How much extra in taxes would you pay to eliminate poverty?

[Herr Kutz]

in the animal kingdom food=reproduction. its the same now. if you make people rich, they will make themselves poor by growing excessively in number.

if everyone who lives at the poverty line stopped having kids, in 50 years there would be no poverty, workers, instead of work, would be a commodity, and we would have a new reneissance similar to the one which followed the black plague.

we are allowed to quote facts, right? or just ideas?

Why's it gotta be a black plague?

 

[compuwiz1]

Nothing. I feel I'm taxed enough already. Poverty is something some people just do for a living, like a bad habit.

 

[fskimospy]

When you've got people ranting about how overtaxed they are in one of the least taxed nations in the developed world that says something.

Funny, my response was an eye roll too! I wonder if for the same reasons.

 

[Moonbeam]

We need to figure out what happened in India and China, what kind of eugenics they are practicing there. It seems that just yesterday they were filled with billions and billions of worthless lazy people, poor as dirt and worse, but today a completely elite and even superior White type people seem to be emerging. Clearly they have found an answer to the worthless gene that plagues Democratic communities in the US and have replaced it with some sort of advanced and far superior go-getter one. We need to discover the methodology as to how these ducks are so rapidly beoming swans.

 

[Mai72]

I voted 0%.

Why? Because giving people money never solves anything. You want to pick people out of poverty? Give them a good education, skills and a job. They will start to feel good about themselves, and this will lead to fewer poor people.

Giving money leads to entitlement. We have people on welfare for decades.

 

[Mai72]

We need to figure out what happened in India and China, what kind of eugenics they are practicing there. It seems that just yesterday they were filled with billions and billions of worthless lazy people, poor as dirt and worse, but today a completely elite and even superior White type people seem to be emerging. Clearly they have found an answer to the worthless gene that plagues Democratic communities in the US and have replaced it with some sort of advanced and far superior go-getter one. We need to discover the methodology as to how these ducks are so rapidly becoming swans.

I hope you're being sarcastic.

*What happens if you're a lazy bum in Asia?
*What happens if you refuse to work in Asia?
*What happens if you're disabled in Asia?
*What happens if you're poor in Asia?

You end up on the street begging for money. There are no government handouts. There are no SSI benefits. You end up broke, alone and on the street.

I wouldn't call all Asian people lazy. In South Korea it's very shameful to not excel academically and financially. You're not going to find 24 year old lazy bums at home playing on their PS4's in Korea. It's not America. Being lazy in America isn't shameful like it it is South Korea, or even Asia.

 

[Moonbeam]

Eliminate poverty, poverty will be redefined.

Yes and even now there is more than one way to be poor.

 

[Moonbeam]

I hope you're being sarcastic.

*What happens if you're a lazy bum in Asia?
*What happens if you refuse to work in Asia?
*What happens if you're disabled in Asia?
*What happens if you're poor in Asia?

You end up on the street begging for money. There are no government handouts. There are no SSI benefits. You end up broke, alone and on the street.

I wouldn't call all Asian people lazy. In South Korea it's very shameful to not excel academically and financially. You're not going to find 24 year old lazy bums at home playing on their PS4's in Korea. It's not America. Being lazy in America isn't shameful like it it is South Korea, or even Asia.

They had to have been lazy and worthless because they were poor by the billions. How can there be any doubt they have discovered a way to fix their faulty genes. We need to find their genetic labs and discover their secrets and copy them here.

 

[Mai72]

They had to have been lazy and worthless because they were poor by the billions. How can there be any doubt they have discovered a way to fix their faulty genes. We need to find their genetic labs and discover their secrets and copy them here.

Maybe it's complacency?

We've been successful for so long I believe it makes you less likely to search for success. Why should I bust my ass when the government is going to take care of me? Why should I work 2 jobs and attend college when I can live at home with mommy and play video games? Playing Skyrim and Madden is much more exciting than working 2 jobs and attending college.

Look at South Korea. 50 years ago they were poor. Dirt poor! Within 50 years they have gone from a poor country to being a powerhouse. How did they do it? Hard work and education.

 

[soulcougher73]

Lol not seen that meme before awesome.

 

[drebo]

Most of the people in poverty situations have done it to themselves (or at least made their situation worse on their own.) Things like being on welfare but owning an Escalade and having 5 children. Or single mothers with a part time job. That's not society's fault. You could be the hardest working janitor the world's ever seen, but you still probably aren't going to be able to afford 4 kids on a single income.

Now, the people who truely have fallen on hard times (laid off from a manufacturing plant that closed, etc) through no fault of their own do deserve some assistance. And by assistance, I don't mean money directly. I mean food vouchers and rent vouchers.

Also, those who are truely unable to work due to physical or extreme mental handicap (no, I'm not talking about the people who are too obese to get out of bed) should be provided for in the same way.

 

[Fern]

Without the threat of falling into poverty would people still work?

Would the elimination of the concept of poverty thereby guarantee all are in poverty?

If all are in poverty is it still poverty? I think it depends how poverty is defined. It seems for many poverty means simply 'having less than others'.

To directly answer your question I'd think at a minimum someone would need to define an objective standard of poverty and place a $ value on it (not easy, perhaps not even possible). Then determine the amount of income in aggregate and the number of people in the USA. If that income was evenly spread out would everyone be above the poverty amount? I suspect not, but then again, that depends upon the $ value placed upon the poverty threshold. Even if it could, the sustainability would depend upon the question raised in my first sentence.

Fern

 

[Greenman]

Eliminate poverty, poverty will be redefined.

It already has been redefined. I worked for several months in a very poor area. Every apartment I went into (and I entered at least a hundred) had a large, flat screen TV and cable. At least half the residents were obese, and most places had liquor and cigarettes in them. Health care was provided free of charge at a clinic within easy walking distance, and prescription drugs were low cost or free. It would have been utopia if it weren't for the gangs and trash everywhere.
They even had a community center where everyone came to complain about the horrible living conditions they were "forced" to endure.

I met some interesting people on that site, it was in many ways a whole different reality than the white, upper class areas that I was used to. Gang violence was particularly troubling. One fellow that worked for me was a gang member, and one of his "brothers" was shot twice in the leg for venturing onto street controlled by another gang. Oddly enough, the gang members that worked for me were allowed free run of the entire complex while on the job. Gang affiliations didn't apply while at work. The white guys on the crew were afforded the same consideration, we were never bothered the entire time we worked there.

Got way off topic, sorry. But I feel a little nostalgic about that place.

 

[Moonbeam]

It already has been redefined. I worked for several months in a very poor area. Every apartment I went into (and I entered at least a hundred) had a large, flat screen TV and cable. At least half the residents were obese, and most places had liquor and cigarettes in them. Health care was provided free of charge at a clinic within easy walking distance, and prescription drugs were low cost or free. It would have been utopia if it weren't for the gangs and trash everywhere.
They even had a community center where everyone came to complain about the horrible living conditions they were "forced" to endure.

I met some interesting people on that site, it was in many ways a whole different reality than the white, upper class areas that I was used to. Gang violence was particularly troubling. One fellow that worked for me was a gang member, and one of his "brothers" was shot twice in the leg for venturing onto street controlled by another gang. Oddly enough, the gang members that worked for me were allowed free run of the entire complex while on the job. Gang affiliations didn't apply while at work. The white guys on the crew were afforded the same consideration, we were never bothered the entire time we worked there.

Got way off topic, sorry. But I feel a little nostalgic about that place.

You talk as if poverty were a mental condition.

 

[fskimospy]

It already has been redefined. I worked for several months in a very poor area. Every apartment I went into (and I entered at least a hundred) had a large, flat screen TV and cable. At least half the residents were obese, and most places had liquor and cigarettes in them. Health care was provided free of charge at a clinic within easy walking distance, and prescription drugs were low cost or free. It would have been utopia if it weren't for the gangs and trash everywhere.
They even had a community center where everyone came to complain about the horrible living conditions they were "forced" to endure.

I met some interesting people on that site, it was in many ways a whole different reality than the white, upper class areas that I was used to. Gang violence was particularly troubling. One fellow that worked for me was a gang member, and one of his "brothers" was shot twice in the leg for venturing onto street controlled by another gang. Oddly enough, the gang members that worked for me were allowed free run of the entire complex while on the job. Gang affiliations didn't apply while at work. The white guys on the crew were afforded the same consideration, we were never bothered the entire time we worked there.

Got way off topic, sorry. But I feel a little nostalgic about that place.

Having both lived and worked in very poor areas my guess is that it either wasn't that poor or you missed a lot of the problems. Very poor buildings are usually filled with bugs you can't get rid of no matter how clean you are. Their plumbing doesn't work right. You end up with random leaks through your ceiling. Nobody fixes things that break. That "free" health care requires you to wait for hours and hours just to be ignored.

People also mistake the presence of a TV for a lack of poverty. TVs have decreased dramatically in price over the last 40 years. Even large ones are pretty low in cost. The other things that families need like food, health care, etc have not gotten any cheaper.

If people think that living in those conditions is so great, that option is available to you, so reach out and take it! Lets see how long you last in "paradise" before you are freaking out about how bad your life is.

 

[mizzou]

You talk as if poverty were a mental condition.

In some cases it absolutely is. So he saying goes, "You can take the xxxx out of the xxxx but you cant take the xxxx out of the xxxx"

 

[Zaap]

If people think that living in those conditions is so great, that option is available to you, so reach out and take it! Lets see how long you last in "paradise" before you are freaking out about how bad your life is.

The difference is, those not living in such conditions aren't sniveling for someone else to be taxed more, pretending that it will translate into us magically living better. Most realize you have to improve your conditions on your own.

Your take on "really poor" also shouldn't pass anyone's smell test; you're an idiot that thinks a wine region in southern California where the median income is nearly 80k is poor. I don't think you really know what the term means in any practical sense.

 

[fskimospy]

In some cases it absolutely is. So he saying goes, "You can take the xxxx out of the xxxx but you cant take the xxxx out of the xxxx"

It is far more everything else though. I know the desire to blame poor people for their poverty is high, as it absolves us of having to change anything that might affect us. We all know it's about a lot more than mindset. There's a reason why Africa is so desperately poor and it isn't because they are all so lazy.

 

[Orignal Earl]

Threads like this are an interesting insight into just how extreme American conservatism has become. I'm not aware of an equivalent movement anywhere else in the developed world.

I don't think a person should really look at anything that comes from ATPN as a reflection of the US.
Most of the peeps here are introverts who have sheltered themselves away from the outside world

 

[fskimospy]

The difference is, those not living in such conditions aren't sniveling for someone else to be taxed more, pretending that it will translate into us magically living better. Most realize you have to improve your conditions on your own.

Your take on "really poor" also shouldn't pass anyone's smell test; you're an idiot that thinks a wine region in southern California where the median income is nearly 80k is poor. I don't think you really know what the term means in any practical sense.

I said it was a shit hole. Anyone who has spent time there would agree with me, I'd bet. Your fundamental point of randomly cherry picking places was so stupid that I thought you would be too embarrassed to mention it again. Looks like I underestimated your capacity for being made fun of, haha.

I'm quite certain that I have spent much more time in poor areas both here and abroad than you have. Hell, you think a suburban hell hole like Temecula is a really nice place.

If you would like to argue that government policy can't improve living conditions for the poor in a country I'm looking forward to you making that argument using empirical evidence. Let's see it!

 

[fskimospy]

I don't think a person should really look at anything that comes from ATPN as a reflection of the US.
Most of the peeps here are introverts who have sheltered themselves away from the outside world

People here generally seem to be introverted 25-50 year old upper middle class men, I agree.

I always do find it interesting to see how many of them seem to think that poor minority populations are the real winners in our society, though. It's pretty embarrassing.

 

[Orignal Earl]

It already has been redefined. I worked for several months in a very poor area. Every apartment I went into (and I entered at least a hundred) had a large, flat screen TV and cable. At least half the residents were obese, and most places had liquor and cigarettes in them. Health care was provided free of charge at a clinic within easy walking distance, and prescription drugs were low cost or free. It would have been utopia if it weren't for the gangs and trash everywhere.
They even had a community center where everyone came to complain about the horrible living conditions they were "forced" to endure.

I met some interesting people on that site, it was in many ways a whole different reality than the white, upper class areas that I was used to. Gang violence was particularly troubling. One fellow that worked for me was a gang member, and one of his "brothers" was shot twice in the leg for venturing onto street controlled by another gang. Oddly enough, the gang members that worked for me were allowed free run of the entire complex while on the job. Gang affiliations didn't apply while at work. The white guys on the crew were afforded the same consideration, we were never bothered the entire time we worked there.

Got way off topic, sorry. But I feel a little nostalgic about that place.

Those poor people you met sound like some of the rich people I see posting here.
A guy just wonders wtf how?

 

[Mai72]

I don't think a person should really look at anything that comes from ATPN as a reflection of the US.
Most of the peeps here are introverts who have sheltered themselves away from the outside world

Have you been outside lately? It's scary.

 

[Zaap]

I said it was a shit hole. Anyone who has spent time there would agree with me, I'd bet. Your fundamental point of randomly cherry picking places was so stupid that I thought you would be too embarrassed to mention it again. Looks like I underestimated your capacity for being made fun of, haha.

I'm quite certain that I have spent much more time in poor areas both here and abroad than you have. Hell, you think a suburban hell hole like Temecula is a really nice place.

If you would like to argue that government policy can't improve living conditions for the poor in a country I'm looking forward to you making that argument using empirical evidence. Let's see it!

^ So there you have it folks, the dimshit lib who thinks "Temecula" (median income 80k) qualifies as a slum that he's had to "do time in." And of course this is him picking ONE location from a list and trying to shift the focus to it, rather than deal with the whole list that disproved him so badly I'm still embarrassed for him.

LOL! And this dimwit accuses others of leading a sheltered life?

Too funny!

It is hilarious that you having embarrassed yourself so throughly you would of course try to spin it as exactly the opposite. You've been lying and spinning and sucking the big government teat for so long that it's actually clearly affected your mental health, as even the quality of your spin has gone WAY downhill. You're not quite at McOwned levels of delusion, but it's not too far off.

 

[Orignal Earl]

Have you been outside lately? It's scary.

Not yet today no, but if all those little kids playing outside can do it, so can you
If you were anywhere around me, I'd love to take you out n about slowly and help get you used to it