller.

 

[tigersty1e]

Hmmm. Is this a joke or spoof thread?

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: tigersty1e
Hmmm. Is this a joke or spoof thread?

I'm an electronic design engineer, and it sounds legit. The plastic used in components that are intended to be soldered is spec'd to withstand soldering temperatures but BE CAREFUL! The OP's solution may work, but today's lead free, RoHS compliant, soldering systems are NOT your father's soldering tank or iron.

1. There are several lead free solder formulas and fabrication procedures. None of them is yet as reliable as good old tin-lead solder, and each system has its own nominal melting point and it's own manufacturing and reliablity problems.
   
2. Various plastic parts are spec'd to withstand a maximum temperature for a maximum time. If such parts are heated beyond their rated temps, or if they are heated too long, even without exceeding their max temp, they may fail.

The OP's baking method worked for his card, and it may work for yours, as long as you don't exceed the maximum temp or exposure time for the solder and the components on your card, but as with overclocking, proceed at your own risk.

The difference, here, is that, unlike O/C'ing, you're trying to rescue/repair a failing product, instead of risking damaging a known good one so it may be worth trying. If possible, try to learn more about the solder and the components on your card before attempting this. You may be able to make better judgments about times and temps if you know their limits.

After that, all I can say is, good luck.

 

[livingsacrifice]

This sounds legit, I've done the same thing with my xbox 360 motherboard and it's an attempted fix for the RROD which has something to do wtih the GPU and the soldering points.

 

[JTJB]

This was a used, defective card given too me from my brother in law. These things are dated to 2005, no RMA available.

He built a new system, and could not be bothered with trouble shooting the old 9800 card. I being inquisitive, played with it a couple of times in the last year by fiddling with extra fans, lapping the heatsink, etc...but to no positive effect. Last night was when I had the brainstorm to "bake it".

I said bake it until you smell the solder, not melting plastic. The card was in the oven for approx. 8 minutes at full 385F until I hit the "off" button on the stove. The plastic they use on these cards is heat stabilized thermal plastic (VGA, DVI, Molex connector).

Remember, this is hot air, that is exactly what they use when fabricating these products. "Hot air solder stations" are commercially used for the installation/removal of integrated circuits on PCB's.

Anyways, I now have a working 9800 Pro with 2 video outs in my HTPC box instead of a 9600 AIW XT with only 1 video out that was there before. This is better for my setup as I needed the DVI out for my Optoma projector and the VGA out for my 17" monitor mounted in my component rack in an adjacent room that does not have visual sight of the movie screen.

 

[DSF]

Hmm...I think I threw my 9800 away when it crapped out on me. If not, maybe I'll try this.

 

[NYHoustonman]

I have mine lying right in front of me.

Preheating the oven now...

What orientation (gpu side-up, down, etc) should I use?

 

[Sylvanas]

Haha great thread! I'll keep this in mind if I encounter this problem with the 'old' tin solder cards.

 

[JTJB]

I baked mine GPU side up on a perforated aluminum pizza pan.

Don't worry about the chippery on the bottom falling off when the solder reaches melting point as there is a meniscus layer with solder similar to water which will keep it bonded to the card.

 

[JTJB]

Well, just over 24 hours and it started garbling again dammit! Started all by itself while I was D/L with Utorrent. Will bake again only this time longer. Nothing to lose at this point. Sorry I spoke too soon. This card would NEVER have run before I baked it without garbled images except at boot up by like I said, one touch to the case or Video cord and it was scrambled pixels! Back to the drawing board...

 

[NYHoustonman]

Yea, mine had the same exact problem.

However, at this point it's garbled at boot, and it's making some kind of ugly noise (I'm thinking a capacitor about to blow). I'm not sure if it was the baking or if it 'died' further sitting on my desk over the past year, but hey, it was worth a shot . One of the more interesting ideas I had ever heard.

 

[watek]

haha, you guys try anything to revive hardware.

 

[Oyeve]

Ovens have many uses. I fixed warped vinly records by placing the record between 2 sheets of glas and popping in the oven for a coupla mins. Vinly gets soft, flattens, take out and let cool. perfectly flat record. Or big black gloop if you leave it in too long.

 

[v8envy]

Maybe sprinkling chocolate chips on the boards would help? I hear pink frosting fixes everything too.