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I’m a cop. If you don’t want to get hurt, don’t challenge me.

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Feb 10, 2000
30,031
66
91
I have dealt with a lot of police over the years, including as a prosecutor, a criminal defense attorney, as a lawyer handling police civil rights cases on both the plaintiff's and defense sides, and as a subject of investigation (in a traffic context).

My sense is that police, as a whole, are no better or worse than anyone else, but it is a profession that is unusually unlikely to attract people whose intentions are either altruistic or self-serving (that is, compared to most other professions, police are more likely to be motivated by either helping their fellow man or taking advantage of him).

Lay citizens normally have no way of knowing whether the cop they are interacting with is a good, bad or indifferent person. With that in mind, when I am interacting with a police officer acting in a law enforcement capacity (pretty much invariably because I have been pulled over), my job is to make him feel safe, comfortable, and sympathetic toward me. I don't BS him, I don't treat him with hostility, I don't raise my voice. I am polite and respectful. Obviously that doesn't guarantee that I won't get a ticket or worse, but it does improve my odds. I am mindful of the fact that I am a middle-aged white guy with a doctorate driving a BMW, not a young black guy with low-hanging jeans walking down the sidewalk, so I probably get subjected to less scrutiny and skepticism in the first place, but I would advise anyone to treat the situation the same way I do, regardless of race, age, sex or socioeconomic status.
 

cubby1223

Lifer
May 24, 2004
13,518
42
86
I thought this was a very good read, and he seems like the sort of officer who is very intelligent and full force was a very last resort.
Yea, and the other half of the article is a request for people not to be disrespectful, antagonistic assholes towards random officers.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,621
387
126
I have dealt with a lot of police over the years, including as a prosecutor, a criminal defense attorney, as a lawyer handling police civil rights cases on both the plaintiff's and defense sides, and as a subject of investigation (in a traffic context).

My sense is that police, as a whole, are no better or worse than anyone else, but it is a profession that is unusually unlikely to attract people whose intentions are either altruistic or self-serving (that is, compared to most other professions, police are more likely to be motivated by either helping their fellow man or taking advantage of him).

Lay citizens normally have no way of knowing whether the cop they are interacting with is a good, bad or indifferent person. With that in mind, when I am interacting with a police officer acting in a law enforcement capacity (pretty much invariably because I have been pulled over), my job is to make him feel safe, comfortable, and sympathetic toward me. I don't BS him, I don't treat him with hostility, I don't raise my voice. I am polite and respectful. Obviously that doesn't guarantee that I won't get a ticket or worse, but it does improve my odds. I am mindful of the fact that I am a middle-aged white guy with a doctorate driving a BMW, not a young black guy with low-hanging jeans walking down the sidewalk, so I probably get subjected to less scrutiny and skepticism in the first place, but I would advise anyone to treat the situation the same way I do, regardless of race, age, sex or socioeconomic status.
Most part I agree, but at the same time I also don't let cops walk over me. I politely let them know I am aware of my rights, that I have access to a lawyer, and I will obey lawful orders, but nothing beyond that. I've only had to do that twice in my relatively handful of interactions with police officers. A good officer once told me not to let the bad ones walk all over you either. As suggested in the OP, don't get mad, hostile, and make threats, but don't let them walk all over you. As you stated, be polite, but firm back and even the bad cops will usually take pause. They have with me in the past. Usually bad cops have also been reported and under scrutiny before and they don't really want the headache either of messing around with a calm citizen that knows their rights. Especially when they have nothing to really gain from the interaction.
 

WHAMPOM

Diamond Member
Feb 28, 2006
7,628
181
106
So, what is the alternative? Challenge a cop who is already violating your rights? As he said, that is going to work out real well for you. If a cop is okay with illegally detaining you, why wouldn't he be okay with shooting you if you show aggression?

99.9% of the time a cop is detaining someone, it is legal. You aren't in that extreme minority. Stfu and take your traffic ticket. Don't act like an idiot.
99.9%?? When police are forced to wear cameras on their person, reports of abuse drop by half. Change that to less then 50% and you will get closer to the truth.
 

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,660
3,138
126
I have only had to exert my rights one time.

Apparently I forgot to buckle my seat belt and like venomous snake this cop turned hisa lights on while making an illegal U Turn to pull me over.

I could tell by his demeanor that he was going to ticket me regardless what I said.

So he walked up to the car and asked for the usual id, registration and insurance.

Then he started asking me questions about where I was going, where I was coming from...etc.. I said to him -- officer, is my answering these questions going to make a difference in whether you ticket me or not?

He said 'No". I said well then you should go back to your car and write the ticket so we both can go about our business!!
 

halik

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
25,696
1
0
I have dealt with a lot of police over the years, including as a prosecutor, a criminal defense attorney, as a lawyer handling police civil rights cases on both the plaintiff's and defense sides, and as a subject of investigation (in a traffic context).

My sense is that police, as a whole, are no better or worse than anyone else, but it is a profession that is unusually unlikely to attract people whose intentions are either altruistic or self-serving (that is, compared to most other professions, police are more likely to be motivated by either helping their fellow man or taking advantage of him).

Lay citizens normally have no way of knowing whether the cop they are interacting with is a good, bad or indifferent person. With that in mind, when I am interacting with a police officer acting in a law enforcement capacity (pretty much invariably because I have been pulled over), my job is to make him feel safe, comfortable, and sympathetic toward me. I don't BS him, I don't treat him with hostility, I don't raise my voice. I am polite and respectful. Obviously that doesn't guarantee that I won't get a ticket or worse, but it does improve my odds. I am mindful of the fact that I am a middle-aged white guy with a doctorate driving a BMW, not a young black guy with low-hanging jeans walking down the sidewalk, so I probably get subjected to less scrutiny and skepticism in the first place, but I would advise anyone to treat the situation the same way I do, regardless of race, age, sex or socioeconomic status.
I am at roughly 14 for 14 for getting pulled over and receiving warnings. Most people simply don't know how to interact with LEOs - the number one thing police officers care about is obviously their own safety.

So just be mindful about keeping your hands visible, not fidgeting/digging around and ask/tell them what you're about to do something unusual (one time i had my registration in the back of the driver's seat, so I told the cop I am about to reach behind me to get it. He stepped back and lit it up with his flashlight there to see check it). I've never had a bad experience, If you act respectfully, you will get respect back.

Also I've gotta say that attitude/"keeping it real" sort of mentality with interacting with cops is pretty much how you end up getting tased or shot.
 
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CitizenKain

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2000
4,480
14
76
i cant wait for this cop hate to blow over...its reaching critical mass. Once regular joe starts to pay attention and sees criminals running free, fucking up society, eroding law enforcements ability to stop them, he will wonder why he stood by and let the neudering of police begin.
Maybe if cops stopped doing shit that makes rational people distrust first. Maybe if a no-knock raid wasn't the 1st step in serving a warrant. Or shooting people's pets to send them a message.
Other first world nations seem to manage without their police busting down doors and shooting minorities every weekend.

Its sad that doing anything aside from stroking a cop's ego means you might get tasered or murdered, and maybe your family will collect a partial settlement.
 
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halik

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
25,696
1
0
Maybe if cops stopped doing shit that makes rational people distrust first. Maybe if a no-knock raid wasn't the 1st step in serving a warrant. Or shooting people's pets to send them a message.
Other first world nations seem to manage without their police busting down doors and shooting minorities every weekend.

Its sad that doing anything aside from stroking a cop's ego means you might get tasered or murdered, and maybe your family will collect a partial settlement.
Other nations don't really have an epidemic of minorities shoot minorities every weekend. The number of black teens shoot black teens around here (chicago) is many orders of magnitude higher than cops shooting anyone.
 

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,660
3,138
126
i cant wait for this cop hate to blow over...its reaching critical mass. Once regular joe starts to pay attention and sees criminals running free, fucking up society, eroding law enforcements ability to stop them, he will wonder why he stood by and let the neudering of police begin.
If the cop denied the criminal of his or her constitutional rights...then perhaps the criminal should run free.....as opposed to the cop denying everyone of their rights!!
 

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,660
3,138
126
Another thread from the OP about cop or cop/law enforcement related in a bad light? Darn, when it will be enough, dude?
It will not be enough.......I was also posting these threads but I got sidetracked by another topic..lolol
 

Londo_Jowo

Lifer
Jan 31, 2010
17,303
158
106
londojowo.hypermart.net
I am at roughly 14 for 14 for getting pulled over and receiving warnings. Most people simply don't know how to interact with LEOs - the number one thing police officers care about is obviously their own safety.

So just be mindful about keeping your hands visible, not fidgeting/digging around and ask/tell them what you're about to do something unusual (one time i had my registration in the back of the driver's seat, so I told the cop I am about to reach behind me to get it. He stepped back and lit it up with his flashlight there to see check it). I've never had a bad experience, If you act respectfully, you will get respect back.

Also I've gotta say that attitude/"keeping it real" sort of mentality with interacting with cops is pretty much how you end up getting tased or shot.
This has been my experience as well. Surprising how yes sir, no sir or yes maam, no maam seems to set the tone when dealing with the police. Never have I been treated rudely by the police.
 

momeNt

Diamond Member
Jan 26, 2011
9,297
350
126
This has been my experience as well. Surprising how yes sir, no sir or yes maam, no maam seems to set the tone when dealing with the police. Never have I been treated rudely by the police.
Late at night on Christmas, pulled over for passing a cop while actually going the speed limit. Soon as the window was rolled down got an earful about the lack of respect I must have for passing a cop on the road. Passed him on the left too, he was going maybe 3 mph under the speed limit. Gives me some story about how there was a double fatality earlier that night and speeding was an issue, and here I am speeding while two people don't get christmas... wtf?

My guess is he was just taking his day out on someone who isn't going to be yelling back, like his wife, for having to work on christmas. She won't have any trouble helping him spend the paycheck though.
 

Mai72

Lifer
Sep 12, 2012
10,654
1,161
126
You listen to the cops and kiss their ass!

Cop: Get on the ground
Me: Yes sir!

Cop: Lick my boots!
Me: Yes sir!

Cop: Now give me 25 push ups.
Me: Yes sir.

It's not hard. The cops always have the right of way. You will always lose to a cop. Listen to what he says and do it!

We don't have another choice. :(
 

halik

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
25,696
1
0
Late at night on Christmas, pulled over for passing a cop while actually going the speed limit. Soon as the window was rolled down got an earful about the lack of respect I must have for passing a cop on the road. Passed him on the left too, he was going maybe 3 mph under the speed limit. Gives me some story about how there was a double fatality earlier that night and speeding was an issue, and here I am speeding while two people don't get christmas... wtf?

My guess is he was just taking his day out on someone who isn't going to be yelling back, like his wife, for having to work on christmas. She won't have any trouble helping him spend the paycheck though.
The average speedometer has at least 10% tolerance...
 

Brovane

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2001
3,956
33
91
This has been my experience as well. Surprising how yes sir, no sir or yes maam, no maam seems to set the tone when dealing with the police. Never have I been treated rudely by the police.
Or even recognizing correctly if they are a Sheriff Deputy or PD so you know if you should address them as Deputy or Officer will go far.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
78
86
I am at roughly 14 for 14 for getting pulled over and receiving warnings. Most people simply don't know how to interact with LEOs - the number one thing police officers care about is obviously their own safety.

So just be mindful about keeping your hands visible, not fidgeting/digging around and ask/tell them what you're about to do something unusual (one time i had my registration in the back of the driver's seat, so I told the cop I am about to reach behind me to get it. He stepped back and lit it up with his flashlight there to see check it). I've never had a bad experience, If you act respectfully, you will get respect back.

Also I've gotta say that attitude/"keeping it real" sort of mentality with interacting with cops is pretty much how you end up getting tased or shot.
Pretty much this. Although, I've only been pulled over 3 times (and one was a warning). Turning off your engine, putting your hands where they can see (especially at night), and being calm really puts them at ease. They are polite, so long as you don't act like a moron. My first ticket, I dropped my license under my car seat and had to dig for it. I told him and he even helped me dig it out. He felt at ease from my demeanor that I wasn't a threat. It also helped I actually pulled into a side road out of traffic.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
72,594
23,706
136
I'm just going to note that it's unlikely that a single person in this thread is the type of person who is routinely aggressively confronted by the police.
 

Oldgamer

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2013
3,280
1
0
He posted his thoughts at the end..
Yea, I think a good cop like this one shows a good deal of restraint and tries MANY other options before using excessive or lethal force. Unfortunately we don't have too many of these types of cops in the PD's across America right now. Now a cop who thinks that people should not ever question him period and uses excessive force because he can, ummm.. no I don't believe in that.
 

Oldgamer

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2013
3,280
1
0
I'm just going to note that it's unlikely that a single person in this thread is the type of person who is routinely aggressively confronted by the police.
That's right, and that is exactly why I am not a cop. But if you decide you want to become a cop you should know that this is what comes with the job. You should know that your life is always on the line. You should know many people will be afraid of you and sooner run than be cuffed (even if they are not guilty of anything). You should have the right temperament for the job and the right patience and intellect for the job. If you don't have these qualities then you have no business being a cop.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,563
9
81
Late at night on Christmas, pulled over for passing a cop while actually going the speed limit. Soon as the window was rolled down got an earful about the lack of respect I must have for passing a cop on the road. Passed him on the left too, he was going maybe 3 mph under the speed limit. Gives me some story about how there was a double fatality earlier that night and speeding was an issue, and here I am speeding while two people don't get christmas... wtf?

My guess is he was just taking his day out on someone who isn't going to be yelling back, like his wife, for having to work on christmas. She won't have any trouble helping him spend the paycheck though.
Which is funny, because cops blow by other traffic all the time with no lights or siren.

Laws for thee, but not for me!
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,621
387
126
You listen to the cops and kiss their ass!

Cop: Get on the ground
Me: Yes sir!

Cop: Lick my boots!
Me: Yes sir!

Cop: Now give me 25 push ups.
Me: Yes sir.

It's not hard. The cops always have the right of way. You will always lose to a cop. Listen to what he says and do it!

We don't have another choice. :(
And your attitude is what further draws bad people to be cops and incentives the ones already on the force.

I'm not saying be belligerent, but I am saying to know your rights and stand up for them. You let a cop piss all over you and they gladly will. Then they'll expect it from the next person as well.

The profession of being a police officer, like a politician, tends to draw the very altruistic, and those looking to hide their actions behind a badge. The former are great officers, and the later are not. The major problem is that the later tends to pull in more of itself on the force once it gets in charge. Bad cops do not like having good cops hanging around them who can figure out they aren't up to any good. Which is why some places the bad cops have overrun the good ones. And when citizens like yourself let them piss all over you, you allow that spreading of bad cops to continue.
 

rommelrommel

Platinum Member
Dec 7, 2002
2,984
585
136
And your attitude is what further draws bad people to be cops and incentives the ones already on the force.

I'm not saying be belligerent, but I am saying to know your rights and stand up for them. You let a cop piss all over you and they gladly will. Then they'll expect it from the next person as well.

The profession of being a police officer, like a politician, tends to draw the very altruistic, and those looking to hide their actions behind a badge. The former are great officers, and the later are not. The major problem is that the later tends to pull in more of itself on the force once it gets in charge. Bad cops do not like having good cops hanging around them who can figure out they aren't up to any good. Which is why some places the bad cops have overrun the good ones. And when citizens like yourself let them piss all over you, you allow that spreading of bad cops to continue.
I think the overall point has been to stand up for your rights, but not when the cop is effecting an arrest. Call your lawyer and win that way, don't try to argue with a bad cop who is pointing a gun at you.
 

Pneumothorax

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2002
1,174
18
81
I think the overall point has been to stand up for your rights, but not when the cop is effecting an arrest. Call your lawyer and win that way, don't try to argue with a bad cop who is pointing a gun at you.

+1000

The 3 people who got shot at here when that rogue ex cop was running around got a major payola. I'm pretty sure that homeless lady who got beat up by the chp will get a big payday too
 
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