HW Recommendation: Mobo / Processor / Memory

craftyy

Junior Member
Nov 13, 2007
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My regards for making a recommendation post as my introduction to the forums. I hope this is ok.

Current Setup:
A64 3000+ Winchester
DFI Lanparty NF4 Ultra-D
2x512 OCZ VX PC4000
(new) 8800GT PCI-E X16

My major bottleneck right now is obviously the processor, but I also want to have 2 gigs of memory. I'm afraid of losing my OC (in addition to using 2T command rate) if I pick up another 2x512 DDR400 memory. I'm also afraid I may get sticks that don't play nicely with the VX (which like 3.1v).

My plan was initially to keep the NF4 motherboard and buy 2x1gb G.Skill memory from newegg ($110) along with a 4200+ Manchester ($66), which brings my cost to $176.

The question:
Given a budget of $176 (Can increase for large performance jumps), which processor/memory/motherboard would you choose? Or would I be better off sticking with the Ultra-D and using the upgrade plan listed above.

I have no brand loyalty, but I'm obviously looking at last generation's hardware given the price range. PCI-E x16 is required, as is 2 gb of memory.

Thanks in advance. Regards, Brent
 

QuixoticOne

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2005
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Trouble is that DDR is twice the price of DDR2, so memory upgrades are
painfully expensive for DDR whereas you get more than twice the amount
of reasonable quality DDR2 for the same money ($99-$102 = 4GBy 2x2GB DDR2,
Fry's, eWiz, currently).

Also if you run Socket 939 or Socket 754 which I assume you do from the DDR400,
you are limited in your choices of processor upgrade, the more cost effective CPUs
being the low to mid end Core2s and of course the mid-end AMD X2, low end AMD Opterons.

I would not worry a BIT about losing 1T -> 2T or a few MHz of RAM overclock.
Having MORE ram is WAY BETTER for performance for virtually every game and
application than having slightly (well under 10%, more like 2%) faster RAM.

Look at the benchmarks for RAM speed vs. system performance and it really
doesn't make much difference to use 2T or 400MHz vs 366 or whatever.

I don't remember what X2s and dual core Opterons are available in your
compatibility range. If you have any of those as options (you probably do
on Socket 939 anyway), I'd look for the best sale price, OEM CPU price, or
reputable used CPU price you can find and upgrade the CPU to dual core
before I'd go to a 4200+ Manchester.

Also, even though it's wasteful of resources (not really if you sell the spare motherboard),
often the best deals I've seen are combination CPU + motherboard deals from places
like Fry's when they're on a holiday / weekend sale. I remember they had a
X2 4400+ and ECS motherboard combo for $99 a few months back, and they did that
a few times. Anyway my only point here is that maybe you can get a better CPU deal
if you buy one of those kinds of kits and use the CPU on your current M/B and
sell the spare motherboard.

Or maybe keep the new CPU + motherboard if it's DDR2 (AMD AM2 or S775 Intel),
sell your current DDR memory & motherboard, buy 2GB or 4GB of the presently CHEAP
DDR2 memory, and come out ahead in price / performance overall.

Or just save up for a few more months maybe and then jump on the best deal you
can find for a major CPU + motherboard + RAM upgrade since I'm sure there will
be good deals on combos and individual parts over the period from now through
January.

 

craftyy

Junior Member
Nov 13, 2007
3
0
0
Thanks for the reply QuixoticOne

The dual core Opterons are available for my 939 system, however they are $100 more, raising the price to ~$300 which would equal the cost of upgrading to a new, faster, platform.

I think based on the article on budget gaming machines I will use the CPU/MB/memory suggested there. It is $100 out of my price-range, but seems to be the best bang for my buck.

Based on your recommendation I was considering selling my 939 mobo and DDR400 memory (both parts were very good to me for a long time), but I think they will make a good x-mas present as part of a non-gaming rig for my family.

These are the parts I am now considering:
AMD Athlon X2 5000+ (2.6GHz 89W Windsor 2 x 512KB L2) ($110)
Biostar TForce TF570SLI AM2 nForce 570SLI ATX ($88)
Crucial Ballistix 2GB (2x1GB) DDR2-800 PC2-6400 ($100)
= $300

I think this is an acceptable rig, although over my budget by a slight margin. I'm going to hold off and not order until tomorrow in case there are more suggestions from the forum population.

Thanks
 

QuixoticOne

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2005
1,855
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http://www.newegg.com/Product/...16813127031&Tpk=ip35-e
$90 ABIT IP35-E LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
probably/maybe somewhere else has a lower price

http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2116895&enterthread=y
http://microcenter.com/single_...tml?product_id=0266759
Boxed E2140 @ Micro Center...$60 @ B&M; add $6 to ship

So that's around $160 or so shipped.

http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?name=T8UB2GC5&show=p
$50 STT DDR2-800 2GB/128x8 S-RIGID Memory

So you could jump to a C2D for $210 or so, sell your current CPU, memory,
motherboard, overclock the C2D up to around 3.2GHz, and you'd have something
that'd probably be competitive (check the benchmarks, this is just a off the cuff
guess) with the Manchester 4200+ system and your hypothetical expanded DDR RAM
option for a final price in your ballpark.

Advantages being you'd have plenty of options to later upgrade THAT CPU with a
faster C2D or quad core in a year or whenever it makes sense for you to do that.

Similarly you get to buy more dirt cheap (compared to historic levels, as well as
compared to DDR-400) DDR2 for expanding to 4GB which would eventually be
a very good upgrade for you.

Then again there are some dirt cheap DDR2-1GBy sticks out there these days too,
I saw the HP branded ones for $15/1GB DIMM for a long time in the AnandTech
Hot Deals forum posts, and plenty of other sticks for $25/1GB to $34/GB for really
fast ones. Personally I like the $50/2GB single sticks.

 

QuixoticOne

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2005
1,855
0
0
You're welcome.
The budget gaming article looks good.

Here's a CPU cooler that'll be $7 after rebate as of now. I use one on a somewhat
overclocked quad core intel Q6600, so it'll handle pretty serious overclocks on the
CPUs you're looking at, i.e. up to the reasonable limit of your CPU/motherboard.
It's a pain in the butt to install, though, and way bigger/heavier than it ought to be
but nothing will even come close to it for the current price. It should let you
overclock a fair bit more than the stock AMD/Intel cooler heatsink-fans, and
if you buy an OEM CPU you don't get the AMD/Intel heatsink-fan anyway so then
you'd certainly need to buy one.
http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/...p?ProductCode=10005496

Here's 2GB (2x1GB) of DDR2 for $40.
http://www.clubit.com/product_...8301&CMP=EMC-MIX110907
OCZ Platinum Revision 2 2GB (2x1GB) DDR2-800 CL 4-4-4-15 ATI CrossFire Certified Dual Channel Kit Retail OCZ2P800R22GK
oh NEVERMIND wait...

Here's an EVEN BETTER deal on RAM:
4-4-4 timings for $30 after rebate.
http://shop2.outpost.com/product/5398158
OCZ EL DDR2 PC2-6400 / 800 MHz / Enhanced Latency / Platinum Edition / Dual Channel / OCZ2P800FR2GK

NOTHING is wrong with the ballistix, though you listed a $100 price for them, so,
whatever you get I wouldn't pay more than around $20/Gigabyte for decent
PC2-6400 DDR2 memory whoever you buy it from considering the prices like
the ones I mention are popping up all over every day.

Personally I'd go with the intel CPU bugdet gaming type setup; the article you
linked to said the Intel would be faster and overclock better, but the reason they
liked the AMD was mainly because the AMD motherboard could SLI two 8800GTs
whereas an Intel system could not. But honestly I doubt you'd ever want/need to
buy a SECOND 8800GT to add it to SLI, if you needed anywhere near that game
performance you'd be shopping for an all-around much higher end system.
And by the time you ever want something better than the 8800GT (mine arrived
today, I'm about to install it), in a year I'm sure the next generation model will be
out and it'd be a better deal for better performance to get ONE of those vs. a SECOND
8800GT. So overall I'd stick with the CPU that will overclock faster and perform
better TODAY if you have no other reason to prefer the AMD setup (which is fine,
but you seem to be after performance for the dollar, so I'm just saying get the best
deal you can).

Might not be too bad of a deal to look for the cheapest new OEM model or
even a used CPU from someone LOCAL who you 100% trust and maybe even
can see it WORK before they take it out to sell to you just to get whatever the best
CPU model for the dollar.

I think the ABIT IP35-E Motherboard seems to have some very NICE reviews
for being great performance for the dollar in a mid-range P35 chipset (very modern)
motherboard for Intel CPUs. You might compare its price / features / reviews to your
other options and see what works best for you.

Since you're giving away the old system vs selling the parts and keeping the
case/PSU, I'll say get a case with GOOD airflow and room inside as much as your
budget allows, and a good quality 550W PSU on sale somewhere (EarthWatts 550
is around $40-$49 when on sale sometimes);
the 8800GT is a great card and very low power FOR WHAT IT DOES,
but still between it and an overclocked CPU you will have a good amount of heat and
power drain, so don't let things get too hot.

BTW the current 8800GT driver has a bug that runs the fan speed too low so the
cards heat up too much in gaming because the fan is never told to spin faster when you
game and the card gets a lot hotter. You can use something like ntune or rivatuner
or whatever to force the 8800GT fan to spin at 60% or faster and it'll run MUCH
cooler which would be very good for it. Maybe they'll fix the problem by the time
you get it built, but if not, be aware to do this.

Frys -- AMD BE-2300 45W CPU + ASUS M2A-VM - $108.99 At your neighborhood Frys B&M
http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2116530&enterthread=y
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuch...howdoc.aspx?i=3003&p=1
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/432
I don't know if that's a good deal on Motherboard and CPU or not. The overall price
is pretty low, and coupled with the 8800GT should be decent in games and the
anandtech review article benchmarks of the BE-2300 aren't too bad, but the CPU
is considerably slower than the X2-5000, so if you do have the budget to get
a faster CPU then of course that'll be faster for you at a price.
I didn't really look at the motherboard features to see if it's especially good/bad,
that's kind of subjective to your needs vs budget anyway.


Originally posted by: craftyy
Thanks for the reply QuixoticOne

The dual core Opterons are available for my 939 system, however they are $100 more, raising the price to ~$300 which would equal the cost of upgrading to a new, faster, platform.

I think based on the article on budget gaming machines I will use the CPU/MB/memory suggested there. It is $100 out of my price-range, but seems to be the best bang for my buck.

Based on your recommendation I was considering selling my 939 mobo and DDR400 memory (both parts were very good to me for a long time), but I think they will make a good x-mas present as part of a non-gaming rig for my family.

These are the parts I am now considering:
AMD Athlon X2 5000+ (2.6GHz 89W Windsor 2 x 512KB L2) ($110)
Biostar TForce TF570SLI AM2 nForce 570SLI ATX ($88)
Crucial Ballistix 2GB (2x1GB) DDR2-800 PC2-6400 ($100)
= $300

I think this is an acceptable rig, although over my budget by a slight margin. I'm going to hold off and not order until tomorrow in case there are more suggestions from the forum population.

Thanks

 

SerpentRoyal

Banned
May 20, 2007
3,517
0
0
Abit IP35-E is $71 AR @ MWAVE. I would avoid OCZ RAMs or any memory rated north of JEDEC's 1.8V spec. Stick with Kingston N5 DDR2 800 if you need to push FSB higher than 400MHz. Those N5 DDR2 667 modules are good up to 400MHz FSB. Note that the E2140 will hit a FSB wall around 425MHz.

I also like those HP DDR2 667 RAMs. $9/GB AR was a steal last month.