How to setup front wide speakers, dipoles and more

[spidey07]

Wow, I've been out of home theater for a while now. I just ordered a Onkyo NR3009 and there's all kinds of options on setup and dual subs (full AudesseyEQ 32T, THX Ultra, 9.2, blah). And then there is the concept of "front wide" speakers. In my new house I don't really have surround backs and have always preferred a strong front stage with only surrounds, I don't even use a center channel although I have a very powerful one (deftech 3000 series, powered woofer).

So here's the front speakers at my disposal:
Fronts = Def Technology 3002 I think, 15" powered woofer in each, bi-polar, 2x6.5 mids front and rear, true full range
Fronts = Polk RTA 11t, old school tower 2x6.5 mid driver and a tweeter, two 8" passive radiators down to 34 hz

My front wall is 40 feet wide so maybe I can benefit from "front wide" speakers. The question is should the DefTech bi-polar be used as mains or the Polk? I would think the polk, given their point-source should be the main fronts and the DT used as the front wide. The room is huge, a full open 2000 sq foot basement.

Questions:
1) Which speaker to use as front wide, if at all? Bi-polar with large woofer or smaller polks given a very large room
2) I can bi-amp the bi-polar DefTechs, so I can get more power/volume there
3) DefTechs can take line level for their woofers, run that from pre-outs on receiver?

Thanks in advance, this will likely take some time to see what works best but that's my thinking...so much has changed.

 

[sdifox]

Given that you have Def Techs, which gives you huge sound stage, don't bother with front wide. Rear surround is far more important. Sounds like you have the 2000TL like I do, never heard of 3002TL. But then there was a 2002TL so maybe there was a 3002TL.

Also, leave more room to the back and side of the Def Tech. They love breathing room. Mine were at 4 ft from back, 3ft from side. I still need to figure out new room setup at the new place.

What is the room config?

forget bi-amp.

4 towers will be good for surround music :biggrin:

 

[spidey07]

Just checked. Bp2000. Circa early 2000s.

The room is huge. No back wall to work with.

I need spl on this given room size. 40x50x9 height. Not my first rodeo with big biploars. They need powa.

My goal is to have huge front stage, major bass, an surrounds for effects. Can't really do rear surrounds, but there are def tech surrounds in the ceiling if I need them. The size of the room is the hurdle.

 

[sdifox]

Just checked. Bp2000. Circa early 2000s.

The room is huge. No back wall to work with.

I need spl on this given room size. 40x50x9 height.

You will be fine. I have the same speaker... And it will put out sound :biggrin:

I tried Telarc 1812 DVD-A at reference level... had to cover my ears and it still hurt.

I ran them as full range and also fed it sub out from the pre/pro to the LFE input.

I am assuming it is carpet? That will soak up sound, but not necessarily in a bad way.

 

[spidey07]

Thanks. I guess I'll have to see what kind of volume I can get

Now to get two high quality subs.

Any tips on the woofers of the dt? Remember the room size.

 

[sdifox]

Thanks. I guess I'll have to see what kind of volume I can get

Now to get two high quality subs.

Any tips on the woofers of the dt? Remember the room size.

Your entire basement is one room right? Or is there a mechanical room? Maybe IB sub if you have a way to do it?

http://www.jonathanfoulkes.com/Home_Theater/Speakers/IBInstallStory.htm

http://www.jonathanfoulkes.com/Home_Theater/Speakers/IBSub.htm

What do you mean by woofers of the def tech? They are bipoles with two pairs of 6.5" midrange and a 15" sub driven by 500w plate amp.

You mean the subs right? Use the sub pre-out of your reciver to feed the lfe in of your sub.

 

[spidey07]

I mean two additional real subwoofers. I don't consider the woofers in the deftech speakers subs. Just big woofers. Not to be fed lfe.

Or are you suggesting running 4 subs?

 

[Anubis]

budget for subs?
how handy are you at building stuff?

 

[spidey07]

2k for subs. Want dual.

But what to do with the woofers in the def tech speakers?

 

[Anubis]

you can just not use them

if you are handy with DIY stuff you should check out what people are doing with the new Dayton 18in sub over at AVS, you can build duals for well under a grand and quads for around 2k

i plan on building 2 singles after the first of the year

 

[spidey07]

Lulz. I've got all these decent speakers laying around and want to use them.

I've got a hammer looking for nails.

 

[sdifox]

I mean two additional real subwoofers. I don't consider the woofers in the deftech speakers subs. Just big woofers. Not to be fed lfe.

Or are you suggesting running 4 subs?

You never hooked up lfe to the def techs? Should try it.

Do you have placement limitations? As in wiring.

 

[sdifox]

2k for subs. Want dual.

But what to do with the woofers in the def tech speakers?

You could just run the 2000 as large and adjust the sub volume to a level that is pleasing to you.

 

[spidey07]

The receiver has dual sub and calibration support so I'll try using LFE output for the woofers in the DT as a try. I was just thinking with such a wide front wall it might be worth the effort to play with front wide channels and what speakers to use as which.

 

[sdifox]

The receiver has dual sub and calibration support so I'll try using LFE output for the woofers in the DT as a try. I was just thinking with such a wide front wall it might be worth the effort to play with front wide channels and what speakers to use as which.

Front wide proably help if you have monoploes for fronts.

 

[Paul98]

Make sure you plug in your mains to the LFE your mic and mic stand and then run the audyssey xt32 correctly. Then test out the results, see what sort of low end response you end up getting. Mainly under 30hz as that is where you will see faults on most powered subs in speakers. It will also show you what sort of upgrade to look for. I would look for a subs that go down to atleast 17ish hz.

 

[spidey07]

I fear the size of the room will dictate tremendous amounts of power and air movement.

 

[Paul98]

Another great option is something like butt kickers for the low bass rumble. Also do you have REW and ran freq sweeps with it?

 

[spidey07]

Another great option is something like butt kickers for the low bass rumble. Also do you have REW and ran freq sweeps with it?

Not sure what that is, but having the ability to see freq sweeps and response would be awesome.

 

[boomhower]

You spent the money on 32T, put it to use and higher a pro to come and calibrate. He can use his tools to set your speakers up for the best sound.

 

[Paul98]

http://www.hometheatershack.com/roomeq/

great tool for checking your system. You need a mic like the radio shack SPL meter, or you can find better mic's from like parts-express that gives more accurate results. I found that it helped the most with figuring placement of subs and getting them to blend with mains. The main thing is to remove the nulls and spikes in bass response. On my system I have setup now after moving things around and getting everything setup correctly I am basically flat 15hz( or around there can't remember exactly)+

 

[Paul98]

Run xt32 and check REW first you may not need anything else.

 

[spidey07]

Thanks all. I've been so out of it this is all new to me.

Roomeq and others things were advanced techniques requiring many pieces of equipment in the chain.

 

[spidey07]

You spent the money on 32T, put it to use and higher a pro to come and calibrate. He can use his tools to set your speakers up for the best sound.

I agree. But it can take months to place your speakers properly in the first place.

 

[spidey07]

Do front wides get much sound or are they more effects? I might play around with them. The room is so huge I'm not getting much output from the DefTech BP2000s. I did run dual LFE output to the powered 15s in them but I got a HUGE bass hole at the listening position...it's gotta be 20+ db, it's non existent there. Will be interesting to see what Audessey XT32 comes up with.

BP2000 question - subs pointing in or out? Meaning woofers on the inside, or outside.