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How XBone graphics will surpass PS4 graphics.

F

futurefields

Diamond Member
It's simple, Microsoft isn't planning on chasing higher resolution. They are going to stick with 720p which will open up lots of room for more graphical effects. The XBone GPU is a 16 ROP unit with 768 shaders whereas the PS4 is 32 ROP and 1156 shaders.

For a 16 ROP GPU to pull off true 1080p with solid framerates and next gen graphics will be pretty much impossible.

So I am expecting XBone games to run at a lower native resolution in order to keep up with the graphical effects of PS4 games.
 
futurefields said:
It's simple, Microsoft isn't planning on chasing higher resolution. They are going to stick with 720p which will open up lots of room for more graphical effects. The XBone GPU is a 16 ROP unit with 768 shaders whereas the PS4 is 32 ROP and 1156 shaders.
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What happens if ps4 game developer uses 720p or dynamic resolution?
 
Crap, I accidentally clicked on the teen forum. My brain literally exploded trying to understand the OP.
 
futurefields said:
It's simple, Microsoft isn't planning on chasing higher resolution. They are going to stick with 720p which will open up lots of room for more graphical effects. The XBone GPU is a 16 ROP unit with 768 shaders whereas the PS4 is 32 ROP and 1156 shaders.

For a 16 ROP GPU to pull off true 1080p with solid framerates and next gen graphics will be pretty much impossible.

So I am expecting XBone games to run at a lower native resolution in order to keep up with the graphical effects of PS4 games.
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Do you actually have an official source for that or are you pulling stuff from the air?

Both consoles are designed to operate at 1080P. The PS4 has somewhat of a GPU edge, but that will ultimately translate into possibly another level of AA/AF or slightly cleaner shadow effects. In real world terms it is highly doubtful that the technical differences will actually be apparent in games, or at least less noticeable than had been seen between the 360 and PS3. The differences will be very subtle. Both systems are X86 and both use AMD radeon variant GPUS. It's about as cookie cutter as you can get.

I've been running at 1920X1200 on my PC since 2006 and both consoles have GPUs far more powerful than what I was using then. They both have plenty of power under the hood to get it done.
 
Both the 360 and PS3 rarely ever run in 720p, though they were "designed" for that res. I think the OP is partially correct here, though I think _both_ new systems will only ever rarely hit true 1920x1080.
 
No+tears+only+dreams+now..+woop+woop_c868d7_4547977.gif
 
Assuming both systems use the same CPU (which is rumoured), the PS4's GPU is much faster. It's GPU is somewhere in between a Radeon HD 7850 and 7870. Where as the Xbox One is somewhere between a 7750 and 7770.

If you want to get a rough judge of performance, here's the best case for the Xbox One vs the worst case for the PS4 using current PC GPUs.
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/536?vs=549

Worth nothing is that both the Xbox One and PS4 should be able to produce respectable frame rates at 1080p without sacrificing quaility. Assuming of course the CPU is up to snuff.
 
The comparison is not valid, as the games were not engineered for a specific target (1080p @ 60 fps, let's say). The beauty of consoles is that you don't have to create a plethora of settings and you get a single, non moving, target to get your program to run at.

Also, you're assuming the APIs will be equal in performance, which they won't. It is suspected the PS4's API will be slightly slower or more cumbersome than the native DX API the Xbox One is using.

Realistically, developers are going to develop a cross platform game that hits the target on the slower platform, cap the framerate at 60FPS, and release it for both consoles as is. We won't see any real difference unless the developers have some colossal failures like they did this gen (MVC3 framerate on the PS3 for instance... thanks Capcom).

We might end up seeing differences in exclusive titles, but those are hard to compare unless it is drastically different. A game having slightly more draw distance on the PS4 isn't relevant to compare against a completely different game on the Xbox One.
 
smackababy said:
The comparison is not valid, as the games were not engineered for a specific target (1080p @ 60 fps, let's say). The beauty of consoles is that you don't have to create a plethora of settings and you get a single, non moving, target to get your program to run at.

Also, you're assuming the APIs will be equal in performance, which they won't. It is suspected the PS4's API will be slightly slower or more cumbersome than the native DX API the Xbox One is using.

Realistically, developers are going to develop a cross platform game that hits the target on the slower platform, cap the framerate at 60FPS, and release it for both consoles as is. We won't see any real difference unless the developers have some colossal failures like they did this gen (MVC3 framerate on the PS3 for instance... thanks Capcom).

We might end up seeing differences in exclusive titles, but those are hard to compare unless it is drastically different. A game having slightly more draw distance on the PS4 isn't relevant to compare against a completely different game on the Xbox One.
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Some people keep saying this, but I'll believe it when I see it.

The performance gap between PS4 and XB1 is fairly massive. If it doesn't show in some fashion in cross-platform titles (less slowdown, more AA, whatever would result from the laziest devs possible), I'll be surprised.

One must realize that framerate caps aren't guarantees of constant framerate, just a limit that stops it from going above that limit. Many many titles on 360/PS3 dip well below their target framerates depending on what's happening. Beyond that, many titles that aim to provide a truly consistent framerate have to be rendered below 720p and upscaled in order for that to be achievable. What we could see in some cases is native 720p or 1080p on one system, and an upscaled source on the other.

The API issue will be something to check into. After all, we have nothing concrete to go on right now. It could be that the OS overhead on XB1 negates any potential API advantages entirely, or worse.

I don't want to say anything silly, because we'll have actual games out soon. If they look absolutely identical, then I'm wrong. If there are real differences to be seen, then it will seem silly given the hardware gap to have expected them to be truly identical.
 
Arkaign said:
Some people keep saying this, but I'll believe it when I see it.

The performance gap between PS4 and XB1 is fairly massive. If it doesn't show in some fashion in cross-platform titles (less slowdown, more AA, whatever would result from the laziest devs possible), I'll be surprised.

One must realize that framerate caps aren't guarantees of constant framerate, just a limit that stops it from going above that limit. Many many titles on 360/PS3 dip well below their target framerates depending on what's happening. Beyond that, many titles that aim to provide a truly consistent framerate have to be rendered below 720p and upscaled in order for that to be achievable. What we could see in some cases is native 720p or 1080p on one system, and an upscaled source on the other.

The API issue will be something to check into. After all, we have nothing concrete to go on right now. It could be that the OS overhead on XB1 negates any potential API advantages entirely, or worse.

I don't want to say anything silly, because we'll have actual games out soon. If they look absolutely identical, then I'm wrong. If there are real differences to be seen, then it will seem silly given the hardware gap to have expected them to be truly identical.
Click to expand...

Here is the problem you're missing. Even if the PS4 had a thousand times more power, what developer is going to develop against two platforms when they can now easily develop against one. Development should be similar enough that getting the slower console (Xbox One) to run at 1080p @ 60 FPS and simply changing a few API calls to make it compile for the PS4 should also give it 1080p @ 60 FPS, thus making them completely identical.

If PC developers had the same opportunity to develop a single quality setting at a single resolution, the card they chose would perform identical to a Titan, except for heat / noise and such. The Titan would obviously run it with much less effort.
 
smackababy said:
Here is the problem you're missing. Even if the PS4 had a thousand times more power, what developer is going to develop against two platforms when they can now easily develop against one. Development should be similar enough that getting the slower console (Xbox One) to run at 1080p @ 60 FPS and simply changing a few API calls to make it compile for the PS4 should also give it 1080p @ 60 FPS, thus making them completely identical.

If PC developers had the same opportunity to develop a single quality setting at a single resolution, the card they chose would perform identical to a Titan, except for heat / noise and such. The Titan would obviously run it with much less effort.
Click to expand...

Or they could do like pretty much every PC game, including most ports- Just tweak the quality settings for each target. Only extremely lazy devs are going to let the extra hp of the ps4 go to waste. It'll render slightly higher resolution, have better AA, better rendering options, etc, etc. Or a mix of all of those. If I were developing, the ps4 would be my baseline target. I'd tweak down to what the xb1 can do and just open up the settings for PC.
 
smackababy said:
Here is the problem you're missing. Even if the PS4 had a thousand times more power, what developer is going to develop against two platforms when they can now easily develop against one. Development should be similar enough that getting the slower console (Xbox One) to run at 1080p @ 60 FPS and simply changing a few API calls to make it compile for the PS4 should also give it 1080p @ 60 FPS, thus making them completely identical.

If PC developers had the same opportunity to develop a single quality setting at a single resolution, the card they chose would perform identical to a Titan, except for heat / noise and such. The Titan would obviously run it with much less effort.
Click to expand...


UMM... I think every developer who will make their games for Xbox1, Ps4, and PC. It would be stupid to gut the PS4 version when the ability to run with lower or higher settings has to be there for the PC anyway.
 
Pottuvoi said:
What happens if ps4 game developer uses 720p or dynamic resolution?
Click to expand...

Most of the next major games with either be 720p @ 60fps or 1080p @ 30fps. Ion Storm says 1080p @ 30fps is perfect, DICE is doing 720p @ 60fps for Battlefield 4. I don't expect any developer to do 1080p on PS4 and 720p on the XB1. They'll design it one way and that's it. Only exclusives will show any difference at all, with any advantages going to the PS4 for sure.

Not many game developers will take the time to do 1080p @ 60fps. It requires more work on their part.

SurelyYouJest said:
UMM... I think every developer who will make their games for Xbox1, Ps4, and PC. It would be stupid to gut the PS4 version when the ability to run with lower or higher settings has to be there for the PC anyway.
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When you set the command for activate to the enter key but see an xbox controller prompt for "press x to enter the door" you'll change your mind lol.

Not to mention you are assuming every title will make it to PC, that isn't going to happen as much as I'd rather play Forza 5, Halo 5, Killzone: Shadowfall, Infamous etc at 1440p and real AA on my PC, they aren't making those games for PC.
 
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So what you are saying is consoles are dinosaurs....because let's face it....while I'm no graphics whore..1080p isn't exactly new tech. IIRC MS said the Xbox 1 was the equivalent of a top of the line PC right? Prove it...oh wait..they probably 180'd on that too... 😛 Everyone gave the Wii a hard time about it's resolution, when the reality is there were games that would never have been made in high resolution, then to find out those consoles were never doing much other than 720 at best it makes me laugh that anyone talks about graphics. 1080p @ 60 should have been THE ONE thing all consoles should have strived for this generation(xbox1/ps4/wii-u) instead of all this other useless crap they've thrown around. If they do not achieve that, they have failed miserably. People are not playing on little 19" CRT's anymore.

The sad truth is contrary to what someone else said above, they aren't making games with the PC in mind. Very few ported games made use of PC extras. It would actually be nice if they made them with the PC in mind, then ported them to consoles but that would be kind of counter intuitive to selling consoles.

I kind of miss the really old days when the ports were completely different from each other. Then you had real things to debate like gameplay instead of this trivial crap of which one has less jaggy shadows.
 
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ImpulsE69 said:
So what you are saying is consoles are dinosaurs....because let's face it....while I'm no graphics whore..1080p isn't exactly new tech. IIRC MS said the Xbox 1 was the equivalent of a top of the line PC right? Prove it...oh wait..they probably 180'd on that too... 😛

The sad truth is contrary to what someone else said above, they aren't making games with the PC in mind. Very few ported games made use of PC extras. It would actually be nice if they made them with the PC in mind, then ported them to consoles but that would be kind of counter intuitive to selling consoles.

I kind of miss the really old days when the ports were completely different from each other. Then you had real things to debate like gameplay instead of this trivial crap of which one has less jaggy shadows.
Click to expand...

The only hope this time is the XB1 natively runs DX11 which will translate to more titles on PC. The first dev kits and a lot of the XB1 demo units at E3 were higher end PCs anyhow.
 
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