How many Haswell dies do you think we'll see?

[Hulk]

Now that the graphics portion of the die is requiring even more real estate I'm wondering how many different dies we will see for Haswell?

Assuming there are dual and quad core parts I would think that each would be a separate die as it wouldn't make sense to disable two cores and wastes all of that silicon for the dual parts right?

GT1/GT2 are essentially the same so it seems reasonable that there would be
dual core GT1/GT2
quad GT1/GT2

But then there is also GT3. If the graphics portion of the die is really large then it might not make sense for Intel to simply disable half of the EU's to make GT1/GT2 parts so there could be another die for GT3 parts. Of course GT3e is just a matter of adding the separate 128MB edram.

So now we could have

dual core GT1/GT2
dual core GT3/GT3e
quad core GT1/GT2
quad core GT3/GT3e (since we know these will be the high end mobile parts)

What do you think?

 

[veri745]

2 at the most, would be my guess.

Disabling two cores is probably way more cost effective than producing a different set of wafer masks and splitting the production line. (have you seen how much area a single core takes on a die nowadays?)

There may be a smaller die part with a reduced core count and a smaller GPU.

 

[ShintaiDK]

2 at the most, would be my guess.

Disabling two cores is probably way more cost effective than producing a different set of wafer masks and splitting the production line. (have you seen how much area a single core takes on a die nowadays?)

There may be a smaller die part with a reduced core count and a smaller GPU.

With Intels volumes its much cheaper to make the mask. Dont confuse it with AMD.

I would guess on 4 dies as well.

 

[A5]

2 at the most, would be my guess.

Disabling two cores is probably way more cost effective than producing a different set of wafer masks and splitting the production line. (have you seen how much area a single core takes on a die nowadays?)

There may be a smaller die part with a reduced core count and a smaller GPU.

Intel has been making separate dual-core dies for i3 and lower CPUs for awhile. I see no reason for that to not continue.

Intel's yields probably aren't bad enough to make harvesting bad i5s as i3s a useful strategy.

I can see them harvesting bad GT3s for some desktop GT2 parts, though.

 

[piasabird]

All the data I have seen says the high end graphics will only be for i7 processors.

 

[willomz]

No, there are two i5 R suffix parts.

 

[Kippa]

Do you think that there is a chance of seeing 6 or 8 core IVY or Haswell within the next 7 months?

 

[erunion]

IVB has 4 dies. add 4core gt3, so at least 5.
Will 15w gt3 be 2 core? So maybe 6

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5876/the-rest-of-the-ivy-bridge-die-sizes

 

[lagokc]

Do you think that there is a chance of seeing 6 or 8 core IVY or Haswell within the next 7 months?

6-core Ivy Bridge-E and up to 12-core Xeon E5-2600 v2 will be available in that timeframe, 6-core Haswell will not.

 

[Hulk]

IVB has 4 dies. add 4core gt3, so at least 5.
Will 15w gt3 be 2 core? So maybe 6

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5876/the-rest-of-the-ivy-bridge-die-sizes

Haswell is different from Ivy in that GT1/GT2 are very similar, enough to simply gimp GT2 into GT1 in a cost effective manner.

TDP has no effect as they are just top-binned parts.

 

[erunion]

Haswell is different from Ivy in that GT1/GT2 are very similar, enough to simply gimp GT2 into GT1 in a cost effective manner.

TDP has no effect as they are just top-binned parts.

Intel dubbed it Gt3, not gt2, for a reason. There will be three graphics configurations.

Intels ULV parts are dual core, not quad, so it matters.

why ask a question then pretend to already know the answer?

 

[Hulk]

Intel dubbed it Gt3, not gt2, for a reason. There will be three graphics configurations.

Intels ULV parts are dual core, not quad, so it matters.

why ask a question then pretend to already know the answer?

Sorry if I came off harsh. I'm excited about the impending Haswell release. The point of my post was to spur discussion.

Yes, you are correct there are three graphic configurations. GT3 having 40 EU's, and I believe GT1 and GT2 are both 20 EU's or GT1 such a small number below 20 that it might make sense to gimp GT2 into GT1.

As for the ULV I was only stating that there is no die difference between a ULV part and non ULV of the same core count/graphic configuration/L3, just a better binned part.

I don't know the answers I'm just inferring from what I've read and I know there are a lot of people here who know things I don't. My point was for the collective to try and figure this out. Just for fun.

Again, sorry if I offended as it was definitely not my intention. Sometimes I think trying to conserve words in a post can make the post seem harsh. I will be more careful in the future. Believe me, I know my place around here. There are intellects roaming these forums that are awe inspiring to me. I am happy to just get a seat at the table and perhaps make barely significant comment now and again.

 

[Yuriman]

How about the Xeon variants with no integrated graphics?

 

[IntelUser2000]

The known Haswell die configurations are:

2 core GT2
2 core GT3
4 core GT2
4 core GT3

 

[erunion]

Sorry if I came off harsh. I'm excited about the impending Haswell release. The point of my post was to spur discussion.

Yes, you are correct there are three graphic configurations. GT3 having 40 EU's, and I believe GT1 and GT2 are both 20 EU's or GT1 such a small number below 20 that it might make sense to gimp GT2 into GT1.

As for the ULV I was only stating that there is no die difference between a ULV part and non ULV of the same core count/graphic configuration/L3, just a better binned part.

I don't know the answers I'm just inferring from what I've read and I know there are a lot of people here who know things I don't. My point was for the collective to try and figure this out. Just for fun.

Again, sorry if I offended as it was definitely not my intention. Sometimes I think trying to conserve words in a post can make the post seem harsh. I will be more careful in the future. Believe me, I know my place around here. There are intellects roaming these forums that are awe inspiring to me. I am happy to just get a seat at the table and perhaps make barely significant comment now and again.

Thanks, Hulk. No offense taken.

Speaking of GT1 do we know how many EUs yet? SNB had 12 EU GT2, and 6 EU GT1. IVB GT2 had 16 EU, but still only 6 EU for GT1. Will Haswell be 6? 10?

Even if its bumped to 10, the other 10 EUs is a lot of die space to be saved. SNB made a separate die just to save the space of 6 EUs.

Plus, as that IVB link showed, Intel is also varying the amount of cache, not just the graphics.

 

[IntelUser2000]

Thanks, Hulk. No offense taken.

Speaking of GT1 do we know how many EUs yet? SNB had 12 EU GT2, and 6 EU GT1. IVB GT2 had 16 EU, but still only 6 EU for GT1. Will Haswell be 6? 10?

GT1 has 6 EUs with 1 Sampler, GT1.5 has 6 EUs with 2 Samplers, GT2 has 20EUs with 2 Samplers, and GT3 has double of GT2.

 

[Hulk]

The known Haswell die configurations are:

2 core GT2
2 core GT3
4 core GT2
4 core GT3

Do you think GT1 will be crippled GT2's?

 

[ShintaiDK]

How about the Xeon variants with no integrated graphics?

Its just disabled. IGP is still there. Unless you think the parts that will be released in 2014.

 

[zephyrprime]

dual core GT1/GT2
dual core GT3/GT3e
quad core GT1/GT2
quad core GT3/GT3e (since we know these will be the high end mobile parts)

My guess is that no dual core GT3/GT3e will be produced thus saving money. Maybe there will be a 6 or 8 core server variant?

 

[A5]

My guess is that no dual core GT3/GT3e will be produced thus saving money. Maybe there will be a 6 or 8 core server variant?

I'd wager good money there will be a GT3 dual-core for mobile. Maybe not GT3e, though.

 

[TakeNoPrisoners]

I still wish they had an SKU where they chop off the iGPU and shove a couple more cores in as I never use the iGPU in my i7. But Intel doesn't care about enthusiasts so it will never happen. You have to pay $300 more for a SB-E and about $100-200 more for a motherboard to get that option. I would jump on a 6 core 1155 part in a heartbeat even if they charged $200 more for it.

 

[MisterMac]

I still wish they had an SKU where they chop off the iGPU and shove a couple more cores in as I never use the iGPU in my i7. But Intel doesn't care about enthusiasts so it will never happen. You have to pay $300 more for a SB-E and about $100-200 more for a motherboard to get that option. I would jump on a 6 core 1155 part in a heartbeat even if they charged $200 more for it.

This.


They're carefully segmenting the value massively only to the money careless segment to keep they're crazy margins alive.


I'd value the tradeoff volume they could get for 400-450 dollars 6 core 1155 would be crazy.

maybe even 500.

 

[ShintaiDK]

It wouldnt be worth creating. The buyer segment is simply too tiny for that product.

Also adding 6 cores would increase TDP and lower max default frequency. Then all boards would also need validation for the higher TDP etc.

 

[IntelUser2000]

I'd wager good money there will be a GT3 dual-core for mobile. Maybe not GT3e, though.

GT3 for dual core is only on the U series(Ultrabook).

 

[A5]

GT3 for dual core is only on the U series(Ultrabook).

That's what I figured. Thanks.