I'm going to upgrade from my 600 Mhz Athlon this winter and I want to know what I should be able to get with $400 spending dough. I don't need a monitor, sound card or hard drive but everything else is pretty much worthless. What kind of AMD system can I expect get in ~2 months?
How far will $400 take me?
- Thread starter MAME
- Start date
2500+/nf7-s/512 buffalo pc3200
you may be able to squeeze a 9600 pro in there is you look for in FS/FT
you may be able to squeeze a 9600 pro in there is you look for in FS/FT
2500+/your choice of MB - $120-$150
512mb PC3200 memory - $80-$110
Radeon 9600pro - $120-$130
_________________________________
$320-$390 depending on the minor details of brand, type, etc...
512mb PC3200 memory - $80-$110
Radeon 9600pro - $120-$130
_________________________________
$320-$390 depending on the minor details of brand, type, etc...
NesuD
Diamond Member
- Oct 9, 1999
- 4,999
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CD/DVD ROM Drives
LG Electronics Beige 52X CD-ROM, Model GCR-8523B (B), OEM $15.99
Corsair Value Select 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-3200 cas3 - OEM Warranty: Lifetime $82.00 at 333 bus it should work at cas 2.5. The spd on the one i just got says it is cas 2.5 at 400mhz
Motherboards - AMD
Biostar Motherboard for AMD Athlon/Athlon XP/ Duron Processor, Model# M7NCD
Specifications:
Supported CPU: Socket A AMD Athlon/Athlon XP/Duron Processors
Chipset: NVIDIA nForce2 SPP + MCP
FSB: 200/266/333/400
RAM: 2x DIMM for DDR200/266/333/400
IDE: 2x UDMA 33/66/100/133
Slots: 1x AGP 4X/8X, 5x PCI
Ports: 2xCOM,1xLPT,2xUSB,1xLAN,Audio Ports
Onboard Audio: Realtek ALC650 6-Channel AC97 CODEC
Onboard LAN: MCP NVIDIA MAC + Realtek ALC650 PHY
Form Factor: ATX more info>
$58.00
This is a no frills board. single channel memory which is still pretty good on the nforce2. Not much overclocking potential with it either, no multis or voltage setting in the bios. bus speed is available though. It is however dirt cheap although I only paid 49 for it earlier this week.
Processors
AMD Athlon XP 2500+ "Barton", 333 FSB, 512K Cache Processor - Retail $91.00
Sapphire Atlantis ATI RADEON 9600 PRO 128MB 8X AGP DVI/TV LITE BOX $148.00
Subtotal » $394.99
shipping $ 10.00
Grand Total » $ 404.99
this is all newegg pricing as of this time.
Wow, not bad! A few questions:
Why are all Sapphire cards so much cheaper in comparison?
Would the EPOX nForce2 board perform any better?
What does 2.5 cas refer to and do I have to change something in BIOS for the RAM?
Why are Sapphire cheaper? Maybe they have efficient production facility, or accept less profit... dunno.
As for the mb, just make sure it has the features you need. I have that Biostar mb, and it works fine. It has no SATA or firewire, so look elsewhere if you need that shiznits. I'm pretty sure there's little real speed diff between the various nForce2 mb's.
CAS is like latency or time between receiving and sending data. Lower CAS is better. Value RAM has a CAS of 3.0, average is 2.5, and good stuff is 2.0. It's not as big a deal as it's hyped up to be, tho. The RAM has an automatic setting, so the computer will treat it as CAS 2.5 unless you change it. You can do that in your BIOS, in the same place where you change CPU FSB & multipier. It's always worth a try to drop your timings down to the lowest setting, and if your comp runs stable, then it's a free speed bonus
As for the mb, just make sure it has the features you need. I have that Biostar mb, and it works fine. It has no SATA or firewire, so look elsewhere if you need that shiznits. I'm pretty sure there's little real speed diff between the various nForce2 mb's.
CAS is like latency or time between receiving and sending data. Lower CAS is better. Value RAM has a CAS of 3.0, average is 2.5, and good stuff is 2.0. It's not as big a deal as it's hyped up to be, tho. The RAM has an automatic setting, so the computer will treat it as CAS 2.5 unless you change it. You can do that in your BIOS, in the same place where you change CPU FSB & multipier. It's always worth a try to drop your timings down to the lowest setting, and if your comp runs stable, then it's a free speed bonus
I'd recommend the $48AR shuttle over the Biostar since it's cheaper. And instead of the $16 CDROM, I'd get the $20 DVD rom drive at Best Buy (I think that's the store that's having a sale on DVD-ROM drives until Saturday).
NesuD
Diamond Member
- Oct 9, 1999
- 4,999
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well I'm sure it is possible to find something a little cheaper but I'm not in the habit of recommending something i haven't used myself. Like i said the board was actually priced at $49 a week ago so it was the cheapest nforce 2 boards in the listing at that time which is why i used it in my suggestion. The target was $400 and i tried to get as close to that as i could and still have a decent system when it was done. No idea why sapphire is lower in price but by all reports they do work just fine. The ram works fine at 200/400mhz bus at cas 2.5 and since the cpu is a 333 bus chip the ram should run very well, most likely cas 2 but honestly i see very little difference performance wise between cas 2 and 2.5 settings. Just leave the timings selection to by spd in the bios and everything should set itself accordingly at stable settings. If you can find a epox Nforce2 board in that price range then grab it. As Far as the shuttle goes I don't see any 49 dollar shuttles at newegg. cheapest socket A shuttle i see is 55 and it is a KT400 board. The biostar Nforce2 is a superior board to that and supports 400 bus cpu's like the 3200+. Used shuttles in the past although not recently and have to say i was a bit underwhelmed. Like I said everything I suggested I have used myself recently and I feel confident that they will work reliably for you. If you are wanting overclocking features for the motherboard then you are going to have to spend a bit more to get a board with those. May as well pencil in 90-110 for a board if you want a decent overclocking board. Usually good idea to get a performance grade of ram as well if you plan on overclocking. add another 20-40 for that to. No overclocking though and what i listed should do just fine unless there are some other board features that you need that the biostar doesn't have.
Thanks very much MasterFlash and NesuD, you have both been quite informative.
Keep in mind I wasn't trying to get a price check of what's out there now, but more of what'll be out there in a little less than 2 months from now. I was wondering how much the FX chips would drop prices on the XP's and their motherboards. Sounds like even now there's good deals to be had, wee!
Do prices usually drop after x-mas? Is there anything else coming out soon that will drop prices (even if I have to wait till Feb)?
Keep in mind I wasn't trying to get a price check of what's out there now, but more of what'll be out there in a little less than 2 months from now. I was wondering how much the FX chips would drop prices on the XP's and their motherboards. Sounds like even now there's good deals to be had, wee!
Do prices usually drop after x-mas? Is there anything else coming out soon that will drop prices (even if I have to wait till Feb)?
NesuD
Diamond Member
- Oct 9, 1999
- 4,999
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Really hard to say Prices normally do drop although cpu prices seem to have been pretty static for a while now. on the other hand ram can fluctuate pretty wildly from time to time. been pretty steady lately but who knows what it will do in 2 months. As yo can see from my post the motherboard actually went up 9 bucks in a week. My guess is that you will be able to stay very close to that list for 400 in feb might be a little lower or could be a bit higher but very close. It's been my experience that in Jan and Feb availability on components at Newegg is not as consistant so it may be harder to get all the right things in stock at the same time. maybe not but certain things were out of stock a lot more this past Jan and Feb than normal. Probably the result of slow season inventory reductions.
I don't think that the FX is going to affect the price of the XP a whole lot. AMD is targeting those processors at two different markets. The FX is for the "computer enthusiast", the XP is the mainstream chip, Duron for budget systems, and Opteron for workstations/servers.
buffalo pc3200 with run cas 2 @ 200 MHZ and corsair VS wont, considering they are about the same $, there is no reason to get the VS
NesuD
Diamond Member
- Oct 9, 1999
- 4,999
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From everything i have heard while it seem a lot of the buffalo is good but i have also heard about some real crap buffalo modules to. Like i said I am only suggesting something i have used myself. Haven't used buffalo. If i want cas2 ram i would go for XMS or mushkin. Personally i never even heard of buffalo until a few months ago so I play it safe and stay with someone i know. Besides the performance diff between cas2 and 2.5 which the VS does just fine is undetectable except when running a memory benchmarking app. cas2 versus cas2.5 is overrated. In addition with that board there are basically no overclocking options so the ram shouldn't be run at 400 anyway should be at 333 and cas 2 is a go at 333 with that ram. Besides It's Corsair that name is worth a lot more than the Buffalo name.
I don't think the FX chip will affect prices much. BUT the Pentium Prescott coming out next year, like around Feb maybe, will push prices down IMO. Intel is really pushing for decreasing die sizes = more chips per wafer = cheaper chips. If Intel can sell the Prescott for less, it'll drive the whole market down with it. The laws of supply & demand being what they are... We'll see though. Until a couple months after Prescott comes out, and Intel drops the inflated/novelty prices of the new chip, then we'll prob start seeing some better deals mid '04.
Oh yeah, and I'd like to see a link for that Shuttle board... Shuttle typically sells low cost, low feature boards. As for overclocking, I bumped my FSB on my XP2500+ up to 200 without increasing voltage, and is running stable with my Crucial RAM set at "Turbo" setting in Bios. Can't really complain about it. Just my experience, for what it's worth.
Arg, that's 6 months longer than I was looking at. a $400 might depreciate quickly, but I think I'll be able to afford it and it'll be a nice upgrade to my pos!
So is the 2500+ Barton better than a 2600+ XP in any way? The prices are basically the same.
So is the 2500+ Barton better than a 2600+ XP in any way? The prices are basically the same.
The Barton has 512 KB of L2, the XP only has 256 KB. I know that the 2500+ Barton OC's like a champ. Don't know about the 2600+ XP. I'd take the Barton between the 2, for the extra cache.
buffalo is basically the corsair of japan. the ram with the winbond modules are the good ones that can run cas 2 @ 200 mhz, fortunately you can be assured winbond through newegg. i have tested 4 sticks and all do 400 mhz just fine. also, with AMD systems, there is a BIG difference between cas 2 and 2.5. yes the corsair name is worth a lot more, if you want to pay a lot more and get the same performance go with corsair. im not biased here cuz i have used both corsair and buffalo and they overclock the same, run the same timings, etc... so i cant justify paying an arm and a leg for corsair when i can get the same thing for a lot cheaper
btw, if the board has no overclocking features i recommend looking into a better board. a $89 NF7-s comes to mind
The XP2500+ and 2600+ are neck and neck in most benchmarks. I think the 2500+ has a little more headroom for overclocking. For about $90 retail it's hard to beat either choice.
what power supply would need to be used to accomidate the XP 2600+, ATI 9600 and the other goodies listed above?
Do NOT get a sapphire card. they are so cheap b/c 1/2 the pipelines are disabled. Spend the extra $50 and get a full 9600 Pro. Thank you
I assume you don't need a new case nor a new optical drive.
I'd do this:
Shuttle nforce2 ultra AN35n-ultra $68
Kreton 256MB pc3200 $37 times 2 $74
Barton2500+ oem $86
ATI 9600 pro 400 core 600 memory $153.50
Thermalright SLK-947-U $39.99
Antec 92mm SmartCool #18.50
Total $439.99
OC the 2500 to 3200 speeds. The motherboard is as fast a any other nforce2 ultra and has all the ocing options. Memory is dual channel, it does make a difference. The 9600pro has 600 mhz memory, not 400 like the cheaper ones do.
I'd do this:
Shuttle nforce2 ultra AN35n-ultra $68
Kreton 256MB pc3200 $37 times 2 $74
Barton2500+ oem $86
ATI 9600 pro 400 core 600 memory $153.50
Thermalright SLK-947-U $39.99
Antec 92mm SmartCool #18.50
Total $439.99
OC the 2500 to 3200 speeds. The motherboard is as fast a any other nforce2 ultra and has all the ocing options. Memory is dual channel, it does make a difference. The 9600pro has 600 mhz memory, not 400 like the cheaper ones do.
Originally posted by: Overkiller
Do NOT get a sapphire card. they are so cheap b/c 1/2 the pipelines are disabled. Spend the extra $50 and get a full 9600 Pro. Thank you
But is there a $50 difference in preformance as well?
And what kind of power supply do I need to power these newer computers??
Originally posted by: MAME
Originally posted by: Overkiller
Do NOT get a sapphire card. they are so cheap b/c 1/2 the pipelines are disabled. Spend the extra $50 and get a full 9600 Pro. Thank you
But is there a $50 difference in preformance as well?
And what kind of power supply do I need to power these newer computers??
the power supply you have now should do fine. The 9600pro doesn't draw that much power.
That is an utter lie about the Sapphire cards. Their cards are no different than any other ATI cards. In fact, they make the ATI branded cards as well. THey are cheaper because they don't advertise as much, have the same warranty, and are OEM rather than retail.
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