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How do you force a company/corporation/industry to lower its prices?

Meghan54

Lifer
Just curious.

There is a particular member here who advocates forcing a particular industry to reduce its prices but absolutely will not address how to accomplish it. (Speaking of the oil industry, btw, and I bet you know the thread.)


Here's the quote from the member:

...they (oil companies) should be forced to lower the price thus getting lower profits....


Now, I'm no big time economist, but I can see only a very few ways to "force" a company/corp/industry to lower the prices it sets for its product. The govt. can nationalize the industry, a la Venezuela's model, or put in price caps/controls, neither of which work too well.

Any other ideas?
 
The windfall profits tax.

I'm not especially good at economics, but it seems like dicking around with taxes could help.

I'm not opposed to nationalizing oil production. It's vitally essential to our national interests, and I don't like selling our blood to foreign countries. I'm not sure the government would be any better than the companies at caring for our blood though...
 
And about the windfall tax.....what is a windfall? How much profit does a company need to earn to expose themselves to being considered having a windfall?

If you go by profit margins, Exxon/Mobil, for instance, has historically shown 11% or less profit margins over the last 12 years. Exxon's highest profit, by quarter, was 12.49% in the quarter ending June 30, 2012. Since 2008, Exxon's average profit margin has been well under 10%.

http://ycharts.com/companies/XOM/profit_margin


Compare this to Apple, which has had >20% profit margins per quarter since 2009. Should a windfall tax be applied to Apple, too? Apple's profit margin is double Exxon, so it should....maybe.

http://ycharts.com/companies/AAPL/profit_margin


Intel's another that generates higher profit margins than Exxon.

http://ycharts.com/companies/INTC/profit_margin


In fact, a large sector of the electronics/computer/semiconductor industry routinely generates profit margins higher than Exxon does. So I'm just not seeing profit margins being the standard for setting windfall taxes, unless applied equally to all sectors.


But the tax does not address what the gent in question wants done. He wants someone, prob. the govt., to force the oil companies to drop the retail price of gasoline for the consumer. And unless any windfall tax automatically is redistributed to each and every consumer that buys gas, it isn't the answer.
 
Start subsidizing competing or alternative products.


And that'll never happen given the current political climate, subsidizing competing companies. And the Republicans scream bloody murder when the govt. tries to funnel investment funding into alternatives.
 
Heres an idea, but stop buying products from a company if they are too overpriced?


OK.....now how are you going to drive your car? Ideas?

We're specifically talking about gasoline and gas prices, a commodity that almost everyone uses and depends upon. Simply stopping buying it is no option at all and that notion is overly simplistic to the point of being childish.
 
OK.....now how are you going to drive your car? Ideas?

We're specifically talking about gasoline and gas prices, a commodity that almost everyone uses and depends upon. Simply stopping buying it is no option at all and that notion is overly simplistic to the point of being childish.

Well, you're talking about using a finite resource. The only thing you can do is lower your demand. We use a ridiculous amount in the US compared to other countries, but even as we decrease our demand, which we have done quite a bit (less land yachts being sold), countries like China and India only fill the gap. If you look at graphs of oil consumption by decade, it goes up around 10 million barrels per day every decade.

Until they get a reliable and renewable source for electric cars (fuel cells, solar/chargers that don't take a day to refill etc), all you can really do reduce your dependence on oil.
 
OK.....now how are you going to drive your car? Ideas?

We're specifically talking about gasoline and gas prices, a commodity that almost everyone uses and depends upon. Simply stopping buying it is no option at all and that notion is overly simplistic to the point of being childish.

If I didnt want to pay for oil, I guess I wont be driving my car. See how that works? If you want to drive your car, then you really do want to pay for gas/oil. Otherwise, get a horse/bike.
 
The oil market is a WORLD market. If force the sale of oil for less and less here in the US and people are willing to pay more offshore for crude, companies will sell overseas and export it.

That will cause a spike in demand because the supply will be perceived to be limited. Everyone will be forced to pay more if they want to keep it stateside as a result. It's simple supply and demand unless there are extreme export tariffs or tax benefits for not selling over seas imposed by the Federal government.
 
In most cases, just plain not buying the product may get them to lower the price. Gas though, doesn't work that way. Sure when demand is lower, gas prices go down, but as soon as people start using it again, it will go back up.

Gas just isn't priced the same way as most things (even if it still uses supply/demand), but the whole speculation thing really screws things up.
 
OK.....now how are you going to drive your car? Ideas?

We're specifically talking about gasoline and gas prices, a commodity that almost everyone uses and depends upon. Simply stopping buying it is no option at all and that notion is overly simplistic to the point of being childish.

Buy less?
 
Just invent a newer, cheaper, abundant power source ala Iron Man and the oil prices will go down.

Simple, really.
 
Buy an electric car. Won't be too much longer, perhaps 30-50 years ?, until the oil supply has diminished further to the point it becomes too expensive for consumers to afford. Eventually everyone will be electric out of necessity and gasoline powered cards will become a niche for car enthusiasts.

When a tank of gas costs $500 you won't see many people driving gas powered cars.

Of course going electric now will slow down the process of eradicating the world's oil reserves, so get a big SUV and hasten the process!
 
Not one right answer yet. (There are some correct posts, but not answering how to lower gasoline prices).

Here are some ways to lower the prices:

- Increase competition. This means outlawing and enforcing the laws against any sort of price-fixing, monopoly, etc. Force the market toward the modest-profit pricing and efficiency that capitalist competition is supposed to ensure, and often does in many industries, such as groceries.

- For a bit more aggressive approach, introduce a government competitor. There's a story this year about a very small Midwestern town where the residents, who average among the lowest income in the state, complained to the Mayor about high gas prices above the average in the state.

The Mayor opened a city-run gas station with 'fair pricing' well below the competition, and it did result in large decreases in price from the competition.

Everyone is happy except the private stations, and the Mayor's Brother-in-Law, a Republican in the state legislature, calling it socialism and fighting for a law to outlaw it.

- Tax incentives. Not the simple 'tax those high profits' tax - which can be a good thing - but incentives which incent the companies to policies that lower prices.

- Price controls are vilified by the right, but are one way to lower prices, admittedly a very blunt instrument that can be abused and cause harm.

It's also possible for them to be helpful, if used reasonably, telling the providers 'you figure out the way to meet those lower prices'.

An example here on the public side is the government and Medicare providers; a more aggressive one is Wal-Mart, who tells suppliers, 'meet this low price or go out of business'.

And some businesses have gone out of business because of Wal-Mart's aggressiveness on forcing price targets where they have a huge share of the market.

People have suggested 'buy less', but absent price gouging, that can actually raise prices, as it increases the costs to the business, reducing economies of scale.

It's not practical in all kinds of industries where people don't want to quit buying a product. When has that approach ever actually worked? A few cases maybe?

Usually the only chance the consumers do have, other than the rare case of organizing, is the government representing their interests.

And despite the paranoia of the right, it's not in the best interests of anyone for the government to make unreasonable demands that put the companies out of business.

Which doesn't happen much in the US, except to some pretty 'bad companies' who can't compete with a decent price. But it has in some countries.

People cite Venezuela, but there's bad and good. Having his economy held hostage by foreign interests who sabotage him if he doesn't let them gouge and take away the country's wealth isn't exactly a good 'solution' either. When he put a top to that, American contractors sabotaged the systems, refusing to give passwords, a major six month economic shutdown of the economy was organized to try to pressure the government to give in. Those foreign interests weren't 'for the consumers'.
 
Free, efficient market to produce an accurate price. Do that first.

Involves gutting the crony capitalism and non free markets currently running the show now.

Then lower demand will have an effect on price, and a real market can speak.


So we can't really fix the price of just one thing without subsidizing the larger problem in our system, crony capitalism. We'd have to fix and address the real underlying problem effecting a multitude of prices/market forces.

Fun to think about, reality of it would be unpleasant.
 
Just curious.

There is a particular member here who advocates forcing a particular industry to reduce its prices but absolutely will not address how to accomplish it. (Speaking of the oil industry, btw, and I bet you know the thread.)


Here's the quote from the member:




Now, I'm no big time economist, but I can see only a very few ways to "force" a company/corp/industry to lower the prices it sets for its product. The govt. can nationalize the industry, a la Venezuela's model, or put in price caps/controls, neither of which work too well.

Any other ideas?

You can't control a commodity, it's all supply and demand. If you want to keep oil prices stable, go after the speculators that buy up the supplies whenever there's trouble in the middle east.
 
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