Humility

[zinfamous]

And Yaweh doesn't equal Allah.

The God of Abraham = God of the Hebrews = God of the Christians = God of Islam.

you even suck at Theology.

 

[zinfamous]

World atheist convention rejects Australian creationist debate challenge

http://creation.com/global-atheists-reject-debate-challenge

Not a surprise. When the truth is against you why would you want to debate?

the general stance int he scientific community is to hold no debates on evolution, because there is no debate. It is accepted fact. Holding a debate allows creationists to think that there is controversy.

there is not. go back to Kansas and live your life amongst the other irrelevant nitwits of that backwards fuckhole.

 

[Nik]

Mr. Randal lives in Minnesota, not Kansas.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

I can certainly agree with this post. I personally have no idea if there is a God or not, although I am fairly certain that if there is a Creator of all the known Universe, it is probably not accurately portrayed by some book written a few thousand years ago by even more ignorant and primitive men.

So, to clarify my position:

• Belief that we don't fully comprehend the ultimate origins of all matter and time? Reasonable
• Belief that we know exactly where we came from and what He wants us to do, say, and think at such a detailed level? Absurdly ridiculous

I'm not going to get into the religion thing but you really can't say anything about a hypothetical intelligence that by definition is incomprehensible. You may be right and you may be wrong. Appealing to scale in this context is not something you can do. You have no meaningful metric of what can or can't be done, or even an approximation.

The problem is that if God exists, humans would of necessity be given to anthropomorphizing. How would an amoeba model human thought and capabilities? It wouldn't.

 

[zinfamous]

I guess you just selectively read my posts if that's the way you feel. The "argumentation" on your side is generally to name call and post links.

It's no wonder the militant atheists are so loathe to debate their position in a public forum.

i've actually spent a lot of time defending theists from atheists on this board, and you might know that because you're obviously a previously banned member or some multi...regardless, I only go after idiots--regardless of their philosophical or science-based bent.

 

[Nik]

Good points, HR, but if he's so awesome why doesn't he freakin prove his existence instead of letting people murder each other "in his name" for thousands of years?

Seems like he'd be some kinda asshole or something!

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Good points, HR, but if he's so awesome why doesn't he freakin prove his existence instead of letting people murder each other "in his name" for thousands of years?

Seems like he'd be some kinda asshole or something!

Obviously I couldn't have an answer for that

I suppose that my point is that people have been constructing arguments for or against the existence of God based on their understanding of what God ought to be, including restraints (or none) to ability.

I can say "I think this" or "believe that" but objectively? It's the basis for agnosticism.

I just cannot conceive of testing something which is beyond any definitive test.

 

[PhineasJWhoopee]

The God of Abraham = God of the Hebrews = God of the Christians = God of Islam.

you even suck at Theology.

All true but the last =. You haven't done your homework.

 

[destrekor]

All true but the last =. You haven't done your homework.

He's technically correct, but at the same time he is wrong.

Depends on which Islamic movement, which interpretation one clings. Old school Islam treats Allah as "everything", but most schools of Islam today treat Allah as a supreme architect and judge (iirc).

One could translate the Old Testament as something fairly close to the Pantheistic approach, with a fair amount of deification for drama, but most assuredly not the New Testament.

A lot of the old religions were quite closer to Pantheism in origin, but got completely wrangled and manipulated and had the original texts translated in favor of very specific ideas.

Old school Islam = Yahweh is Allah's bitch, a whiny arrogant little punk who pales in comparison to the awe Allah commands (since Allah does not control anything, it merely is everything, the power of Nature is it's blood, versus simply manipulation of nature and physics to do anything).

 

[PhineasJWhoopee]

They really are quite different. I'm to tired and lazy to point out all the differences but just Google Yahweh vs Allah. There's a lot of good information on the topic.

 

[PhineasJWhoopee]

Good points, HR, but if he's so awesome why doesn't he freakin prove his existence instead of letting people murder each other "in his name" for thousands of years?

Seems like he'd be some kinda asshole or something!

It seems to me that if there is a God he wouldn't have to take orders from you.

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

All true but the last =. You haven't done your homework.

What the fuck are you talking about? Even Arabic Christians refer to God as Allah. Allah is the Arabic name for God in all Abrahamic religions, which includes Islam and Christianity.

Holy shitfuck you are a never-ending fountain of fail.

 

[destrekor]

What the fuck are you talking about? Even Arabic Christians refer to God as Allah. Allah is the Arabic name for God in all Abrahamic religions, which includes Islam and Christianity.

Holy shitfuck you are a never-ending fountain of fail.

I'm going to pretend I'm not backing up that fella, but unfortunately, that doesn't exactly mean much.

Over the generations, Allah has come to simply represent the term God for all those of Arabic descent. In terms of vernacular, it is simply their word that means God. HOWEVER, and this is a big difference, original references to Allah with other choice words coupled next to Allah, translated as something along the lines of "No God, only Allah", with a word that used to be the Arabic translation of god (not a specific god, just simply the word that meant God. Contrast to other religions assigning a name to God at some point in the text). Now, many schools of Islam theology showcase Allah as God, and that has transcended religion and replaced the name Allah for God for anyone raised around Arabic culture.

 

[PhineasJWhoopee]

The concept of God in the Koran is quite different from the concept of God found in the Bible.

Why would you think that they are the same?

How does it matter how Arabic Christains supposedly refer to God?

 

[Farang]

Didn't read the whole thread, but Dick Cavett @ The NY Times had a related article recently:

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/10/dear-fellow-improbable/

 

[BoberFett]

Star Size Comparisons

Heh, the size of the universe is truly mind boggling

 

[Nik]

The concept of God in the Koran is quite different from the concept of God found in the Bible.

Why would you think that they are the same?

How does it matter how Arabic Christains supposedly refer to God?

It doesn't. They both refer to a nonsensical claim with no supporting evidence.

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

The concept of God in the Koran is quite different from the concept of God found in the Bible.

[facepalm.jpg]

I never suggested that muslims and christians had the same god concept. They both worship the God of Abraham, despite that they have different interpretations of what that god is like. What better evidence that said god is a figment of its worshipper's imaginations could there be?

Why would you think that they are the same?

Because I know real facts about the world around me, in stark contrast to you.

How does it matter how Arabic Christains supposedly refer to God?

The god of arabic muslims = Allah. The god of arabic christians = Allah. How are you not getting this?

 

[PhineasJWhoopee]

They are quite different but believe as you will.

The name Allah isn't found in the New or Old Testaments. The name of the God of Jews and Christians is Yahweh

 

[Nik]

They are quite different but believe as you will.

The name Allah isn't found in the New or Old Testaments. The name of the God of Jews and Christians is Yahweh

No, that's a man-given name. God originally called himself Elohim.

 

[PhineasJWhoopee]

No, that's a man-given name. God originally called himself Elohim.

Exodus 3:14 (New International Version)


14 God said to Moses, "I am who I am . [a] This is what you are to say to the Israelites: 'I AM has sent me to you.' "

On a related note, Jesus upset his generation especially when He said, "Before Abraham was, I AM," John 8:58. Note also his claim to be Jehovah (Yahweh) in such phrases as "I AM the Light of the world," "the bread of life," living water," "the Resurrection and the Life," "the Way, Truth and the Life" in John's Gospel. From the Hebrew OT verb "to be" signifying a Living, Intelligent, Personal Being.

 

[Nik]

That's not a name and you're smart enough to know what I mean.

I know you know.

It's okay though. It's fun picking out inconsistencies. Keeps me sharp, so I suppose I should thank ye!

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

They are quite different but believe as you will.

The God of Abraham is different than the God of Abraham? How does that work?

Fuckin' magnets...

The name Allah isn't found in the New or Old Testaments.

Neither is the name "Dios" but guess what they call god in Spanish-speaking countries.

The name of the God of Jews and Christians is Yahweh

I prefer to pray to Joe Pesci. He seems more like a guy that can get shit done.

 

[PhineasJWhoopee]

That's not a name and you're smart enough to know what I mean.

I know you know.

It's okay though. It's fun picking out inconsistencies. Keeps me sharp, so I suppose I should thank ye!

As I understand it, the reason we see "LORD" and "God" in our bibles is because of a Jewish tradition that the name Yahweh was not to be spoken for fear that the name be blasphemed.

Most Jewish people won’t say Yahweh. Instead, they say HASHEM—a Hebrew word that means “The Name”, or they say Adonai—the Hebrew word for Lord.

Anyway, I'm sure that there are Jewish members here who can speak more authoritatively on the topic.

 

[cKGunslinger]

Heh, the size of the universe is truly mind boggling

Indeed!