Hussein Was Right & Bush Was Wrong

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
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For those of you who still believe Bush was working with the best intelligence available and Saddam didn't comply with the request for a full accounting of the non-existent WMD...

Can you imagine? Hussein Was Right & Bush Was Wrong

by Harry Browne

You may remember that in 2002, the year before the Iraq War began, the United Nations Security Council ordered Iraq to produce a report detailing all of its biological, chemical, and nuclear weapons ? past and present. Iraqi officials complied and produced an 11,800-page report on Iraq's weapons programs. The report described all the chemical and biological weapons the country once had ? where they came from and what was done with them ? as well as what had happened to Iraq's nuclear weapons program.

Although the report was prepared for the United Nations, U.S. officials intercepted the report, edited out 8,000 pages (over two thirds) of it, and delivered its Reader's Digest version of the report to the UN.

A German reporter managed to obtain a copy of the original report from Iraq, and then compared it with the truncated copy the U.S. gave to the UN. He found that the missing parts covered the Iraqis' acquisition of chemical and biological weapons from the U.S., the delivery of non-fissionable materials for a nuclear bomb by the U.S. to the Iraqis, and the training of Iraqi nuclear scientists at U.S. nuclear facilities in Los Alamos, Sandia, and Berkeley.

The basic points made in the report were:

* Iraq once had chemical and biological weapons.

*Some of those weapons were destroyed at the end of the Gulf War; the rest were destroyed under the supervision of the UN weapons inspectors.

*Iraq once had a program to develop nuclear weapons.

*Some of the nuclear weapons facilities were destroyed at the end of the Gulf War; the rest were destroyed under the supervision of the UN weapons inspectors.

UN weapons inspector Hans Blix said the conclusions stated in the report were basically true ? that Iraq no longer had dangerous weapons.

Colin Powell dismissed the report, calling it a "catalogue of recycled information and flagrant omissions." Of course, as we now know, the information was recycled because it happened to be true, and the omissions were flagrant because U.S. officials had done the omitting.

Hussein said he would be like to bring the UN weapons inspectors back to Iraq. (They had left for safety reasons in 1998 when President Clinton resumed air strikes against Iraq.) President Bush called Hussein's offer a "cynical ploy" and managed to nip any such idea in the bud.

Hussein also invited the U.S. Congress to send representatives, accompanied by experts, to inspect any facilities in Iraq that they wanted. President Bush said this changed nothing, and he managed to derail the sending of a Congressional delegation.

Over and over, George Bush told us that Saddam Hussein was lying, that he was dragging his feet, that Iraq had dangerous weapons, that Hussein was a threat to the whole world,

Now here we are, over two years later. What have we learned?

*The hunt for Weapons of Mass Destruction has turned up exactly nothing, and so the hunt was been called off.

*Everything Hussein said about the weapons has turned out to be true.

*Everything George Bush said about Iraq's weapons has turned out to be false.

The Bush administration is trying to sugar-coat the above conclusions by saying that the recently concluded weapons hunt by Charles Duelfer and the CIA's Iraq Survey Group (ISG) discovered an "intent" by Hussein to renew his WMD programs if the U.S. would only stay out of Iraq. However, Duelfer has provided absolutely no hard evidence of such an "intent." Once again we're getting firm assertions backed up by nothing.

Former weapons inspector Scott Ritter has summed it all up very well:

One of the tragic ironies of the decision to invade Iraq is that the Iraqi WMD declaration required by security council resolution 1441, submitted by Iraq in December 2002, and summarily rejected by Bush and Blair as repackaged falsehoods, now stands as the most accurate compilation of data yet assembled regarding Iraq?s WMD programs (more so than even Duelfer?s ISG report, which contains much unsubstantiated speculation). Saddam Hussein has yet to be contradicted on a single point of substantive fact. Iraq had disarmed; no one wanted to accept that conclusion.

In other words, the Butcher of Baghdad was correct; the President of the United States of America was wrong. The Butcher of Baghdad will be put on trial for "war crimes." The President of the United States of America was reelected to "lead" the country for four more years.

It's a sorry state of affairs in America when you can trust the words of Saddam Hussein more than those of your own President.


January 17, 2005

 

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
29,578
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4 years ago I would have never thought this possible. It pains me not to be able to argue against this. :(

Edit: I hope someday, if I ever ge the chance to meet Scott Ritter, that I can shake his hand and apologize for doubting him the way I did. When I heard Iraqi funds were issued to him for making a movie about his efforts, my first reaction was that he was paid off by Saddam's regime. If only everyone had taken him more seriously...
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
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Originally posted by: kage69
4 years ago I would have never thought this possible. It pains me not to be able to argue against this. :(

Don't let it pain you. The truth may be painful at first, but it is vital to democracy. Instead, be thankful you aren't one of those who continues to believe the lies. They are truly among the lost.





 

Ldir

Platinum Member
Jul 23, 2003
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Originally posted by: miketheidiot
Can we have an impeachment yet?

Maybe in 2006, if we can get 51% of Americans to wise up and put in a Democratic Congress.
 

GroundedSailor

Platinum Member
Feb 18, 2001
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Originally posted by: miketheidiot
Can we have an impeachment yet?

You do realize that more than 1 person will have to be impeached in this administration. I don't see that happening much as I would like to see someone held responsible for misleading the public.



 

Jassi

Diamond Member
Sep 8, 2004
3,296
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Originally posted by: Ldir
Originally posted by: miketheidiot
Can we have an impeachment yet?

Maybe in 2006, if we can get 51% of Americans to wise up and put in a Democratic Congress.

Like that will ever happen. People here are so apathetic to the truth that it hinders their judgement. The republicans won the elections when they put that anti-gay marriage bill with the elections. They will try it again in 2006 and 2008 with probably another issue. 2004 was just an experiment, get ready to vote on their entire platform one by one.
 

yllus

Elite Member & Lifer
Aug 20, 2000
20,577
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Originally posted by: BBond
You may remember that in 2002, the year before the Iraq War began, the United Nations Security Council ordered Iraq to produce a report detailing all of its biological, chemical, and nuclear weapons ? past and present. Iraqi officials complied and produced an 11,800-page report on Iraq's weapons programs. The report described all the chemical and biological weapons the country once had ? where they came from and what was done with them ? as well as what had happened to Iraq's nuclear weapons program.

Although the report was prepared for the United Nations, U.S. officials intercepted the report, edited out 8,000 pages (over two thirds) of it, and delivered its Reader's Digest version of the report to the UN.

...

UN weapons inspector Hans Blix said the conclusions stated in the report were basically true ? that Iraq no longer had dangerous weapons.
Did he now? That's strange, considering that on the topic of the report Dr. Blix is on the record as having stated, "Regrettably, the 12,000 page declaration, most of which is a reprint of earlier documents, does not seem to contain any new evidence that would eliminate the questions or reduce their number."

The basic points made in the report were:

* Iraq once had chemical and biological weapons.

*Some of those weapons were destroyed at the end of the Gulf War; the rest were destroyed under the supervision of the UN weapons inspectors.

*Iraq once had a program to develop nuclear weapons.

*Some of the nuclear weapons facilities were destroyed at the end of the Gulf War; the rest were destroyed under the supervision of the UN weapons inspectors.
Oh really. :roll: How convenient. An op-ed piece uncategorically states that all WMD were destroyed at the end of the Gulf War. It's too bad they didn't drop the UN a line and let them know so they could call off those searches in the desert. I mean, all that wasted paper and telephone time pleading the Bush administration for extra time while a simple phone call to Mr. Ridgeway could have decided the matter.

In other words, the Butcher of Baghdad was correct; the President of the United States of America was wrong. The Butcher of Baghdad will be put on trial for "war crimes." The President of the United States of America was reelected to "lead" the country for four more years.

It's a sorry state of affairs in America when you can trust the words of Saddam Hussein more than those of your own President.
Somehow I'm not surprised that you would agree with such a fitting conclusion.

Edit: Little mix-up.
 

TheGameIs21

Golden Member
Apr 23, 2001
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Not that anyone here wants to hear from a conservative....

I find it funny how people will immediately accept this article as 100% truth. I don't accept either report as 100% truth. You can't 100% trust this "new uncensored" report since you have no idea where it really came from.

Just my .02 as a conservative who doesn't think that ANY admin tells the truth about what the do.
 

Darkhawk28

Diamond Member
Dec 22, 2000
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Originally posted by: yllus
Originally posted by: BBond
You may remember that in 2002, the year before the Iraq War began, the United Nations Security Council ordered Iraq to produce a report detailing all of its biological, chemical, and nuclear weapons ? past and present. Iraqi officials complied and produced an 11,800-page report on Iraq's weapons programs. The report described all the chemical and biological weapons the country once had ? where they came from and what was done with them ? as well as what had happened to Iraq's nuclear weapons program.

Although the report was prepared for the United Nations, U.S. officials intercepted the report, edited out 8,000 pages (over two thirds) of it, and delivered its Reader's Digest version of the report to the UN.

...

UN weapons inspector Hans Blix said the conclusions stated in the report were basically true ? that Iraq no longer had dangerous weapons.
Did he now? That's strange, considering that on the topic of the report Dr. Blix is on the record as having stated, "Regrettably, the 12,000 page declaration, most of which is a reprint of earlier documents, does not seem to contain any new evidence that would eliminate the questions or reduce their number."

The basic points made in the report were:

* Iraq once had chemical and biological weapons.

*Some of those weapons were destroyed at the end of the Gulf War; the rest were destroyed under the supervision of the UN weapons inspectors.

*Iraq once had a program to develop nuclear weapons.

*Some of the nuclear weapons facilities were destroyed at the end of the Gulf War; the rest were destroyed under the supervision of the UN weapons inspectors.
Oh really. :roll: How convenient. An op-ed piece uncategorically states that all WMD were destroyed at the end of the Gulf War. It's too bad they didn't drop the UN a line and let them know so they could call off those searches in the desert. I mean, all that wasted paper and telephone time pleading the Bush administration for extra time while a simple phone call to Mr. Ridgeway could have decided the matter.

In other words, the Butcher of Baghdad was correct; the President of the United States of America was wrong. The Butcher of Baghdad will be put on trial for "war crimes." The President of the United States of America was reelected to "lead" the country for four more years.

It's a sorry state of affairs in America when you can trust the words of Saddam Hussein more than those of your own President.
Somehow I'm not surprised that you were capable with coming up with such an fitting conclusion.

What other conclusion can we make out of this whole fiasco? He's incompotent, he's psychopathic, tell me.
 
May 10, 2001
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good post, let's take a critical look at it:

your link:

Can you imagine? Hussein Was Right & Bush Was Wrong

has a link saying

U.S. officials intercepted the report, edited out 8,000 pages (over two thirds) of it, and delivered its Reader's Digest version of the report to the UN.

but if you read the link it says:
THE United States edited out more than 8000 crucial pages of Iraq's 11,800-page dossier on weapons, before passing on a sanitised version to the 10 non-permanent members of the United Nations security council.

Iraq itself was soon to be rotated into the security counsel?s non-permanent, a lot of human intelligence could have been compromised by countries that arn't exactly interested in the best for the US.

The permanent members of the council did get to see the full report, It's not like there aren?t other countries that looked at it, or that bush could actually delete files from the report without anyone noticing.

Then the article accuses the US of handing Iraq nuclear weapons! Based on what, An editorial from an internet journal? You?ve got to be kidding me.

We helped Iraq fight the islamo-facist terrorist regime of Iran in the 80s, this is true, but if we could show the things that this article attempts to invent then Dan Rather wouldn?t have had to use fake documents in his hit-peace against bush.

The ?village voice? that says that the weapons where destroyed before UN weapon inspectors is actually a hit-peace trying to say that bush was planning on invading Iraq November of 2002. The link the article uses presumes the statement being made by the article, as though it?s common knowledge. The fact is that the UN weapons inspector didn?t say that at all, but that he had no way of knowing how much Iraq had destroyed.

If anyone needs I?ll do more of your own homework for you, but before you blindly declare:
It pains me not to be able to argue against this.
I suggest you actually read the documentation that the hit-peace is trying to support itself with.

Internet info is more free-wheeling, you?ve got to be more incredulous when confronted with radical information that falls outside of the mainstream. I?m not saying it can?t be right, I?m just saying:
Give it an incredulous eye, unless you want to be a Michael More/Mat Drudge believing whack job.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,425
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Don't know if the article is accurate. It states that the US intercepted then altered the report before it reached the UN. However, it offers no evidence that it was even possible to do so nevermind proved that it happened. Wouldn't surprise me that it happened, but I wouldn't just assume just because some guy in Germany claims to have seen the original Iraqi report.
 

yllus

Elite Member & Lifer
Aug 20, 2000
20,577
432
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Originally posted by: Darkhawk28
What other conclusion can we make out of this whole fiasco? He's incompotent, he's psychopathic, tell me
Well gee, do you think we should put much stock in a 2-year-old op-ed piece with corroboration by the most trustworthy of sources that makes assertions based on incorrect positions? Dr. Blix never said the new report helped draw a conclusion - he said the complete opposite. Not that the article writer would have known that - the piece predates Blix's last speech before the UN on the topic.

The piece then rewrites history to make Mr. Hussein into this agreeable character who would "like to bring the UN weapons inspectors back to Iraq". I guess that would be after the airstrikes reminded him of his commitments to the UN?

It's not incompetency that's coming to light here. It's the way people love to rewrite even rather recent history in a way that fits their agenda. Unfortunately facts win over conspirational notions every time.
 
Sep 12, 2004
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Nice revisionist history in the article.

The parts of the report removed by the US had nothing to do with the information that was considered missing. Blix stated what was missing in his report:

http://www.iraqfoundation.org/...2003/bfeb/20_blix.html

To take an example, a document which Iraq provided suggested to us that some 1,000 tons of chemical agent were unaccounted for. I must not jump to the conclusion that they exist; however, that possibility is also not excluded. If they exist, they should be presented for destruction. If they do not exist, credible evidence to that effect should be presented.

We are fully aware that many governmental intelligence organizations are convinced and assert that proscribed weapons, items and programs continue to exist. The U.S. secretary of state presented material in support of this conclusion.

Governments have many sources of information that are not available to inspectors. The inspectors, for their part, must base their reports only on the evidence which they can themselves examine and present publicly. Without evidence, confidence cannot arise.

Mr. President, in my earlier briefings, I have noted that significant outstanding issues of substance were listed in two Security Council documents from early 1999 and should be well known to Iraq.

I referred, as examples, to the issues of anthrax, the nerve agent VX, and long-range missiles, and said that such issues -- and I quote myself -- "deserve to be taken seriously by Iraq rather than being brushed aside," unquote.

The declaration submitted by Iraq on the 7th of December last year, despite its large volume, missed the opportunity to provide the fresh material and evidence needed to respond to the open questions.
Blix specifically and unabiguously stated that there were ommissions by Iraq that still had not been addressed. He alo stated there was little in the way of "fresh material". So despite the assertions in the article in the OP, Blix realy said more than "Iraq no longer had dangerous weapons." He believed, as did many others, that Iraq was still withholding vital information.

The information removed by the US also had to do with more than things that the US supplied Iraq. There was also information on French, German, and Russian supplied chemicals and materials. The US removed those as well to protect those countries.

When an article omits such information it appears to be stretching to make a point and presents itself as obviously biased, which this one is in spades.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
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None of the documentation either way changes the truth one whit. No nuclear program, no wmd's, no links to al qaeda worthy of the term- zero, zip, nada, nothing. Just a very expensive and fruitless war dragged in on the coattails of a lot of fearmongering and misdirection over 9/11, justified and sold on the basis of a great deal of supposition and cherry-picking of intelligence, much of it supplied by Iranian sponsored exile groups...

Whatever Blix believed, TLC, we'll never know unless he tells us, unless you can successfully represent yourself as the next Kreskin... but we know what he said, and that was that his work would be completed in a matter of months from march 7, 2003- months that the Bush admin refused to allow him in their rush to war...
 

Darkhawk28

Diamond Member
Dec 22, 2000
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Originally posted by: Jhhnn
None of the documentation either way changes the truth one whit. No nuclear program, no wmd's, no links to al qaeda worthy of the term- zero, zip, nada, nothing. Just a very expensive and fruitless war dragged in on the coattails of a lot of fearmongering and misdirection over 9/11, justified and sold on the basis of a great deal of supposition and cherry-picking of intelligence, much of it supplied by Iranian sponsored exile groups...

Whatever Blix believed, TLC, we'll never know unless he tells us, unless you can successfully represent yourself as the next Kreskin... but we know what he said, and that was that his work would be completed in a matter of months from march 7, 2003- months that the Bush admin refused to allow him in their rush to war...

Bingo! Nicely said. Beers on me.:beer:
 

CycloWizard

Lifer
Sep 10, 2001
12,348
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Iraq dismantled their WMD. All they had to do was tell us when, where, and how. They had 12 years to do so but did not. Saddam himself has said that the reason he refused is because he was more worried about an attack by Iran than an invasion by the US because he never thought the US would actually invade. Whoever wrote this article tries to pin the tail on Bush. He has clearly never read the UNMOVIC reports nor much other pertinent information. Instead, he waves his hands in an effort to defame Bush.
 

jpeyton

Moderator in SFF, Notebooks, Pre-Built/Barebones
Moderator
Aug 23, 2003
25,375
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Isn't it funny...so far, every pathetic attempt to counter the OP hasn't dealt with the actual FACTS the article tries to argue. Just more chickenhawks trying to find more reasons to excuse our blunders...
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
How can anyone complain about ommissions from Saddam when in fact the greatest ommission was the 8,000 pages the U.S. tore from the report.

What exactly are they hiding???

 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Isn't it funny...so far, every pathetic attempt to counter the OP hasn't dealt with the actual FACTS the article tries to argue. Just more chickenhawks trying to find more reasons to excuse our blunders...

Must not being reading the same thread as the rest of us.