Definitely not, I don't agree with this administration or the current situation we're in AT ALL. I can't fit duty to my country and the war in Iraq together. I'm 19 and I have no idea what to do with my life, there's just nothing that interests me as far as a career. I think most people that join the military would tell you it was to 'serve their country' but I don't think hardly any of them actually mean that. I wouldn't mind being sent to South Korea in the event sh!t there ever got hot, or even Afghanistan for that matter if we were really focused on fighting terrorism and finding Bin Laden. But the fact of the matter is this administration isn't interested in anything other than whatever the hell we're in Iraq for, I can't see myself being sent anywhere else to be honest, the way things are going. If it's for a just enough cause, I'll put my life on the line for $8, considering I can't think of anything better to do. But to be sent to Iraq, and chance death for.... what? It better be a hell of a lot more. I dunno, maybe that seems selfish, but that's just the way I look at it.
My father would like to see me join the Air Force, he spent 20 years in the AF and retired a Chief Master Sergeant. AFAIK they generally don't accept anything less than a diploma though. I'm sure in some cases they'll make exceptions, but there are probably plenty of graduates applying for them to not even want to bother. Unless I scored pretty well on the ASVAB maybe? Is that a test you take before or after joining?
But I don't know really, I mean I don't know what's available out there, I'm only 19. That's my main reason for posting here, maybe I'll see something and think yeah that sounds like a cool job, I'd like to try that.
I bought the original SWAT game for the PC years ago, and I thought the sniper levels were the sh!t. A sharpshooter for SWAT was what I wanted to grow up to be back then. It's still something I'm pretty interested in today, which is why I was kind of leaning towards the Army as well, besides the whole GED thing. I'd like to be able to wear that expert marksman badge, and do something that involves a high powered rifle. Not a sniper though, I don't think I could put up with that blend in with your environment crawl 6 feet a day sh!t. I wouldn't mind bein the guy in a helicopter covering our infantry's asses though, or even an instructor.
But I don't know really, I mean I don't know what's available out there, I'm only 19. That's my main reason for posting here, maybe I'll see something and think yeah that sounds like a cool job, I'd like to try that.
I bought the original SWAT game for the PC years ago, and I thought the sniper levels were the sh!t. A sharpshooter for SWAT was what I wanted to grow up to be back then. It's still something I'm pretty interested in today, which is why I was kind of leaning towards the Army as well, besides the whole GED thing. I'd like to be able to wear that expert marksman badge, and do something that involves a high powered rifle. Not a sniper though, I don't think I could put up with that blend in with your environment crawl 6 feet a day sh!t. I wouldn't mind bein the guy in a helicopter covering our infantry's asses though, or even an instructor.
Remember that military service has absolutely nothing to do with video games. There is no quick save/reload in combat.
Take careful consideration of your job training, there isn't much of a market for snipers IRL.
SarcasticDwarf
Diamond Member
- Jun 8, 2001
- 9,574
- 1
- 76
That $1200 takehome is without any bonuses/kickers/deployment/haz duty/etc added in. That would add at least $2-300 in. Considering that you can get that by the time you are 20, that isn't bad at all.
My son is currently in the Army and feels the same way you do about the current administration and the situation in the M.E. However, he pointed out that there is much more to the military than the situation in the M.E. and the current president does not define our country, he will eventually be replaced by another president. He joined for the training, the experience, the travel, and the benefits. He doesnt wish to go to the M.E. but he will go if told to and will do his job. He is currently serving in South Korea, Camp Hovey (right on the DMZ), as a 96 B - CounterIntelligence Agent. As soon as he showed up he was told they had no 97 E - HUMINT, so he spent 2 months training in that capacity and finished out his first year. He is now beginning a second year in South Korea, but he requested to be re-assigned to another unit so he can actually do the job he was formally trained for. Great cross training and very few will ever get to do both jobs. He is now looking at future options. He is working on his college degree and considering if he wants to extend and go into their Linguistics program. He has approached this with the perspective of how this training will carry over into civilian jobs and what kind of pay he can expect in the private sector. I think the biggest thing is to take the ASVAB, find out what you qualify for, and then get it in writing from your recruiter before you sign anything. Find out what MOS you qualify for and then find out how it will translate into the civilian world/marketability. There are a lot of benefits in the military, as long as you are smart and take advantage of them.
Good luck on your decision.
14 years ago as a Yeoman in the navy I was up to making about $2000/month within 6 months of enlisting. Of course, I was married, so that was more than if you're single.
I spent my enlistment working for admirals so it's not the same as what 99% of the navy did. It was pretty much like being a secretary, with a bit more stress added in. Except during a few certain times where things happened that required us to act like an actual military unit. Overall I continue to recommend military service (at least boot camp, which was a blast), but I don't recommend it under this particular administration due to personal political differences.
There's a LOT of crap about military service, depending on your values and personality, but there's a lot of good in it too.
I spent my enlistment working for admirals so it's not the same as what 99% of the navy did. It was pretty much like being a secretary, with a bit more stress added in. Except during a few certain times where things happened that required us to act like an actual military unit. Overall I continue to recommend military service (at least boot camp, which was a blast), but I don't recommend it under this particular administration due to personal political differences.
There's a LOT of crap about military service, depending on your values and personality, but there's a lot of good in it too.
Do your homework, like you are now. You're right, most recruiters are worse than used car salesmen...but if pressured correctly (or bribed correctly), they can help a lot. Again, it has a lot to do with personality.
I let them know in the first two minutes that I wanted absolutely no crap whatsoever, they weren't to try and sell me once or I'd walk, weren't to try and give me any gung-ho America crap or I'd walk...just answer my questions absolutely truthfully and I'd be sure to get them a bonus by enlisting someone with my scores and potential. They played ball, so I went in. And with their advice I advanced 3 times in the first six months and had the most cakewalk job it was possible to get.
I do feel kind of bad about lying to them, since I refused to go in the nuke program like I'd discussed with them (bye-bye to their bonus). Oh well, they lied enough in return that I figure it's a wash.
The requirements for service are nearly gone now due to the shortages. If you're breathing and don't hit on the recruiter, you're in.
Heh I realize there's a difference btwn real life and video games. But I've been fascinated with long range shooting since my youngin days when I got my first BB gun. There's not a market for "snipers" if you think of them in a traditional sense, but in the military there's always openings for great shots. I can die standing a post, or riding in the back of a Humvee over there, so I don't consider it taking any more of a risk. Who knows, they could always end up simply making me an instructor, but at least I'd be doing something that interests me.
datalink7
Lifer
- Jan 23, 2001
- 16,765
- 6
- 81
I've been in 1 year 2 months.
MOS is 11A (Infantry Officer). Base pay is $2400/month (and because I'm from Oregon I don't pay state tax), housing allowance is $710/month.
So far I've mostly been in training (Infantry Officer Basic Course, Airborne), did a short stint training cadets at their summer camp. Been at my unit for about 2 months. I've liked it quite a bit though it is generally long hours (work starts at 6:30, and I get home around 7:00 each night generally).
Now I'm off to Ranger School tommorow morning.
MOS is 11A (Infantry Officer). Base pay is $2400/month (and because I'm from Oregon I don't pay state tax), housing allowance is $710/month.
So far I've mostly been in training (Infantry Officer Basic Course, Airborne), did a short stint training cadets at their summer camp. Been at my unit for about 2 months. I've liked it quite a bit though it is generally long hours (work starts at 6:30, and I get home around 7:00 each night generally).
Now I'm off to Ranger School tommorow morning.
HAHHAHA Niceville Florida!!!!! I was in the Air Force stationed at Hurlburt Field in Fort Walton Beach FL. I dated a girl (sorta) from Niceville.
I was in for 2.5 years (got out early cuz i hated it, applied to get out honorably). I wsa an Aerospace Propulsion Engineer Apprentice.... a jet engine mechanic on Pave Low MH-53 Helicopters. I was an e-3 (about to hit e-4 in a week) when i got out. It had its up sides, i made some good friends and a couple of CLOSE friends that i sitll keep in touch with and come fly out to cali to hang out. (Oh i got out 1.5 years ago). I hated it though because i didn't fit in there were a lot of "rednecks" and most ppl had no class all they ever wanted to do was drink and party and most thought the Military was the best thign ever because they had never experienced better before joining. In the end i missed home, my friends and family, and my old way of life. I also felt like i was going no where in life if i continued to stay in i had learned every lesson iw as going to so i decided to get out to go to school.
I was in for 2.5 years (got out early cuz i hated it, applied to get out honorably). I wsa an Aerospace Propulsion Engineer Apprentice.... a jet engine mechanic on Pave Low MH-53 Helicopters. I was an e-3 (about to hit e-4 in a week) when i got out. It had its up sides, i made some good friends and a couple of CLOSE friends that i sitll keep in touch with and come fly out to cali to hang out. (Oh i got out 1.5 years ago). I hated it though because i didn't fit in there were a lot of "rednecks" and most ppl had no class all they ever wanted to do was drink and party and most thought the Military was the best thign ever because they had never experienced better before joining. In the end i missed home, my friends and family, and my old way of life. I also felt like i was going no where in life if i continued to stay in i had learned every lesson iw as going to so i decided to get out to go to school.
That sounds much better as far as pay is concerned. Do you only get housing allowance if you live off base? A lot of people are posting their job title, but honestly I have no idea what half of em even mean lol.
datalink7
Lifer
- Jan 23, 2001
- 16,765
- 6
- 81
Yes housing allowance is for living off base, which if you enlist you won't (you'll live in the barracks or on post housing if you are married). Though if you are on base you don't have to pay for housing, which is why you don't get a housing allowance.
To become an officer though you have to get a college degree.
Heh, that's pretty cool. I used to work in Fort Walton a lot when I was an electrician. Niceville's a sh!thole though, there's nothing to do here lol. I know exactly what you mean about ppl only wanting to drink and party though, it's the same way in construction. They blow at least 1/4 of their paychecks on beer and dope. The guys in my crew used to do lines of coke and smoke weed in the work van on the way to job sites. Their spending habits fvcking amazed me, and then they'd always complain about bills and rent when they were dropping $50 a time on tiny little bags of coke that would get them high for a few hours. I think I have the personality for the military, at work I was the only guy that showed up everyday, I do whatever I'm told and don't cut corners. My dad says I'm perfect for the Air Force due to my 'work ethic', so I don't think I'd be one of those guys that's absolutely miserable at basic because they're catching a lot of sh!t for being fvck ups. I definitely plan on being able to pass all the PT's before showing up so I'm not the dude always dragging ass. I think it's like 42 push ups, 53 sit ups, 2 miles in under 15:12 now? I've got a long way to go lol.
Oh so you're not enlisted then, that's why your pay seemed much higher. I'm not qualified to be an officer, don't really plan on going to college either, even if/when I get out of the service.
clamum
Lifer
- Feb 13, 2003
- 26,252
- 403
- 126
Interesting thread.
I've been thinking about the military recently... I graduated this past Spring with a B.S. in Computer Science and haven't found a job yet. If nothing comes up soon I think I'm going to join (not sure which branch yet, have to talk to recruiters) and hopefully get a job working with technology.
I've been thinking about the military recently... I graduated this past Spring with a B.S. in Computer Science and haven't found a job yet. If nothing comes up soon I think I'm going to join (not sure which branch yet, have to talk to recruiters) and hopefully get a job working with technology.
SarcasticDwarf
Diamond Member
- Jun 8, 2001
- 9,574
- 1
- 76
Bullshit. Prove it. Sure, the requirements have been *lowered*, but not that significantly. The requirements that have changed are as follows:
1) Raising the enlistment age from ~38? to 42. You are not retired when you are 42. There are a LOT of 45+ people in the military. The only difference is that they enlisted earlier. What the HELL is your problem?
2) Change it so that you can get into the military if you have not taken ADHD meds in x years. Considering the number of people that are diagnosed with it and stop taking meds by high school, I would consider this reasonable. If you took Ritalin from age 10-13, what does it matter now that you are 18+?
3) Change the asthma requirements so that you can now get in if it is not currently a problem (it used to be that you can not have had it since age x). Reasonable I would say since you still can't get in *if it is a problem*
Seriously, I want to know wtf you problem is?
It would probably be a good choice for you, even if you only put in your 4 years or whatever it is. I've been to a few LANs where the national guard were sponsors because they were looking to recruit IT oriented people. If you come out with an honorable discharge that's probably some of the best looking experience you can have on your resume. Employers know if you came from the service you'll show up when you need to and do what you're instructed to. Or so says my dad.
EDIT: Oh and my step dad was an officer in the Navy, he also just recently retired. He was intelligence, doing network defense. He used to always stress that having a security clearance (which is required for what he was doing) is real important nowadays that a lot of IT sh!t can be outsourced. I'm sure if you were to go into DOD-CERT you could land a pretty decent job afterwards as a civilian, but that sh!t sounds kinda boring IMO.
I got a friend in the Army Special Forces, he is going away for 11 weeks to be treated like a POW, they get to break one major bone and one minor bone on his body.
I wonder how he will be like after he gets back...
I wonder how he will be like after he gets back...
Well, if that was it, it wouldn't be a big deal. But that's not it.
"To allow more recruits to join, the Army last fall amended its rule that it can sign up no more than 2 percent of recruits who score between 15 and 30 out of 99 on the Army's aptitude test. Now, up to 4 percent of Army recruits can score under 30 on the aptitude test..." source
"The U.S. Army has lowered the physical requirements needed to pass basic training to accommodate recruits as old as 41, Defense Department records show.
The Army raised the enlistment age limit to just shy of 42 in June, five months after raising it to just under 40 from 35, USA Today reports." source
"Army officials said Thursday that for the recruiting year that started this week, at least 90 percent of new recruits must be high school graduates, compared with 92 percent last year." source
Just a quick blurb on international views of this issue.
"In January, the enlistment age for active-duty Army recruits was raised from 35 to 40. Late last year, a key drug test for recent use of marijuana was softened. Last fall, a high school equivalency program was put in place for high school dropouts. And last spring, a ban on childhood asthmatics was removed.
But in a country where the rate of teenage obesity climbed from 5 percent to 16 percent over the last 30 years, perhaps the most significant revision is a loophole that allows recruits who are too heavy to meet weight or body fat limits to take the fitness test anyway." source
"Last year, almost 1 in 6 Army recruits had a problem in their background that would have disqualified them from military service. In order to accept them, the Army granted special exceptions, known as recruiting waivers.
...There was a significant increase in the number of recruits with what the Army terms "serious criminal misconduct" in their background. That category includes aggravated assault, robbery, vehicular manslaughter, receiving stolen property and making terrorist threats, said Douglas Smith, a spokesman for the Army Recruiting Command at Ft. Knox, Ky.
The number of recruits in that category increased to 630, from 408 in 2004, reversing at least a four-year trend in which the number of recruits with serious criminal misconduct in their background had declined, Army statistics showed." source
That's just a few I tossed together in five minutes. You can find more if you look.
The point isn't merely that they are lowering requirements, it's that they're doing it more every couple months since nothing they try (including massively increasing enlistment bonuses) is allowing them to meet their goals.
Thanks, best wishes to your son as well. Although there will be a new president soon enough, I really don't believe we can just pull out of Iraq without total chaos ensuing. I have a feeling we're going to be there for a very long time, regardless of how much better any following presidents are at handling the situation.
SarcasticDwarf
Diamond Member
- Jun 8, 2001
- 9,574
- 1
- 76
ok, an area of concern, granted.
I already covered the enlistment age part. Do you want mandatory retirement at age 40? If not, stfu. It isn't a problem. Oh, and the only requirement that changed was the age, they still have to bass BCT and AIT with everyone else.
I don't think anyone can comment on this. Nowhere does it state what they actually mean. It likely is that they still have to graduate/get a GED by the time they go into service (you can join and go to BCT at 17, but must have your GED/diploma before you can actually be *in*).
I would comment if there was any data on this.
You still have to pass the full PT test before you finish BCT, so it isn't really relevant.
Shocking, 600 out of how many 10's of thousands? First, cut some people some slack. Stuff happens. Nobody expects the military to be all harvard grads with 700+ FICO scores and spotless records. Second, IIRC, that class of items needs to be waivered by a person on the general staff (meaning, a General). Also, if these people have a problem, it generally gets sorted out in BCT (either the problem is fixed or they are kicked out).
Keep in mind here that everyone still has to pass the exact same PT test. Everyone still has to pass BCT and AIT. Sure, signing on the dotted line is easier, but the training is still much the same.
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