How does the US welfare system work?

[XZeroII]

Originally posted by: yowolabi

Originally posted by: Fencer128
[

So, you really see no instances where people are going to suffer/starve through no fault of their own? How would this say matter if we had a similar situation to the great depression come around again - mass redundancies?

I find this debate interesting. In the UK we have a welfare state. Although many see problems with it similar to you - no one really wants to scrap it. The majority either think that "you will always have abusers" in the same way I guess "guilty men will always go free if we have a system of innocent until proved guilty" - a necessary evil if you want the right people to get the help. People really only push for reform. I thought it may be similar in the US.

Andy

It is like this. You just happen to have met some of the more ____ members who believe that welfare is totally unnecessary. I'm personally in favor of welfare reform, and in the past decade or so we've been making some steps. One of the programs I like best is the welfare to work program where in order to be on welfare you have to enroll in a program that helps you learn job skills and find employment.

If after a certain amount of time, you haven't made any progress, then you're at risk of losing your welfare money. What needs to be done is to make sure that all welfare programs are designed to get people off of welfare eventually. What some of these more cynical members don't realize is that there are some people who are working full time while on welfare.

After my parents divorce and my dad's disappearance, my mom had to find work. She got a minimum wage job as an airport screener which required a two hour commute on public transportation each way. She worked overtime almost every day to afford the rent on a 1 bedroom apartment in the only neighborhood she could afford. That's a total of about 18 hours for work every day. She had two kids living with her and one in college. Even with all that work, without food stamps we would have starved. 10 years later, all of her kids are out of college and she owns a house, a car, and perfect credit. She is far from an exception to the type of people that use welfare, but all some people want to believe in are crack moms and 8 kids. There are many people who do use welfare as a temporary step to survive while they better themselves.

Please show me one example of someone on welfare with a $3000 tv and starving kids. Myths like these are why some feel so callously about it.

I agree with what you said. You are an example of someone who used the system the way it was meant. You make me happy.

 

[Fencer128]

Very true, however, a person can live (not nicely, but live) off $1,000 per month. If they have been laid off, unemployment kicks in (McDonalds is always an option). As for education, here in America education is free until you graduate HS. If you drop out, that is your own fault. There is no excuse for not having a basic eduation here (I don't know how it is by you). If you are really unintelligent (mentally retarded) then you shouldn't be on welfare anyway...you should be on some sort of disability compensation.

Thanks for answering my questions. What I don't understand is how they get the $1000/month if there's no welfare? BTW - I think you can live off a lot less than that. If you were on welfare in Britain you'd get ~$120/week.

Cheers,

Andy

 

[Mustangrrl]

Please note my reply in this thread...

I explained the federal requirements for welfare at the GG forums...

Amendment -- there ARE some lazy people on welfare, but they quickly lose their medical and cash benefits for noncooperation... you cannot do NOTHING if you receive welfare, that's just how it is.

Enjoy

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: yowolabi

Originally posted by: Fencer128
[

So, you really see no instances where people are going to suffer/starve through no fault of their own? How would this say matter if we had a similar situation to the great depression come around again - mass redundancies?

I find this debate interesting. In the UK we have a welfare state. Although many see problems with it similar to you - no one really wants to scrap it. The majority either think that "you will always have abusers" in the same way I guess "guilty men will always go free if we have a system of innocent until proved guilty" - a necessary evil if you want the right people to get the help. People really only push for reform. I thought it may be similar in the US.

Andy

It is like this. You just happen to have met some of the more ____ members who believe that welfare is totally unnecessary. I'm personally in favor of welfare reform, and in the past decade or so we've been making some steps. One of the programs I like best is the welfare to work program where in order to be on welfare you have to enroll in a program that helps you learn job skills and find employment.

If after a certain amount of time, you haven't made any progress, then you're at risk of losing your welfare money. What needs to be done is to make sure that all welfare programs are designed to get people off of welfare eventually. What some of these more cynical members don't realize is that there are some people who are working full time while on welfare.

After my parents divorce and my dad's disappearance, my mom had to find work. She got a minimum wage job as an airport screener which required a two hour commute on public transportation each way. She worked overtime almost every day to afford the rent on a 1 bedroom apartment in the only neighborhood she could afford. That's a total of about 18 hours for work every day. She had two kids living with her and one in college. Even with all that work, without food stamps we would have starved. 10 years later, all of her kids are out of college and she owns a house, a car, and perfect credit. She is far from an exception to the type of people that use welfare, but all some people want to believe in are crack moms and 8 kids. There are many people who do use welfare as a temporary step to survive while they better themselves.

Please show me one example of someone on welfare with a $3000 tv and starving kids. Myths like these are why some feel so callously about it.

Sure. There used to be a little shotgun house off a main road that you could see while driving by. The kids played outside in rags, whikle the adults set inside with the door open. The house was maybe 500 SQ ft but right across from the door was the LARGEST and most expensive TV I have ever seen. Normally when you would drive by, the youngest kid would be playing in the trash can.

 

[rudder]

Originally posted by: Fencer128


Thank you. If you (or anyone else) has the time. Could someone explain the phrase "Tenncare limits you to which doctors you can see etc." a bit. Is there some two tier standard of healthcare? Are they really that different and does medical insurance cost a lot?

Cheers,

Andy

Certain doctors won't take Tenncare because it does not reimburse them at the same rate as say a commericial insurance company. There are other rules and regulations that make it more difficult for doctors to getting money from Tenncare. Some are owed quite a lot of money and refuse to take any more Tenncare patients. This limits the person who has Tenncare. It does not necessarily mean the care they receive is substandard, but they may not have access to the best doctors that could help.

 

[Ausm]

Originally posted by: Nitemare
Basically anyone who is too lazy to work won't starve to death. Also, you get paid per kid, so you have alot of trailer trash and ghetto babies running around not knowing who their father is so they can get a check.

not everyone who lives in a trailer is trash buddy!!

Ausm

 

[yowolabi]

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: yowolabi

Originally posted by: Fencer128
[

So, you really see no instances where people are going to suffer/starve through no fault of their own? How would this say matter if we had a similar situation to the great depression come around again - mass redundancies?

I find this debate interesting. In the UK we have a welfare state. Although many see problems with it similar to you - no one really wants to scrap it. The majority either think that "you will always have abusers" in the same way I guess "guilty men will always go free if we have a system of innocent until proved guilty" - a necessary evil if you want the right people to get the help. People really only push for reform. I thought it may be similar in the US.

Andy

It is like this. You just happen to have met some of the more ____ members who believe that welfare is totally unnecessary. I'm personally in favor of welfare reform, and in the past decade or so we've been making some steps. One of the programs I like best is the welfare to work program where in order to be on welfare you have to enroll in a program that helps you learn job skills and find employment.

If after a certain amount of time, you haven't made any progress, then you're at risk of losing your welfare money. What needs to be done is to make sure that all welfare programs are designed to get people off of welfare eventually. What some of these more cynical members don't realize is that there are some people who are working full time while on welfare.

After my parents divorce and my dad's disappearance, my mom had to find work. She got a minimum wage job as an airport screener which required a two hour commute on public transportation each way. She worked overtime almost every day to afford the rent on a 1 bedroom apartment in the only neighborhood she could afford. That's a total of about 18 hours for work every day. She had two kids living with her and one in college. Even with all that work, without food stamps we would have starved. 10 years later, all of her kids are out of college and she owns a house, a car, and perfect credit. She is far from an exception to the type of people that use welfare, but all some people want to believe in are crack moms and 8 kids. There are many people who do use welfare as a temporary step to survive while they better themselves.

Please show me one example of someone on welfare with a $3000 tv and starving kids. Myths like these are why some feel so callously about it.

Sure. There used to be a little shotgun house off a main road that you could see while driving by. The kids played outside in rags, whikle the adults set inside with the door open. The house was maybe 500 SQ ft but right across from the door was the LARGEST and most expensive TV I have ever seen. Normally when you would drive by, the youngest kid would be playing in the trash can.

How do you know that they were on welfare? Maybe the reason they were in rags and a small house was because the dad spent all the money from his job on a tv. Maybe they bought it on credit cause someone told them they could declare bankruptcy and keep it. Maybe they won the t.v. in a contest. Maybe they have plenty of money but don't care about the size of their house or what play clothes their kids wear. There are hundreds of possibilities other than someone abusing the welfare system. There is no factual or logical basis to assume that this explanation is correct.

 

[nemesismk2]

I find this debate interesting. In the UK we have a welfare state. Although many see problems with it similar to you - no one really wants to scrap it. The majority either think that "you will always have abusers" in the same way I guess "guilty men will always go free if we have a system of innocent until proved guilty" - a necessary evil if you want the right people to get the help. People really only push for reform. I thought it may be similar in the US.

Andy

Huh there's a welfare state in the UK who pay you when your not working? I wouldn't know I've never been unemployed, the government and my bank manager loves hard working people like me.

I personally think the whole UK welfare system needs to reformed, there's far too many people who can work but are too lazy to work and are abusing the system. I also have a problem with giving asylum seekers money, they should be given some form of tokens to purchase food or put up in concentration camps (or should that be in dentention centre's?).

I have sympathy for the people who want to work but can't due to sickness or disability, anyone else who is unemployed needs to get off their fat ass and get a job. :disgust:

As for the comment about trailer park trash that's bullshit, I had a sexy black honey who lived in a trailer park and she was a real lady, she was much more classy than any cheap English tart for example.

 

[yoda291]

I honestly think the reason that people are so against welfare is because they are under the impression that they are the ones paying for it with their tax money. This assumption probably isn't ungrounded, but the fact of the matter is, most people would not have a problem with welfare if, when they receive their paycheck, they don't see the government taking 1/3 to 1/2 of it away. In this country, if you are offered a job at 36,000/yr, you end up taking home about 24,000 dollars. It used to be that making over 100,000 dollars in this country was a good deal, except the rise in cost of living coupled with the rise in taxes has soured the working public. The sting is greatly increased when you see countries like korea where there is no welfare system, and income tax is 3-6%. I imagine a good amount of this is made up for in other taxes korean people have to pay, but we usually just ignore things like that.

Personally, I have 3 theories as to why our taxes are so high.
- reagan/bush economics fluffified the deficit.
- welfare
- because the american people aren't unified enough to stop them from levying all those taxes.

 

[nemesismk2]

Originally posted by: yoda291
I honestly think the reason that people are so against welfare is because they are under the impression that they are the ones paying for it with their tax money. This assumption probably isn't ungrounded, but the fact of the matter is, most people would not have a problem with welfare if, when they receive their paycheck, they don't see the government taking 1/3 to 1/2 of it away. In this country, if you are offered a job at 36,000/yr, you end up taking home about 24,000 dollars. It used to be that making over 100,000 dollars in this country was a good deal, except the rise in cost of living coupled with the rise in taxes has soured the working public. The sting is greatly increased when you see countries like korea where there is no welfare system, and income tax is 3-6%. I imagine a good amount of this is made up for in other taxes korean people have to pay, but we usually just ignore things like that.

Personally, I have 3 theories as to why our taxes are so high.
- reagan/bush economics fluffified the deficit.
- welfare
- because the american people aren't unified enough to stop them from levying all those taxes.

When I lived in the US I was surprised by how much you have to pay for everything, there's a tax for this, a tax for that it's crazy. As for the cost of dental treatment in the US, it would of been cheaper for me to fly all the way back to the UK, visit my free nhs dentist and then fly back than to have treatment in the US.

 

[Chris A]

Honestly there is a lot more waste that goes on then the $800. per month for a family of four in California.

We spend more per month incarcerating and convicting a criminal then we do trying to feed a healthy kid.

Yes there is need for reforms. Yes there are abuses. But in this nation of plenty should any kid ever go hungary or homeless?

You want abuse? look at the Thousands of people that claim Social security benefits fraudulently. This is way more easy then to stay on Welfare for over a year... Find a DR that will agree and a lawyer that will represent you and you are on your way to a lifetime check much higher then Welfare... Welfare is considered old school by the real slackers....

 

[Tigerman]

Mwilding's answer was right on the money
taxpayer money to those who are nonproductive malcontents

 

[SagaLore]

Originally posted by: Fencer128
I'm not a US citizen - and have no idea.

Is it under state or federal control? Do you have the equivalent of an unemployment benefit?

How is it that people who are "anti-welfare state" can reconcile the need for the unemployed (for whatever reason) who may need money to keep themselves/their family going whilst getting another job?

If you have the time - on another note I *think* I know that in the US you need medical insurance to get access to medical care? How does that work if you do not have the money available for the insurance - or you need emergency (ie life threatening) treatment but, for whatever reason, you don't have insurance.

Sorry about all the questions - I'm just curious as to how this all works (as opposed to the UK where I live).

Cheers,

Andy

That's the problem. People that go on welfare stay on welfare, forever. The unemployment fund pays for Unemployment Compensation, which can last long enough before getting another job.

 

[StageLeft]

Have kid get money. Have 10 kids get more money.

 

[heartsurgeon]

I know that in the US you need medical insurance to get access to medical care?

what???

emergency rooms are required by law to treat anyone that shows up...
i operate on people without any insurance (but enough money to buy cigarettes) all the time

this may be the only country in the world where a bum can fall down sick on the street and wake up in a hospital having received health care that is unavailable to a large portion of the world's population.

to say people don't have access to health care if they don't have insurance is just plain wrong. they may have better access to health care than those of you who have an HMO plan!!!

hahahahahha..what people think they know, and the reality of a situation are totally different.

in some european countries - you may think you get "free comprehensive medical care, cradle to grave", but i can tell you with certainty that if you are older, and require an
heart operation - you won't even be given the option of surgery (to old) whereas here, regardless of age, regardless of insurance status, if you need the operation, you'll get it.

make no mistake about it..the u.s. health care system (with all its flaws, and there are plenty) is the best in the world.