I don't get the fuss over the Veyron

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: BouZouki
The Veryron is an engineering masterpiece.

You do understand that every art chosen on that car is the most expensive...even if it's not necessary. How do you think they racked up a 5 million dollar cost on a car they sell for 1 million? Oh, like every European car, you must be paying for the "name"

The car is ridiculously expensive, needlessly overdesigned and overcomplicated, and excessive in every way. That's exactly the point of such a car.

You could say "Oh, the parts will wear and break in the 20 year life span but wait....

All the parts are designed from the ground up for 1000+ hp with a huge factor of safety in mind. The stresses encountered when flooring the W16 are relatively no more than flooring your average 130 hp 4-banger. That's the greatest challenge in the whole project...build something so immensely powerful and still meet design and life standards of a luxury auto.

20 years is an ambitious goal, but I have no dounbt the car will stand up to punishment better than basically anything. It's built like a tank.

When you hop up a Viper or Corvette motor to 1000 hp, it is unavoidable that you will exceed the safety factors for certain parts. There are limitations that you cannot avoid unless you "start from scratch". The chassis was never designed with that power in mind. Anything you do to make it work is really a band aid.

When you look at it from a practical standpoint though, the Veyron IS an overkill as no one will EVER run it as hard as it's designed to be run. This is why you can tune a Corvette or Viper to run at those power levels as it's all but impossible to use that power for more than a few seconds or maybe a minute on end.





Bottom line, the Veyron is in a different league than ANY other car out there.

Point taken.

 

[Sureshot324]

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: Sureshot324
I'm not that impressed either. Any car company could make 1000 hp with an 8 litre engine and 4 turbos. However, Bugatti needed to make the car almost as wide as a hummer and over 4000 lbs to do it.

Really, then why hasn't there been a production company that has done this before? I suppose it's easy to play armchair engineer and criticize the reasoning for the vehicle's weight and dimensions.

AFAIK, nobody every bothered to make a factory car with an engine that big and forced induction, because there is just no point to it. It's not a track car. It would get owned by a 600hp enzo on the track, and to have much more than 500hp on a road car is comletely useless. Drag racers get over 7000hp with an engine similarly large as the veyron. I'm sure they could make a version that runs on regular gasoline and would be street legal and still have way more than 1000hp, but why would you do it?

Tuners have been able to get 1000hp out of smaller engines like nissan skylines, supras, corvettes, etc.

 

[LordMorpheus]

Its like the concord. No real place for it in today's world, but that doesn't make it less of a marvel. It's a bit like the old McLaren F1 - the faster car in the world that you never get to own. Except its much, much, much better in nearly every regard - speed, handling, comfort, etc.

 

[pray4mojo]

I'm more impressed by Marko's Supra. A street legal 1520rwhp 8.45 second car.

 

[SportSC4]

Ugh... I love crazy souped up cars... but how can people compare the Veyron to a Hennesey Viper or even Marko's Supra? Those cars aren't designed to last for 20+ years. How many of those cars are street driveable? How many of those stripped out cars would pass a government collision test? How many of those cars wouldn't lose control at 200+? The Mclaren could hit 241 mph but it felt like you would lose control at those speeds whereas the Veyron supposedly (from those that have driven it) still feels solid.

The Veyron isn't meant to compare with what you can afford because it's in a totally different league. That's like saying; I don't see what's nice about Bill Gates's house, I've been in houses a tenth of the size that are nice. If it was so easy to do it, don't you think that other car companies would have done it? Or even companies that modify cars for a living?

So yes, drag cars will kill it in the quarter. Track cars will kill it on a track. A geo metro will kill it on fuel consumption. The space shuttle has more horsepower. Cars designed to run on the Utah salt flats will kill it with top speed. The Rolls Royce might have a nicer interior (kinda doubtful since the Veryron has knobs that cost 4k). A Toyota camry is probably more reliable and safer in impacts. But can any of these cars beat the overall package the Veyron delivers?

I'm not trying to change anyone's mind, but the thing is; if you don't get the fuss then you simply don't get it at all.

 

Originally posted by: Sureshot324

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: Sureshot324
I'm not that impressed either. Any car company could make 1000 hp with an 8 litre engine and 4 turbos. However, Bugatti needed to make the car almost as wide as a hummer and over 4000 lbs to do it.

Really, then why hasn't there been a production company that has done this before? I suppose it's easy to play armchair engineer and criticize the reasoning for the vehicle's weight and dimensions.

AFAIK, nobody every bothered to make a factory car with an engine that big and forced induction, because there is just no point to it. It's not a track car. It would get owned by a 600hp enzo on the track, and to have much more than 500hp on a road car is comletely useless. Drag racers get over 7000hp with an engine similarly large as the veyron. I'm sure they could make a version that runs on regular gasoline and would be street legal and still have way more than 1000hp, but why would you do it?

Tuners have been able to get 1000hp out of smaller engines like nissan skylines, supras, corvettes, etc.

Since you were clueless in this thread about top fuel dragster transmission, I would have to say you really dont have much of an idea of what you're talking about.

How do you figure it would get its ass handed to it by an enzo on the track? Do you have any information or well, anything to back that up?

Top fuel dragsters run Nitromethane for fuel, if you detuned a topfuel engine for road specs you wouldn't have way more than 1000hp. It takes around 500-800hp just to drive the huge supercharger on the dragsters. You remove everything that makes the engine a topfuel engine and it's not very spectacular like the veyron engine.

Why would you even compare topfuel dragsters to a veyron anyway?

As for people taking smaller engines and pushing 1000hp out of them, it takes a huge rebuild from the ground up, and even then the engine and components of the car arn't designed to handle that type of power and speeds.

 

[Sureshot324]

Originally posted by: SampSon

Originally posted by: Sureshot324

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: Sureshot324
I'm not that impressed either. Any car company could make 1000 hp with an 8 litre engine and 4 turbos. However, Bugatti needed to make the car almost as wide as a hummer and over 4000 lbs to do it.

Really, then why hasn't there been a production company that has done this before? I suppose it's easy to play armchair engineer and criticize the reasoning for the vehicle's weight and dimensions.

AFAIK, nobody every bothered to make a factory car with an engine that big and forced induction, because there is just no point to it. It's not a track car. It would get owned by a 600hp enzo on the track, and to have much more than 500hp on a road car is comletely useless. Drag racers get over 7000hp with an engine similarly large as the veyron. I'm sure they could make a version that runs on regular gasoline and would be street legal and still have way more than 1000hp, but why would you do it?

Tuners have been able to get 1000hp out of smaller engines like nissan skylines, supras, corvettes, etc.

Since you were clueless in this thread about top fuel dragster transmission, I would have to say you really dont have much of an idea of what you're talking about.

How do you figure it would get its ass handed to it by an enzo on the track? Do you have any information or well, anything to back that up?

Top fuel dragsters run Nitromethane for fuel, if you detuned a topfuel engine for road specs you wouldn't have way more than 1000hp. It takes around 500-800hp just to drive the huge supercharger on the dragsters. You remove everything that makes the engine a topfuel engine and it's not very spectacular like the veyron engine.

Why would you even compare topfuel dragsters to a veyron anyway?

As for people taking smaller engines and pushing 1000hp out of them, it takes a huge rebuild from the ground up, and even then the engine and components of the car arn't designed to handle that type of power and speeds.

Ok the dragster probably wasn't the best comparison. The point I'm trying to make is there's nothing particularly impressive about a 1000hp engine. It's hardly an engineering marvel. Yes it's the first anyone bothered to make a road car that powerful, but there's a good reason for that: It's useless for a roadcar to have 1000hp other than bragging rights (which is exactly the purpose of the Veyron).

The Hennesey Viper has the same amount of power, same engine size, same performance numbers, 1/5 the price, and like the Veyron, is managable as a daily driver. What makes the Veyron more impressive?

 

[boyRacer]

I see another car thread has degraded into another one of these things...

I don't find the car appealing too... I think it's damn impressive... but the front grill reminds me of someone's helmet. 😕

 

[CFster]

I think the car is obscene myself.

Well, actually the fact that they're mass producing it (what, 35 a year?).

I understand it costs VW 5 million to build one, but they sell it for 1 million. They lose a tone of cash on every one they sell, in the interest of some kind of excercise. So what's the point. For a car company that's halfway down the sh1tter, why would they do it.

Plus, I agree with the poster that said it would get owned by an Enzo on the track. Well, I suppose it depends on the track. If it was a horsepower circuit such as Monza or Spa I don't think anything could catch it. However, on the Top Gear test track I think it would get it's fat ass (4000lbs) handed to it by any number of cars. You can talk all you want about all wheel drive, fat rubber and skidpad figures - but when it comes down to it, it's portly weight is going to hinder it. It will be interesting to see what it does when they finally let Top Gear test it.

We see it all the time in SCCA racing. Our Spec Miatas regularly turn faster lap times than many Porsches and Corvettes at tight tracks like Limerock.

FWIW, if I was to buy a supercar it would be the Pagani Zonda S all the way.

 

[overst33r]

Originally posted by: CFster
I think the car is obscene myself.

Well, actually the fact that they're mass producing it (what, 35 a year?).

I understand it costs VW 5 million to build one, but they sell it for 1 million. They lose a tone of cash on every one they sell, in the interest of some kind of excercise. So what's the point. For a car company that's halfway down the sh1tter, why would they do it.

Plus, I agree with the poster that said it would get owned by an Enzo on the track. Well, I suppose it depends on the track. If it was a horsepower circuit such as Monza or Spa I don't think anything could catch it. However, on the Top Gear test track I think it would get it's fat ass (4000lbs) handed to it by any number of cars. You can talk all you want about all wheel drive, fat rubber and skidpad figures - but when it comes down to it, it's portly weight is going to hinder it. It will be interesting to see what it does when they finally let Top Gear test it.

We see it all the time in SCCA racing. Our Spec Miatas regularly turn faster lap times than many Porsches and Corvettes at tight tracks like Limerock.

FWIW, if I was to buy a supercar it would be the Pagani Zonda S all the way.

not the pagani F?

 

[CFster]

Originally posted by: mariok2006

Originally posted by: CFster
I think the car is obscene myself.

Well, actually the fact that they're mass producing it (what, 35 a year?).

I understand it costs VW 5 million to build one, but they sell it for 1 million. They lose a tone of cash on every one they sell, in the interest of some kind of excercise. So what's the point. For a car company that's halfway down the sh1tter, why would they do it.

Plus, I agree with the poster that said it would get owned by an Enzo on the track. Well, I suppose it depends on the track. If it was a horsepower circuit such as Monza or Spa I don't think anything could catch it. However, on the Top Gear test track I think it would get it's fat ass (4000lbs) handed to it by any number of cars. You can talk all you want about all wheel drive, fat rubber and skidpad figures - but when it comes down to it, it's portly weight is going to hinder it. It will be interesting to see what it does when they finally let Top Gear test it.

We see it all the time in SCCA racing. Our Spec Miatas regularly turn faster lap times than many Porsches and Corvettes at tight tracks like Limerock.

FWIW, if I was to buy a supercar it would be the Pagani Zonda S all the way.

not the pagani F?

Sure!

 

[Apex]

Originally posted by: CFster
I think the car is obscene myself.

Well, actually the fact that they're mass producing it (what, 35 a year?).

I understand it costs VW 5 million to build one, but they sell it for 1 million. They lose a tone of cash on every one they sell, in the interest of some kind of excercise. So what's the point. For a car company that's halfway down the sh1tter, why would they do it.

Plus, I agree with the poster that said it would get owned by an Enzo on the track. Well, I suppose it depends on the track. If it was a horsepower circuit such as Monza or Spa I don't think anything could catch it. However, on the Top Gear test track I think it would get it's fat ass (4000lbs) handed to it by any number of cars. You can talk all you want about all wheel drive, fat rubber and skidpad figures - but when it comes down to it, it's portly weight is going to hinder it. It will be interesting to see what it does when they finally let Top Gear test it.

We see it all the time in SCCA racing. Our Spec Miatas regularly turn faster lap times than many Porsches and Corvettes at tight tracks like Limerock.

FWIW, if I was to buy a supercar it would be the Pagani Zonda S all the way.

I have simpler tastes. Koenigsegg CCR for me, thanks. 🙂

Koenigsegg CCR

 

[CFster]

Oh yeah, the Koeniseggeggeggeegggegeeggggeggg!

 

[eelw]

I don't care for the look of the Veyron or the ME. Now the SLR McLaren that is just plain sexy though.

 

[mAdD INDIAN]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Everyone oohs and aahs over this car but it is ridiculously expensive and very limited in production. 95% of us will never even see one and I'd venture to say that 100% of us (or very very close to it) will never ever drive one let alone own one.

Yet I see this car plastered all over the web and the automotive rags. I give it a solid meh.

It's the engineering behind it.

Its the automotive equivalent of some geek ordering his engineers to create a 20Ghz CPU that only dissappates 35W and is half the size of a current CPU. Oh and it must last for 20 years without any failure.

That is what VAG's top dog told his company. He said build a car that makes 1000hp, does over 250mph, and looks like what the Veyron is today. Oh and it should be daily drivable, comfortable in that mode, and reliable (ie: last more than 200km).

And that is what they built.

I, too, didn't see the point of it until I read more about it. The sheer performance of that car is mind blowing, from its acceleration in all gears under all different speeds, to the way it handles and restraints weight transfer in tight corners, to the driveability of the drivetrain in low speeds, etc...

It's an engineering wet dream, really. Much like how hte original McLaren F1 was, although that car had a different purpose....but it still embodies the same basic design principles as the Veyron.

The Veyron is essentially the product of a big blank check, a white peice of paper, and an entire company's resources directed at building the most extravagent vehicle they could that would meet imaginary performance figures.

It turned out those figures weren't that imaginary anymore.