How's that tax cut working out?

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Did the "tax cut" help or hurt you?

  • Tax Rate Went Up - Income $0-50K

    Votes: 6 10.5%
  • Tax Rate Went Up - Income $51-100K

    Votes: 5 8.8%
  • Tax Rate Went Up - Income $101-200K

    Votes: 9 15.8%
  • Tax Rate Went Up - Income $200K+

    Votes: 6 10.5%
  • Tax Rate Went Down - Income $0-50K

    Votes: 2 3.5%
  • Tax Rate Went Down - Income $51-100K

    Votes: 7 12.3%
  • Tax Rate Went Down - Income $101-200K

    Votes: 13 22.8%
  • Tax Rate Went Down - Income $200K+

    Votes: 9 15.8%

  • Total voters
    57
Jun 30, 2004
13,503
102
126
So, if SALT is eliminated for individuals & only business can use it then the tipping point between buying & renting would shift towards renting. Forever, of course.
Actually, this issue was firsthand for me, because I own a rental property. No, you don't have to incorporate; yes the local property tax -- probably a state or county tax -- is a deduction on Schedule E, Rental and Royalty Income. If they limited SALT deductions under Schedule A, they also boosted the standard deduction as high as $13,000 for a senior citizen, and only slightly less than that for individuals of the younger variety.

Further, the 2017 tax law provides a 20% across the board deduction on Schedule E income, and any single rental owner qualifies as "renting for profit". This year, I took a loss of a few hundred dollars because I had to make repairs to the bathroom, together with some De Minimus or Routine Maintenance Safe Harbor deductions which can be written off as repairs rather than capitalized. So I didn't get any 20% Schedule E deduction on net gain.

Who is subsidizing whom is a matter of property tax rates, state tax rates, and for the broader deduction for mortgage interest which is now limited -- whose mortgage and property is financed to the extent of a higher level of annual interest expense.

I don't see much more than chump change in "improvement" on my taxes. They adjusted the withholding during the year, but I plan my estimated tax payments based on the prior year's income, so that I approach as much as possible zero owed and zero refunded after filing the April return. Despite the withholding change, I came very close this year to zero owed in April.

The continued deductions for Schedule E with the 20% additional deduction to net gains is tell-tale. The president's business might benefit very much from it. If you don't own a rental property, then S-O-L.
 

Lanyap

Elite Member
Dec 23, 2000
5,756
78
106
A question for the folks who have already done their taxes and owe more than previous years.
Have you figured out where your tax increase was?

A) Withholding table was lowered so my employer took out less while I made the same salary and I didn't adjust my withholding so I had to pay the difference.

B) Deduction changes with new tax code caused me to pay more.

C) Both A and B
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
50,817
1,319
126
Corporations and individuals have different tax laws and get different kinds of deductions, this is not new. Indiduals pay taxes on income, corporations on net profits. Corporations can’t take the $20k standard deduction which only individuals can, and individuals may be able to take less SALT deductions. Corporations get to write off depreciation on their houses which individuals cannot, but individuals don’t need to collect and remit sales taxes from customers. That’s how it goes.
So what? You dodged the larger point entirely.
 

glenn1

Elite Member
Sep 6, 2000
23,663
86
126
So what? You dodged the larger point entirely.
What point? You've been banging the "rich is evil" drum for so long and about every single topic in this place that your point is more like a tiny blunt nub.

 
Nov 8, 2012
10,385
386
126
Aug 11, 2008
10,454
64
126
House is paid for, and kids are all moved out, so I dont itemize. I did get perhaps 2k extra over the course of the year, including a larger refund than before. I certainly will take it, but in no way do I think the tax cut was fair or intended to help the middle class. It was a tax cut to help the rich and corporations, with a token cut for the middle class thrown in to minimize political backlash. Actually, I have never been a bothered by the federal tax bill as much as I have by the state one (Minnesota). It usually is around half of what the federal bill is, (including being one of the few states that tax social security), which is outrageous.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
50,817
1,319
126
I AGREE COMPLETELY!

We should be educating dumb fucks to adjust their withholding so that they don't have a refund.

Seriously, I'll give everyone here an Excel that I have where you plug in your paycheck numbers and it will tell you if you're estimated to owe or be refunded.
Working withholding to get a refund is just another way of saving money.
 
Nov 8, 2012
10,385
386
126
Working withholding to get a refund is just another way of saving money.
Publicly making a statement this stupid should be worthy of a ban. I honestly cant fathom this level of stupid/


Folks, I am quoting this... SPECIFICALLY to always go back and highlight how fucking retarded Jhhnn is.
 

IJTSSG

Senior member
Aug 12, 2014
784
57
116
Publicly making a statement this stupid should be worthy of a ban. I honestly cant fathom this level of stupid/


Folks, I am quoting this... SPECIFICALLY to always go back and highlight how fucking retarded Jhhnn is.
You're talking about someone who spent decades in a government provided/union protected job. It shouldn't be at all surprising. No intelligence required.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
50,817
1,319
126
Publicly making a statement this stupid should be worthy of a ban. I honestly cant fathom this level of stupid/

Folks, I am quoting this... SPECIFICALLY to always go back and highlight how fucking retarded Jhhnn is.
Tell yourself whatever you need to tell yourself, sport. Millions of people do it every year. It also provides a certain peace of mind knowing you won't have to pay. It's not like passbook savings accounts pay enough to matter, either.
 
Nov 4, 1999
15,996
312
126
I hope Trump supporters who have to pay this year enjoyed giving the rich more money. lol.
 
Feb 4, 2009
19,092
408
126
I hope Trump supporters who have to pay this year enjoyed giving the rich more money. lol.
It’s already been said, Trump just taught them to withhold more money from their taxes so the Goberment doesn’t get to hold it.
God the MAGA guys are so gullible, why would anyone believe that.
 
Aug 21, 2003
29,164
521
126
Publicly making a statement this stupid should be worthy of a ban. I honestly cant fathom this level of stupid/

Folks, I am quoting this... SPECIFICALLY to always go back and highlight how fucking retarded Jhhnn is.
He's not wrong though. Tons of people treat it as passive saving. It's not the absolute worst financial decision that people can make by any stretch even if it's a sub optimal strategy. People do value the certainty of not owing and getting something back.

This is not my financial strategy but I can see the attraction of certainty to people with little room for error.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
50,817
1,319
126
You're talking about someone who spent decades in a government provided/union protected job. It shouldn't be at all surprising. No intelligence required.
As if you have the vaguest idea.
 

snoopy7548

Platinum Member
Jan 1, 2005
2,995
262
136
Before I itemize (which is now only just $1-2k over the standard deduction), I would get back <$1k. After itemizing I'm now getting back ~$2k. It doesn't make sense for someone like me to adjust my withholding, especially considering I pretty much invest any extra money throughout the year and keep only ~$5k in my checking account - everything else is thrown into my 401k and IRA. I think I'm only taking one allowance - if I didn't max out my 401k I would probably end up owing at the end of the year, or getting back a negligible amount.

Before the Trump/GOP tax plan, I would regularly get back ~$3-4k, but it seems like the difference has been added to my paycheck due to the withholding table being changed. The tax "cut" hasn't benefited me. In fact, raising the standard deduction makes owning a home less desirable for someone in my position.

Unless you're making poor financial choices and being refunded a significant amount, getting a tax refund (or wanting to get a small refund) doesn't make you stupid. It is a forced savings account. The vast majority of Americans would immediately spend any extra money in their paycheck if they adjusted their withholding, and then be in trouble come tax time when they would have to owe money.

Any interest you could gain on a few grand over the course of a year is insignificant, and getting $3k back rather than owing $3k is better for 99% of Americans.
 
Jun 30, 2004
13,503
102
126
If consumers and wage-earners managed their money with greater common sense, they would plan their withholding and estimated tax payments so that annual refunds were zero. This is generally a point made by most online tax advice. If refunds are "up" or "down" this year, it is because many people don't do that kind of planning and there have been changes in withholding. The taxpayers may not have paid that much attention to the withholding changes during the tax year.

I use Turbo-Tax, and it always reports what percentage of your income is paid in taxes. By that measure, I pay 3% less this year than in prior years. But I really don't notice the difference.

If we pay more in taxes for our basket of public goods, it means slightly less consumer spending and less private sector investment from after-tax income. On the other hand, public goods spending has the same multiplier effect: school-teachers, defense industry wage-earners and policemen spend their wages like anyone else. Yet the right-of-center obsession with taxes always seems to ignore this balance, as if we only want ice cream cones, junk food, and a new car every other year.
 

ecogen

Senior member
Dec 24, 2016
689
190
106
Publicly making a statement this stupid should be worthy of a ban. I honestly cant fathom this level of stupid/


Folks, I am quoting this... SPECIFICALLY to always go back and highlight how fucking retarded Jhhnn is.
Lmao, coming from the guy that said the following:

Does he? Are you that sure?

If I were in Manafort's position I would ACT like I have some kind of juicy information - of course I wouldn't tell them what it is until after they sign the terms of the plea deal..

Then I would basically say "lol I have nothing /shrug"

I guess I'm wondering - do they REALLY get that much good information out of him prior to signing the plea deal to know he is valuable?
You're not in a position to call anyone retarded you fucking lemming.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
47,076
469
126
NY resident- got crushed this season although under last years rules I'd have made out even better than 2017. Three mortgage payments worth went POOF!
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
50,817
1,319
126
NY resident- got crushed this season although under last years rules I'd have made out even better than 2017. Three mortgage payments worth went POOF!
Yours is exactly the bunghole the GOP tax plan is intended to ream out.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
47,076
469
126
Yours is exactly the bunghole the GOP tax plan is intended to ream out.
Hence Andrew Cuomo. Perhaps we should have a mini revolution and pay fewer Federal taxes to compensate and I mean state-wide, to reach parity with those who soak up the money from donor states.

Oh well another foot shoveled out of the GOP's grave.
 
Nov 4, 1999
15,996
312
126
Publicly making a statement this stupid should be worthy of a ban. I honestly cant fathom this level of stupid/

Folks, I am quoting this... SPECIFICALLY to always go back and highlight how fucking retarded Jhhnn is.
For that to have any meaning, you would have to have a history of not being a stupid lying sack of shit.

Hope this helps.
 

sportage

Diamond Member
Feb 1, 2008
7,084
92
126
I spoke of the "caps". People are questioning the "caps".
What caps?
Just ask any New Yorker home owner about "caps", if you need explaining.
 

Lanyap

Elite Member
Dec 23, 2000
5,756
78
106
Working withholding to get a refund is just another way of saving money.

Based on some of the interviews in these recent tax articles there are a lot of people who don’t have a clue how withholding works “I noticed that my paycheck went up but I didn’t know why and now my refund is less”. Duh.
 

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