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Huge power outage hits India

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Ldir

Platinum Member
Jul 23, 2003
2,184
0
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Not solves as in "comes to a successful conclusion", but solves as in "reaches market equilibrium". The equilibrium reached is not always desirable from a societal perspective.
That is not solving anything. The free market solves problems only when it is more profitable than milking them or ignoring them. That is the problem with drug companies.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
29,807
3,325
126
That is not solving anything. The free market solves problems only when it is more profitable than milking them or ignoring them. That is the problem with drug companies.
Monopolies can milk and ignore. Competition helps avoid that.
 

Raghu

Senior member
Aug 28, 2004
396
1
81
Does India have government-run utilities?
Most of the supply utilities are govt. owned. There are a few private utilities in some cities - Tata and Reliance Power are the biggest. A lot of power generation is private though.

There are 5 main grids in India - North, East, North-East, South, West. The North grid gave way yesterday and was restored. It failed again today, but this time dragged East and North-East too. The failure is attributed to a single state (Uttar Pradesh/UP) drawing more than its share of power. Its the state with the most population and highest fertility rate. Also the most backward.

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/news-by-industry/energy/power/northern-eastern-grids-collapse-biggest-power-failure-in-india/articleshow/15291201.cms

All the power generation units supplying to the failed grids have been shutdown. Restarting them and getting the grid back up is going to take a day.

The South grid is not connected to the rest and hence remained clean. There are frequent but planned power cuts to balance production-demand, but no failures.
 

Druidx

Platinum Member
Jul 16, 2002
2,972
0
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Already the worst traffic problems is the world. Now times 2 with countless trains stalled across roadways and no working traffic lights.

 

PokerGuy

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
13,652
199
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That is not solving anything. The free market solves problems only when it is more profitable than milking them or ignoring them. That is the problem with drug companies.
No, those are just examples of cases where the free market equilibrium reached (the solution) is not desirable. Nobody (that I know of) would argue that a completely free market (which doesn't exist by the way) will always bring about the best and most desirable solution for all.
 

PokerGuy

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
13,652
199
101
Already the worst traffic problems is the world. Now times 2 with countless trains stalled across roadways and no working traffic lights.

I can only imagine how big of a mess traffic there is right now when it's generally a mess anyway (at least from what I've been told).
 

Thump553

Lifer
Jun 2, 2000
11,813
1,130
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NPR said the Indian government was reporting 670 million people without power now. That's close to double the entire population of the USA.
 

PokerGuy

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
13,652
199
101
NPR said the Indian government was reporting 670 million people without power now. That's close to double the entire population of the USA.
..... or about 5 square miles in India? :D Couldn't resist.

670 million without power in one country is mind boggling.
 

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
0
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Ah insults, the last refuge of the well informed debater.

Clearly Im an idiot for not understanding that the Free Market SOLVES EVERY PROBLEM.

And clearly you are far more intelligent for not even addressing my point but instead using an insult to argue for you.

Well played sir, well played.
Actually, you are an idiot because you are an idiot. Posting idiotic things does not make you an idiot - you post idiotic things BECAUSE you are an idiot. To be fair, I did not expect you to come to this understanding on your own...well, because you are...I think you get the idea.

The free market cannot fix something the government fully controls. A non-idiot would already know this.
 

radhak

Senior member
Aug 10, 2011
843
14
81
Even for India, this blackout must have a huge impact. (Even for India, because power cuts are way of life there, with most consumers getting power only part of the day. Major metropolises publish schedules for power cuts, as in 'no power in these areas 3pm to 9pm, Mon - Wed, ...' ).

Yes, twice the population of the US impacted. Even individually, the numbers can boggle the mind : I cannot imagine the state of travelers in the 300 odd trains that were stranded on the tracks at various places (maybe some still are), each with 1000-2000 passengers for more than half a million left to fend for themselves in this heat, away from home or even railway stations :eek:. Hospitals are generally equipped with generators, but this might be more than they could have planned for.

Maybe some good will come out of this. Infrastructure - or lack thereof - has been the bane of India. But just the advent of cell-phones has seen a dramatic shift around in the telecommunication scene in the last few years, maybe this will be the last straw for the electricity arena; there are good examples with certain states managing electricity better than others. WSJ covers it here.
 

OneOfTheseDays

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2000
7,052
0
0
A truly "free" market isolates power in the hands of few, who manipulate the playing field to give themselves unfair advantage over the rest. Why anyone would think that would solve today's problems is beyond me.

There is a reason why our government is shaped the way it is. Regulations were born out of necessity.
 

MooseNSquirrel

Platinum Member
Feb 26, 2009
2,566
295
126
Actually, you are an idiot because you are an idiot. Posting idiotic things does not make you an idiot - you post idiotic things BECAUSE you are an idiot. To be fair, I did not expect you to come to this understanding on your own...well, because you are...I think you get the idea..
Thats it, Im kicking you out my tree house!

The free market cannot fix something the government fully controls. A non-idiot would already know this.
I was not aware that the Indian government completely comtrolled the electrical market in India.
 

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
5,237
472
126
This will teach them a lesson for stealing American jobs and those annoying telemarketers
Not one Chinese, Indian, or illegal stole a single American job, another American with the authority and ability to do so gave them that so called stolen job.:sneaky:
 

DucatiMonster696

Diamond Member
Aug 13, 2009
4,269
1
71
Surely the free market will eventually solve this problem.
It's obvious that the state hasn't done much to address the issue itself. The fact that electricity usage which is controlled and subsidized by India's government (and also rationed via planned outages) further compounds the issue of wasteful energy usage and power spikes when electricity returns to an area.
 
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Svnla

Lifer
Nov 10, 2003
17,584
1,172
126
What gives?

Supply <<<<<<<< Demand = big trouble.

When I was in Asia, some of the electricity lines were beyond craziness.



^^^^^^ live electricity lines and not spider web.
 
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DucatiMonster696

Diamond Member
Aug 13, 2009
4,269
1
71
Most of the supply utilities are govt. owned. There are a few private utilities in some cities - Tata and Reliance Power are the biggest. A lot of power generation is private though.

There are 5 main grids in India - North, East, North-East, South, West. The North grid gave way yesterday and was restored. It failed again today, but this time dragged East and North-East too. The failure is attributed to a single state (Uttar Pradesh/UP) drawing more than its share of power. Its the state with the most population and highest fertility rate. Also the most backward.

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/news-by-industry/energy/power/northern-eastern-grids-collapse-biggest-power-failure-in-india/articleshow/15291201.cms

All the power generation units supplying to the failed grids have been shutdown. Restarting them and getting the grid back up is going to take a day.

The South grid is not connected to the rest and hence remained clean. There are frequent but planned power cuts to balance production-demand, but no failures.
Need I say more?

Monday's collapse of the northern grid, the worst in a decade, was triggered by violation of discipline by states, which drew excessive power, which some officials said was due to political pressures.
 
Apr 27, 2012
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Not one Chinese, Indian, or illegal stole a single American job, another American with the authority and ability to do so gave them that so called stolen job.:sneaky:
Technically its not stealing but India still got what it deserved
 

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