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i discriminate against people that behave badly.

P

PlatinumGold

Lifer
does that make me a bad person??

so what is the difference between discriminating against "bad" behavior vs discriminating against color of skin?

aren't both discrimination and as such be made illegal?
 
This is what I call "Good Discrimination."

You're not actually suggesting that you shouldn't discriminate against assholes, are you?
 
well against skin color you can also be including honest/good ppl. somewhat same then again somewhat different. well teach your kids whats right and hopefully they will make good dicisions.
 
If those naughty black kids are naughty because they are black then you are a bigot.

If they are naughty because of "the man" then you are an enlightened citizen.


/me prepares flame suit
 
Unless you break a law where discrimination played as a purpose, then you're totally fine.

I personally don't want my kids making friends with the wrong crowd and all that means is that I am protective like 85%+ of all American parents 🙂
 
In one instance you are presuming everyone is bad based upon a skin color which is wholly untrue and absurd. By judging someone by their previous behavior, on the other hand, you are making an assessment based upon their character rather than their ethnicity. The two are not even closely related.
 
Discrimination against a person for something over which that person has no control over is wrong. That's the way I see it. That doesn't include behavior.
 
Originally posted by: bradruth
This is what I call "Good Discrimination."

You're not actually suggesting that you shouldn't discriminate against assholes, are you?
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but how do i decide someone is not worthy to hang out with my son?? one temper tantrum? 2 tantrums?

whethor it be 1 or 2, am i not still generalizing specific behavior patterns to the whole??

so let's say there are a series of behaviors in children that i simply will not tolerate, does that make me a bigot against those characteristics??

is the difference between a bigot and an enlightened parent simply how complicated their generalizations are?

if this behavior not acceptable unless this behavior which would not be acceptable with behavior c . . .

where as saying, black people are unacceptable.

is the only difference that one is complicated hence correct and the other is simple hence wrong?

this is a serious question because i AM discriminating about who my children can and cannot associate with. i expect certain things from my kids and i don't want them associating with kids that will detract from that.
 
Specific tantrums/instances shouldn't be the only thing you're judging on. You should be able to get an overall impression as to the character of these kids, just like you would from anyone else. Of course these "tantrums" would factor in, but they would just be a part of the whole judgement.

Think of it this way. You meet someone your age, through work or recreation, whatever. You get an impression of their character and decide whether or not they're the sort of person you'd like to know/hang around. Just do the same basic thing, but with your kids in mind. If they're little bastards that you don't want your kids near, act accordingly.
 
Originally posted by: cKGunslinger
Discrimination against a person for something over which that person has no control over is wrong. That's the way I see it. That doesn't include behavior.
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who says children have control over their behavior??

there was this one kid at our church who was always exceeding boisterous, picked fights, was fidgety etc.

discovered that he was allergic to soy and his parents were ignoring it. this kids legs were always welted and red, because the korean diet is FULL of soy, most koreans can't even conceive of eating without soy products, soy sauce, danjang, tofu . . .

so, would the discrimination against this kid been premature?? my son and i talked a lot about this kid because they are literally 2 days apart in age. they are close friends now, but it took my son a long time to understand this kids behavior.
 
Originally posted by: bradruth
Specific tantrums/instances shouldn't be the only thing you're judging on. You should be able to get an overall impression as to the character of these kids, just like you would from anyone else. Of course these "tantrums" would factor in, but they would just be a part of the whole judgement.

Think of it this way. You meet someone your age, through work or recreation, whatever. You get an impression of their character and decide whether or not they're the sort of person you'd like to know/hang around. Just do the same basic thing, but with your kids in mind. If they're little bastards that you don't want your kids near, act accordingly.
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but ultimately you are judging a person, making a determination about a person based on incomplete information. you cannot say conclusively that if you had 100% of the information, every decision you made about people for the last howver many years of your life would all be the same.

we always make GENERALIZATIONS based on incomplete information. generalizing about a group of people based on the color of their skin is just one aspect of this tendency.

is it true that black people in general have many things in common?? if so, than you cannot say that generalizing about them is wrong. is it true that asians in general have many many things in common? yes, of course its true.
 
Originally posted by: PlatinumGold
but ultimately you are judging a person, making a determination about a person based on incomplete information. you cannot say conclusively that if you had 100% of the information, every decision you made about people for the last howver many years of your life would all be the same.

we always make GENERALIZATIONS based on incomplete information. generalizing about a group of people based on the color of their skin is just one aspect of this tendency.

is it true that black people in general have many things in common?? if so, than you cannot say that generalizing about them is wrong. is it true that asians in general have many many things in common? yes, of course its true.
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But in those cases you're generalizing based on unchangable physical appearance, which is ignorant, narrow-minded thinking. There's no way to get "100% of the information" about somebody, even if you spend your entire life with them. You might be able to predict how they'll react & what they do most of the time, but people are dynamic creatures and can be extremely unpredictable.

Basically by judging someone you're playing the percentages. Again, you think you know how they'll act/behave but you can't be entirely sure. Discrimination has turned into such a bad word because people automatically think of race. By discriminating based on personality you're doing so based on who that person is.

Just remember that this person is still a kid, and is more subject to change. Don't reserve your judgement in stone for eternity. If he displays better behavior, shift your judgement as well.
 
There are certain things that can be figured about a person based solely on his appearance. For instance, if you saw someone wearing a leather "Hell's Angels" jacket, you might assume he rode a Harley-Davidson Motorcycle, or if you saw someone wearing a red bandana with the roman numerals "XIV" tattooed on his arm, you might assume he was a gang member. Or, if you saw someone with black skin, you might assume he liked playing dominos. These are all generalizations that hold a certain degree of truth, butt here are exceptions to every rule. Many times, you can make pretty accurate judgements based solely on the appearances of people, especially when they make certain characteristics very obvious. IMO, it's perfectly OK to discriminate who you (or your children) associates with based solely on these types of traits. You have no obligation to associate with anyone, regardless of what they look like. You have no right to act offensively towards these people until they actually demonstrate certain behavior, but I see absolutely nothing wrong with avoiding them based on thier looks, if they seemto exhibit traits you find unappealing.
 
Dude, protect your children, PLEASE!!!

Don't mind what others think or say, it's your job to bring them up safely. Other parents let their kids run throughout our neighborhood with no curfew, don't be like that.
 
Originally posted by: PlatinumGold
does that make me a bad person??

so what is the difference between discriminating against "bad" behavior vs discriminating against color of skin?

aren't both discrimination and as such be made illegal?
Click to expand...
Discrimination isn't illegal. You can dislike or out-right hate anyone or any group of people for any reason you want - be it based on gender, race, maturity, sexual preference, intelligence, whatever. You can choose to not be friends with someone or let your children associate with a certain group. You can get up and leave a crowded restaurant if you see someone you don't like. That's *your* right. And as long as you don't take away any rights from anyone else, things are ok. You will not be arrested for your hatred or bias. You *may* have to put up with the scorn and reciprocated hatred that falls back on you, but that's legal as well.

I guess I don't see the point of this thread? Are you saying that if I don't let my kids hang around dope-smoking punks, I am being discriminating? The answer is yes, I am. Is that illegal? No. Is it wrong? No. "Wrongness" is based on personal beliefs, so as long as I believe I am right, there is no problem, right?
 
Originally posted by: Atomicus
Unless you break a law where discrimination played as a purpose, then you're totally fine.
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I don't know if I understand this, can you give an example of how a parent could break a law regarding discrimination. Sure businesses can, but hate crimes are the only laws I know of regarding discrimination by John Q. Public.
 
How many threads are you going to make about this stuff? You must be the most annoying parent ever. Newsflash: You cannot shelter your kids. Wait until they are teens. You are going to push them away and alienate them.

Or don't. I don't really care.
 
Originally posted by: PlatinumGold
does that make me a bad person??

so what is the difference between discriminating against "bad" behavior vs discriminating against color of skin?

aren't both discrimination and as such be made illegal?
Click to expand...

Think about the analogous situation of hiring someone for a job. Is it discrimination to hire the best qualified person? Whether the type of discrimination is relevant to the person's qualifications for the situation at hand is the core of the difference.
 
Originally posted by: CPA
Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

aren't both discrimination and as such be made illegal?
Click to expand...

huh? you actually think that?
Click to expand...

or course not. i'm just mocking those that do. the politcally correct.

Originally posted by: VaeVictus
How many threads are you going to make about this stuff? You must be the most annoying parent ever. Newsflash: You cannot shelter your kids. Wait until they are teens. You are going to push them away and alienate them.

Or don't. I don't really care.
Click to expand...

how many threads have i made on this stuff?

so you find this stuff somehow more annoying or offensive than the majority of stuff posted on ATOT?
 
Originally posted by: VaeVictus
How many threads are you going to make about this stuff? You must be the most annoying parent ever. Newsflash: You cannot shelter your kids. Wait until they are teens. You are going to push them away and alienate them.

Or don't. I don't really care.
Click to expand...

That's the exact type of thinking that has made kids they way they are today. Too much "Oh, don't hurt little Johnny's feelings. You must not tell them what to do or how to think." HOGWASH!
 
Originally posted by: PlatinumGold
Originally posted by: CPA
Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

aren't both discrimination and as such be made illegal?
Click to expand...

huh? you actually think that?
Click to expand...

or course not. i'm just mocking those that do. the politcally correct.
Click to expand...

I didn't think so, just wanted to make sure.
 
Originally posted by: VaeVictus
How many threads are you going to make about this stuff? You must be the most annoying parent ever. Newsflash: You cannot shelter your kids. Wait until they are teens. You are going to push them away and alienate them.

Or don't. I don't really care.
Click to expand...

Obviously spoken by someone who isn't a parent.

You're doing the right thing... AND, children learn their values while they're younger, not when they're teenagers. Hopefully as well as preventing your children from hanging out with the wrong crowd, they understand WHY they aren't allowed to play with certain types of individuals. Once children are teenagers, it's too late. You basically provide them with food and shelter til they're 18. You can't "control" per se what they do, but can give them guidelines (rules) as to what's acceptable at this stage of life and what's not. ex) now that they're older, 10pm curfew on school nights (rather than 8pm bedtime when they were in 2nd grade)

If your children are raised well, then you won't have to worry about "pushing them away" when they are teens. Children who have always been given what they want, etc. aren't about to suddenly change when they're teens - those are the children who, when FINALLY faced with some rules, are pushed away.
 
Originally posted by: DrPizza
Originally posted by: VaeVictus
How many threads are you going to make about this stuff? You must be the most annoying parent ever. Newsflash: You cannot shelter your kids. Wait until they are teens. You are going to push them away and alienate them.

Or don't. I don't really care.
Click to expand...

Obviously spoken by someone who isn't a parent.

You're doing the right thing... AND, children learn their values while they're younger, not when they're teenagers. Hopefully as well as preventing your children from hanging out with the wrong crowd, they understand WHY they aren't allowed to play with certain types of individuals. Once children are teenagers, it's too late. You basically provide them with food and shelter til they're 18. You can't "control" per se what they do, but can give them guidelines (rules) as to what's acceptable at this stage of life and what's not. ex) now that they're older, 10pm curfew on school nights (rather than 8pm bedtime when they were in 2nd grade)

If your children are raised well, then you won't have to worry about "pushing them away" when they are teens. Children who have always been given what they want, etc. aren't about to suddenly change when they're teens - those are the children who, when FINALLY faced with some rules, are pushed away.
Click to expand...

agreed. i have gotten into many discussions, here and in person regarding spankings.

it has always been my belief that spanking is one form of communication. i used it when i felt it would be most effective (when my children were very young) now i don't ever spank them, even my 4 yr old as they have learned that there are limits to what's allowable.

the idea that freedom = no limits is just moronic. our greatest freedoms come when we learn that there are limits, there are limits to our time, there are limits to our abilities and there are limits to the types of behavior that is acceptable.

one thing that annoys me more than any other is watching parents with kids in public situations. the kids show signs of dissatisfaction or discomfort and the parents ignore them, these signs grow in intensity and in volume, finally at the point the parent can no longer tolerate it, these parents lose their temper and go OFF on their kids. to me, this is not disciplining kids, this shows a remarkable lack of discipline on the part of the parent.

discipling and raising kids is a 24 hr / day proposition. it isn't something you do only when you are angry or when they misbehave. it is molding and structuring them.

it's obvious in my mind that vaevictus has no experience raising kids.
 
Oh, one thing I'd point out is to NOT teach your children to discriminate based on how someone looks (as someone above alluded to.) Teach your children to judge by character. If you're unsure of their friends, take the time to have their friends over to your house playing with your children. Don't judge the other kids by their parents either... It's unfortunate that that's how most parents do it. Thus, those children with douchebags as parents are doomed by the stereotypical views of the community to follow in their parents' paths. Give the kids a chance. (but, of course, don't have your children playing at the houses of known "bad" people. ) But, again, even if the parents of the other children are crackheads - this does NOT mean that their children are bad. At least give those kids a little bit of a fighting chance at a decent life, rather than doom them to be surrounded by nothing but crackheads their entire lives and turn out to be one as well. I coached youth soccer and had a couple of kids from families like that. They were wonderful kids. They just needed positive role models and responsible adults around them. Don't doom them to spending 100% of their time with families like their own parents.
 
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