How Long Can An Optima Red-Top 34/78 AGM Battery Last, Or When Does One Know It's Going Bad?

[BonzaiDuck]

Here's the Optima Red-Top battery I bought for my Trooper years ago. It could've been 2014; it could've been 2016.

I must have lost the receipt in my automobile document archive. So I cannot be 100% sure how long it's been in the car.

There has been a history of sparse events. In 2017, it needed charging; I had the wrong type of charging device, or it just wasn't working properly. I took the battery to O'Reilly's for testing and charging. Then in September 2018, we'd had an accident wherein we were transporting an old 32"+ (giant) tube-type TV to the recycler. I didn't adequately secure the TV to the interior cargo bay of the Trooper. We went over the gutter at the end of the driveway, and the TV pitched backward and shattered the tailgate window.

Days later, after a Safelite rep visited the house to conclude he couldn't replace my window, I had left the driver's door open. Didn't return to the garage for two days, then found the car -- door open -- with the battery drained. This time, I had a decent "smart" charger, and it took more than 24 hours to charge.

So the other day, I noticed that the starter would hesitate when cranking the engine. The car was still starting properly, but it seemed the battery was weak. So -- two years after the window episode, I put it on the charger again. This time, it took 12 hours to charge completely.

I've had this battery for at least four -- possibly five years. Other available information tells me they will last about three or four years. But, for now, it seems fine.

How can you tell when to replace a battery before you get stranded somewhere in the rain and need to call AAA for a rescue tow?

My previous and now-retired mechanic told me that it was a good idea to put it on the charger every so often. I think he meant every month or two. Info about these batteries advises the owner to avoid letting the battery discharge completely. I think complete discharge has occurred twice in the battery's life. Maybe it happened three times. Always -- a pain in the ass.

FOOTNOTE: Effing Safelite can't fix your window if they are unable to procure the OEM rubber grommet for it. I went to an independent auto-glass place, and they just modded the old grommet and glued the new window on it, just as it was before.

 

[Torn Mind]

Best way is to spend $40 on a diagnostic tool that can quickly check starter, alternator, and battery status. https://www.amazon.com/Car-Starter-Tester/s?k=Car+Starter+Tester
(Of course, there is the con that your money is going into the CCP's pockets).

I personally believe that Johnson Controls is basically the planned obsolescence channel of batteries while Deka/East Penn is carrying the torch of providing something focused on durability and reliability.

 

[mindless1]

Many auto parts places can test batteries. If your climate doesn't get very cold in winter, you can use a battery longer because the available CCA doesn't drop too low to start the vehicle, though a climate with high temperatures can age a battery faster.

How I tell that my battery is soon to need replaced is that the engine cranks slower, and if I turn headlights on and they dim a lot during cranking or I put a multimeter on it and see excessive voltage drop, I know to investigate further.

I then check whether the battery is reaching full charge voltage, staying near there with vehicle undisturbed for a few hours. I make sure it's not low on water if not maintenance free, that battery terminals are corrosion free, and alternator is putting out expected ~14.(n) voltage with engine running.

In other words if no other problems are found to account for a low battery capacity, the battery is replaced. Don't forget to check the OTHER end of the starter cable too, at the starter. On a vehicle that old you could have corrosion there instead of the battery end that everyone thinks about first.

If it's going to be a hardship to get stranded somewhere, go ahead and replace it. 4+ years is not a bad run for a flooded lead acid battery.

I've no problem with using Johnson Controls batteries like those Everstart Maxx sold at walmart for around $100, but have heard rumors that the Optimas have gone down in quality and aren't worth the extra money these days.

If you figure that you're going to be accidentally deep cycling your battery in the future, you might want an Optima yellow instead or if it doesn't get very cold there, any major brand deep cycle battery. Deep discharge, as complete as can happen from a resistive load like a light bulb, is VERY hard on starter batteries.

There used to be somebody that made a low voltage disconnect device for saving batteries from draining below some threshold which was meant to keep enough capacity to start the vehicle still, but with most vehicles for the last 20+ years already having a battery saver circuit built in to disconnect "most* common drains, I don't know if such a thing is still made for aftermarket installation.

 

[Torn Mind]

Many auto parts places can test batteries. If your climate doesn't get very cold in winter, you can use a battery longer because the available CCA doesn't drop too low to start the vehicle, though a climate with high temperatures can age a battery faster.

How I tell that my battery is soon to need replaced is that the engine cranks slower, and if I turn headlights on and they dim a lot during cranking or I put a multimeter on it and see excessive voltage drop, I know to investigate further.

I then check whether the battery is reaching full charge voltage, staying near there with vehicle undisturbed for a few hours. I make sure it's not low on water if not maintenance free, that battery terminals are corrosion free, and alternator is putting out expected ~14.(n) voltage with engine running.

In other words if no other problems are found to account for a low battery capacity, the battery is replaced. Don't forget to check the OTHER end of the starter cable too, at the starter. On a vehicle that old you could have corrosion there instead of the battery end that everyone thinks about first.

If it's going to be a hardship to get stranded somewhere, go ahead and replace it. 4+ years is not a bad run for a flooded lead acid battery.

I've no problem with using Johnson Controls batteries like those Everstart Maxx sold at walmart for around $100, but have heard rumors that the Optimas have gone down in quality and aren't worth the extra money these days.

If you figure that you're going to be accidentally deep cycling your battery in the future, you might want an Optima yellow instead or if it doesn't get very cold there, any major brand deep cycle battery. Deep discharge, as complete as can happen from a resistive load like a light bulb, is VERY hard on starter batteries.

There used to be somebody that made a low voltage disconnect device for saving batteries from draining below some threshold which was meant to keep enough capacity to start the vehicle still, but with most vehicles for the last 20+ years already having a battery saver circuit built in to disconnect "most* common drains, I don't know if such a thing is still made for aftermarket installation.

It depends on local area, but the Walmarts in my area seem to source their Everstart Maxx batteries from East Penn based on the cover of the battery I see. Being on the east coast, I guess that makes sense.

Toyota True-2s are spec'd to suck. Acid leaks out of the positive battery terminal and the battery weakens to the point it can prematurely take out a starter via killing the windings once every three years. If it wasn't for cheap Chinese overstock via Ebay, it'd be a pretty penny to be replacing a positive battery terminal and starter every three years. The way the particular dealer rolls is that they give $35 off every three months to parts or service transaction, so the battery comes out to $90 after core is returned.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Many thanks for the insightful replies.

This is the sort of thing I never bothered to worry about much until I could see that the charger would just seem to take forever to bring the battery to 100% -- or not at all. In other words, wait until the old battery becomes an inconvenience and then replace it.

I'll especially take the advice to purchase the Jhi-neese testing device -- probably a worthwhile investment.

I can't speak to which brand and manufacture is better, so I'll take these other thoughts under advisement. I got a "deep-cycle" yellow Optima for my brother's truck a few months ago. And here's a mildly puerile thought: I like seeing the clean red color of the battery under my hood, and somehow recoil at the idea of it being yellow. That doesn't make any sense at all, does it?!

In the meantime, I think I'll just throw the charger on the battery once every couple months, while I save up the $300 for a replacement. Indeed, this was my inclination: as someone observed, four years is a "pretty decent run" for a battery. So -- why not? First, though -- the battery tester. Then, I'll have a better idea about when I should do the replacement.

On the matter of the starter, it was replaced some 50,000 miles ago. I don't expect any troubles, but then you never know. It's just another one of those parts that I can get either as OEM from the Missouri Isuzu parts depot (for a small fortune, likely!), or as an aftermarket unit.

The Optima doesn't leak; doesn't show corrosion and deposits around the terminals. But it has my attention now, having reviewed my experiences with it since -- when? --- 2014? 2015? 2016? It will soon be time!

 

[Torn Mind]

The reason I plug East Penn batteries was that a used Camry I have(it's the one in my brake line tool thread) came with one branded as Duracell and it apparently was bought used somewhere in Illinois. Who knows how long it was in the car when I bought it in 2015. Due to lack of use, that battery got drained at least twice but got revived twice by a Battery Minder. It's probably toast now, but it took a couple big hits and came back.

Just recently, I also bought a group 78 battery used that was made just this August. It was AAA branded and it had the East Penn cover format. Charged it up with a BatteryMinder even though it was sitting for a couple weeks significantly discharged(I recall the feeling of seeing single digits) because the screw terminal doesn't take charge with clamp charger the used parts store had. Took maybe a day and a half, but the cranking amps numbers still look good as new(about 800). Even with undervoltage, the amps flow out.

The cheaper ones are flooded and they do have AGMs like the Deka Intimidator for about $200. Now, major chains like Sams Club and I think NAPA do carry them with differing labels, and they have an "official" distribution store here and there, but many small stores with a small or no online presence are also part of the supply chain. You'd have to google search your local area for battery stores.

Based on what I read at batteryuniversity.com, lead acid batteries don't like heat but they also self-discharge.

Letting it just sit means self-discharge is occurring and lead sulfate is being formed.

Constantly driving the car will slow that process down as the alternator provides current to recharge the battery.

However, constantly driving the car in most cases also subjects the battery to heat, which shortens lifespan. So, that's why some cars like BMWs have the battery elsewhere and not the engine bay.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

The reason I plug East Penn batteries was that a used Camry I have(it's the one in my brake line tool thread) came with one branded as Duracell and it apparently was bought used somewhere in Illinois. Who knows how long it was in the car when I bought it in 2015. Due to lack of use, that battery got drained at least twice but got revived twice by a Battery Minder. It's probably toast now, but it took a couple big hits and came back.

Just recently, I also bought a group 78 battery used that was made just this August. It was AAA branded and it had the East Penn cover format. Charged it up with a BatteryMinder even though it was sitting for a couple weeks significantly discharged(I recall the feeling of seeing single digits) because the screw terminal doesn't take charge with clamp charger the used parts store had. Took maybe a day and a half, but the cranking amps numbers still look good as new(about 800). Even with undervoltage, the amps flow out.

The cheaper ones are flooded and they do have AGMs like the Deka Intimidator for about $200. Now, major chains like Sams Club and I think NAPA do carry them with differing labels, and they have an "official" distribution store here and there, but many small stores with a small or no online presence are also part of the supply chain. You'd have to google search your local area for battery stores.

Based on what I read at batteryuniversity.com, lead acid batteries don't like heat but they also self-discharge.

Letting it just sit means self-discharge is occurring and lead sulfate is being formed.

Constantly driving the car will slow that process down as the alternator provides current to recharge the battery.

However, constantly driving the car in most cases also subjects the battery to heat, which shortens lifespan. So, that's why some cars like BMWs have the battery elsewhere and not the engine bay.

Illuminating. It all makes sense; I didn't really consider these factors before.

I was looking at the battery a few hours ago, and it has a label "2/15" -- February, 2015. It's five years old and had about two complete discharges. It all seems up to snuff now -- my charging voltage displayed on my USB QC charger settles at about 13.3V with the car idling. I think I can take my time with this, but if I begin to have battery troubles I'll at least have a plan to do the replacement. I can probably make the swap in the O'Reilly's parking lot and deliver the core when I order the battery.