How's this for an out of control school?

[Riprorin]

School officer calls in backup after using pepper spray on girls.

By Donna Jackel
Staff writer

(December 19, 2003) ? A Rochester police officer attempting to break up a fight at the Dr. Freddie Thomas Learning Center on Thursday used pepper spray on students after he felt someone tugging at his gun belt.

A school sentry said a student was on the officer?s back at the time.

Officer Virgil Ross, one of two Rochester police officers assigned as resource officers to Freddie Thomas, was in his school office about 10:45 a.m. when he saw between 400 and 500 students running through the halls ?apparently out of control,? said Sgt. Carlos Garcia, a spokesman for the Police Department.

They were running to a fight in the hall where two girls were ?literally jumping? on a third girl, Garcia said. As Ross tried to separate the girls and disperse the crowd, he felt someone reaching for his gun belt, Garcia said.

A school sentry later told Ross that a student jumped onto the officer?s back from a stairwell, according to Garcia.

?At that point he decides he needs to use pepper spray not only to get the kids off each other but to get the crowd dispersed,? Garcia said. The officer used the pepper spray on the girls who were fighting. Ross then called for backup.

Cops calm melee at Freddie Thomas

 

[ThaGrandCow]

Jerry! Jerry! Jerry!

 

[SweetSweetLeroyBrown]

boys will be boys...errr girls

 

[Jumpem]

I love downtown Rochester. </sarcasm>

 

[Riprorin]

My friend's sisters was a teacher at a Rochester city school. At parent-teacher conferences, one or two parents generally showed up. Sad.

 

Sounds like something that happened a year before I got into high school. The schools officer was walking down the hallway, and some girls decided to jump him (4 or 5 of them). He pressed the panic button on his pager and within 3 minutes the school was overrun with cops.

BTW, the officers that were at my high school NEVER carried guns in the hallway. They were always in a locked drawer in their office.

 

[Mill]

Not really anything out of the norm. This stuff happens fairly often in public schools.

 

[fumbduck]

Originally posted by: Riprorin
My friend's sisters was a teacher at a Rochester city school. At parent-teacher conferences, one or two parents generally showed up. Sad.

one or two parents? how is that sad?

If I had a parent teacher conference, I would send my wife and stay home myself, or go myself and have her stay home, no need for us to both go.

 

[Riprorin]

Originally posted by: fumbduck

Originally posted by: Riprorin
My friend's sisters was a teacher at a Rochester city school. At parent-teacher conferences, one or two parents generally showed up. Sad.

one or two parents? how is that sad?

If I had a parent teacher conference, I would send my wife and stay home myself, or go myself and have her stay home, no need for us to both go.

Out of 25 or so kids, only one or two parents/guardians show up? That's a pretty low percentage.

 

[Turin39789]

Originally posted by: Mill
Not really anything out of the norm. This stuff happens fairly often in public schools.

yup, happened every single day at the public high school I went to, when i switched to a private school , everyone said please and thank you and we had golden toilet seats and they taught me calculus in 20 minutes, even DE

 

[Riprorin]

Originally posted by: Turin39789

Originally posted by: Mill
Not really anything out of the norm. This stuff happens fairly often in public schools.

yup, happened every single day at the public high school I went to, when i switched to a private school , everyone said please and thank you and we had golden toilet seats and they taught me calculus in 20 minutes, even DE

At my kids school (inner city Catholic school), talking during a fire drill is a major offence. My daughter had to write "I will not talk during a fire drill" 100x for greeting her brother in the hallway on the way out of school.

Your sarcasm aside, inner city public schools have some real problems.

 

[Gravity]

I work with juvenile offenders so this stuff is like, job security!

 

[Indolent]

Originally posted by: Turin39789

Originally posted by: Mill
Not really anything out of the norm. This stuff happens fairly often in public schools.

yup, happened every single day at the public high school I went to, when i switched to a private school , everyone said please and thank you and we had golden toilet seats and they taught me calculus in 20 minutes, even DE

My only experience with private schools was sports. We had 3 of them in our conference, and they had the worst sportsmanship i've seen, complete with constant swearing on the basketball court. I have no idea what they were like in school though.

 

[TourGuide]

At my kids school (inner city Catholic school), talking during a fire drill is a major offence. My daughter had to write "I will not talk during a fire drill" 100x for greeting her brother in the hallway on the way out of school.

That is just idiotic. I understand the importance of adhering to a code of conduct. I just don't agree with this intervention. That is WAY too much overkill for such a silly infraction. Pretending that the lines of black and white, right and wrong are so clearly drawn is confusing for kids and makes them angry at punishments that seem arbitrary and capricious. That kind of heavy handed discipline is just foolish.

Your sarcasm aside, inner city public schools have some real problems.

There's no question about that. I'm sure all we need though is for 'W' to legislate the problems away for us. After all, didn't he give us the No Child Left Behind act?

 

[Turin39789]

Originally posted by: Riprorin

Originally posted by: Turin39789

Originally posted by: Mill
Not really anything out of the norm. This stuff happens fairly often in public schools.

yup, happened every single day at the public high school I went to, when i switched to a private school , everyone said please and thank you and we had golden toilet seats and they taught me calculus in 20 minutes, even DE

At my kids school (inner city Catholic school), talking during a fire drill is a major offence. My daughter had to write "I will not talk during a fire drill" 100x for greeting her brother in the hallway on the way out of school.

Your sarcasm aside, inner city public schools have some real problems.

Agreed they do, but (and I am just speaking from what seems like common sense to me) the majority of schools are not in the inner city. If schools could get more funding for the staff and equipment they need, it would help tremendously, though I dont think it would solve the entire problem. Something more is needed, and I'm not sure what; I'm neither a parent or an expert in the field. Still, more money for education would be a good first step.

 

[Riprorin]

Quote

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
At my kids school (inner city Catholic school), talking during a fire drill is a major offence. My daughter had to write "I will not talk during a fire drill" 100x for greeting her brother in the hallway on the way out of school.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


That is just idiotic. I understand the importance of adhering to a code of conduct. I just don't agree with this intervention. That is WAY too much overkill for such a silly infraction. Pretending that the lines of black and white, right and wrong are so clearly drawn is confusing for kids and makes them angry at punishments that seem arbitrary and capricious. That kind of heavy handed discipline is just foolish.

----------------------------

I couldn't disagree with you more. Unless you have rules and enforce them, you have chaos.

My daughter screwed up and she knew it. What if everyone spoke during a fire drill (or worse a real fire)?

My kids are in the 2nd and 4th grades and they are absolutely thrilled with school. They get up every morning enthusiastically looking forward to a new day.

This year, the theme at school is the 3R's - Respect, Responsibility and Reliability.

A good dose of order and discipline is good for kids.

Does this look like an unhappy bunch to you?

Nazareth Hall 2003 Christmas Concert

 

[SarcasticDwarf]

Originally posted by: Turin39789

Originally posted by: Riprorin

Originally posted by: Turin39789

Originally posted by: Mill
Not really anything out of the norm. This stuff happens fairly often in public schools.

yup, happened every single day at the public high school I went to, when i switched to a private school , everyone said please and thank you and we had golden toilet seats and they taught me calculus in 20 minutes, even DE

At my kids school (inner city Catholic school), talking during a fire drill is a major offence. My daughter had to write "I will not talk during a fire drill" 100x for greeting her brother in the hallway on the way out of school.

Your sarcasm aside, inner city public schools have some real problems.

Agreed they do, but (and I am just speaking from what seems like common sense to me) the majority of schools are not in the inner city. If schools could get more funding for the staff and equipment they need, it would help tremendously, though I dont think it would solve the entire problem. Something more is needed, and I'm not sure what; I'm neither a parent or an expert in the field. Still, more money for education would be a good first step.

First off, I am majoring in Elem. Ed.

I would say that about 2/3 of the problems in "poor" schools stem from funding issues. A teacher that has to deal with funding issues all day will not do anywhere near as good a job as a teacher that does not.

 

[Riprorin]

If it's just funding, how come city Catholic schools outperform city public schools at a fraction of the cost/student?

As I pointed out earlier, my friend's sister taught at a city school and only one or two parents/guardians bothered to show up for parent/teacher conferences. How is funding going to help lack of parental involvement?

 

[Zebo]

Fear the nuns riproin

This is the primary reason I pulled mine from public.. My oldest, five at the time, was stabbed by those el cheapo paper mache sissors..no real harm but they refused to disapline this future night stalker and actually keep him in class!! Let the animals and thier progeny have it St Rose elementry where mine go is only $2100 ea. and I've never had behavior incidents and noticed a remarkable dedication to their work.

 

[Riprorin]

Originally posted by: Zebo
Fear the nuns riproin

This is the primary reason I pulled mine from public.. My oldest, five at the time, was stabbed by those el cheapo paper mache sissors..no real harm but they refused to disapline this future night stalker and actually keep him in class!! Let the animals and thier progeny have it St Rose elementry where mine go is only $2100 ea. and I've never had behavior incidents and noticed a remarkable dedication to their work.

Amen. That's my experience too. Given what the teachers are paid, it's a labor of love. I make sure I tell them how much I admire what they're doing every chance I get.

You're a wise man to get your kids out of the public school system.

 

[Zebo]

Here is an excellent example of the need for vouchers. Firstly it offers those with limited means a chance to escape some violent school systems or violent situtations with a viable alternative. Two, it would force more compitition between schools making ALL students more successful. For example the local Catholic HS, Bishop Gorman, is ranked #1 in both SAT's and college entrance in the whole county. And finally it would offer the tax payer a choice for the type of education you want for your child. You want montisorri school? OK You want an all-state wrestler send him to that schools coach etc.

I can't think of one reason to oppose vouchers other than entrinched union power of teachers. My mom is one at university level so I think I speak first hand when I say the system is broken and compitition would fix it.

 

[Riprorin]

Yup, the teachers union in this country is way to powerful. They'll fight vouchers to the death.

How many liberal politicians in the Beltway do you think send their kids to DC public schools? They aren't good enough for their kids, but they're good enough for the poor.

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Yup, the teachers union in this country is way to powerful. They'll fight vouchers to the death.

How many liberal politicians in the Beltway do you think send their kids to DC public schools? They aren't good enough for their kids, but they're good enough for the poor.

I've always said two issues liberals, and I'm one, miss the popular boat on.. education choice and guns.
Both freedom issues they should be more receptive to. But we have our authoritarian types too.

 

[Riprorin]

You're a lib and you are for vouchers? My hat's of to you, you are probably the only one out there.

You're a conservative, you just haven't realized it yet!

 

[Kadarin]

Originally posted by: Riprorin
If it's just funding, how come city Catholic schools outperform city public schools at a fraction of the cost/student?

As I pointed out earlier, my friend's sister taught at a city school and only one or two parents/guardians bothered to show up for parent/teacher conferences. How is funding going to help lack of parental involvement?

Parents send their kids to Catholic (or other private schools, religious or otherwise) because they care about their kids in terms of education and morals. Therefore, almost as a given you're going to have parents that are involved, and students that are raised to be better behaved and hopefully more highly motivated.