How do we change the mindset of the poor to get them out of poverty?

[berzerker60]

So you think if we increase welfare the poor in the inner city will buy livestock?:biggrin:

Also, going by the obesity epidemic in the inner city I am thinking people could use with skipping some meals.

Some might. Cities used to have a lot of livestock on them, providing cheap eggs and meat to the poorer parts of the city. They could again in at least limited numbers, backyard chickens aren't that uncommon.

Too many meals isn't the problem with obesity, it's food deserts and subsidized shitty food making it cheaper to eat unhealthily than healthily.

Working smart is different than working hard.
The rich know this which is why they are rich, and the poor are poor.

Know what the best part is?
Its pretty fucking obvious if you arent a god damn self-absorbed moron.

Person A: "No poor person works smart."
Person B: "I am poor, and I work smart."
Person A: "Well, then you must work hard instead of smart."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

That's a bullshit argument that doesn't mean a thing, you're just using circular logic to define success by working 'smart' and working 'smart' by whether or not you're successful.

 

[nehalem256]

You cannot seriously believe this. If you do, then please do your best to implement your ideals so that I can join the revolution that will end such nonsense.

Now do you believe its nonsense because

(a) It wouldn't work to reduce poverty?

(b) You think poor people people have a "right" to pop out as many bastard children as they want and then force responsible people to feed them?

 

[shortylickens]

Some might. Cities used to have a lot of livestock on them, providing cheap eggs and meat to the poorer parts of the city. They could again in at least limited numbers, backyard chickens aren't that uncommon.

Too many meals isn't the problem with obesity, it's food deserts and subsidized shitty food making it cheaper to eat unhealthily than healthily.


Person A: "No poor person works smart."
Person B: "I am poor, and I work smart."
Person A: "Well, then you must work hard instead of smart."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

That's a bullshit argument that doesn't mean a thing, you're just using circular logic to define success by working 'smart' and working 'smart' by whether or not you're successful.

Actually, I didnt. You did.

Go look up Straw Man while you are at it.





Thank you, and god bless.

 

[nehalem256]

Some might. Cities used to have a lot of livestock on them, providing cheap eggs and meat to the poorer parts of the city. They could again in at least limited numbers, backyard chickens aren't that uncommon.

They can also be used for cock fighting(to earn extra income)! Loser becomes dinner :awe:

Too many meals isn't the problem with obesity, it's food deserts and subsidized shitty food making it cheaper to eat unhealthily than healthily.

Food deserts... right :\

I'm sure the fact that mountain dews and cheetos are tastier than celery has nothing to do with it...

 

[MongGrel]

never ceases to amaze.

 

[berzerker60]

Food deserts... right :\

I'm sure the fact that mountain dews and cheetos are tastier than celery has nothing to do with it...

http://www.ers.usda.gov/data/fooddesert#.U12RTlf76Ao
Do you not believe food deserts exist? Or do you think corner bodegas frequently sell celery? It's hard to make the right choice between celery and cheetos when the only one of those being sold within miles of where you live - inside of a city where you can't afford a car - is cheetos.

 

[Oldgamer]

the poor will stay poor even if we give them a bucket of $.
think lottery winners. A majority of them become bankrupt within 5 yrs.

Better education?
schools in the inner city are underfunded.
NYC has a novel way of fixing this education inequality. Instead of throwing $ at underperforming schools, bus some kids at random to better schools.

And if that school is still underperforming over the years, it will have less and less kids to the point the school will close because it doesn't have enuf kids.

but that's just for kids. How about the poor adults? Are they a lost cause?

anyway, any other ideas of changing the mindset of the poor so they want to lift themselves out of poverty?

Your title really ought to say "How do we change the general publics mindset about the poor". Because all I see is more "blaming the poor" and trying to justify taking away much needed assistance to the poor, because you know "they are all lazy moochers", right?

 

[Vic]

You missed the part where I said PERPETUALLY POOR.

And you missed my sarcasm.

"Knowing their place" isn't going to help the poor. Nor will just working harder.

 

[Vic]

http://www.ers.usda.gov/data/fooddesert#.U12RTlf76Ao
Do you not believe food deserts exist? Or do you think corner bodegas frequently sell celery? It's hard to make the right choice between celery and cheetos when the only one of those being sold within miles of where you live - inside of a city where you can't afford a car - is cheetos.

Buying celery assumes one has a pot and a kitchen to cook it in.

 

[Zaap]

No one is really going to "change" anyone else, so the whole premise of "we" changing someone else is misguided. (Let alone entire groups of someone else.) If your mission is changing another person- just go get married to the most screwed up person you can so you can enjoy "changing" them. Then enjoy the inevitable divorce.

People will have to want to change themselves, and then do so. Only way. There is no other answer.

But if people embrace a culture that doesn't lend itself to self-sufficency, but rather being more of a sub-third world minded serf (and plenty of people do just that) then that's what people will get. There is no real change for that that will come externally. You can tell people that's where they're headed, suggest they do otherwise, but that's about it.

 

[nehalem256]

http://www.ers.usda.gov/data/fooddesert#.U12RTlf76Ao
Do you not believe food deserts exist? Or do you think corner bodegas frequently sell celery? It's hard to make the right choice between celery and cheetos when the only one of those being sold within miles of where you live - inside of a city where you can't afford a car - is cheetos.

I think food deserts are a term made up to push liberalism. Considering that a farm could be considered a food desert I think we would have to agree it is a pretty BS term.

Mountain Dew and cheerios is also what I saw a mom buying her elementary age kids at bfest time in a grocery store. I don't think a grocery store counts as a food desert :awe:

 

[Vic]

I think food deserts are a term made up to push liberalism. Considering that a farm could be considered a food desert I think we would have to agree it is a pretty BS term.

Mountain Dew and cheerios is also what I saw a mom buying her elementary age kids at bfest time in a grocery store. I don't think a grocery store counts as a food desert :awe:

"One time, at band camp.. "

I think we all agree that you're just full of BS always.

 

[Vic]

No one is really going to "change" anyone else, so the whole premise of "we" changing someone else is misguided. (Let alone entire groups of someone else.) If your mission is changing another person- just go get married to the most screwed up person you can so you can enjoy "changing" them. Then enjoy the inevitable divorce.

People will have to want to change themselves, and then do so. Only way. There is no other answer.

But if people embrace a culture that doesn't lend itself to self-sufficency, but rather being more of a sub-third world minded serf (and plenty of people do just that) then that's what people will get. There is no real change for that that will come externally. You can tell people that's where they're headed, suggest they do otherwise, but that's about it.

Yes, the poor "embrace" being poor. I don't disagree with your argument, just your premise. You can’t change other people, that's absolutely true. But you could change yourself into less of a douchebag.

 

[Agent11]

Now do you believe its nonsense because

(a) It wouldn't work to reduce poverty?

(b) You think poor people people have a "right" to pop out as many bastard children as they want and then force responsible people to feed them?

I believe such action would be evil and the antithesis of the inalienable rights of man. That means I would kill and die to have such a law removed from my country. I suspect many others would as well.

Eugenics as a means of forced population control is not something for the land of the free and the home of the brave.

 

[Zaap]

Yes, the poor "embrace" being poor. I don't disagree with your argument, just your premise. You can’t change other people, that's absolutely true. But you could change yourself into less of a douchebag.

Fuck off. You're an idiot.

 

[Vic]

I believe such action would be evil and the antithesis of the inalienable rights of man. That means I would kill and die to have such a law removed from my country. I suspect many others would as well.

Eugenics as a means of forced population control is not something for the land of the free and the home of the brave.

Reactionaries will sacrifice any freedom in order to protect it. They just don't understand that rights are universal.

 

[Vic]

Fuck off. You're an idiot.

That's the best you have, isn't it?

 

[Zaap]

You're poor because you're stupid Vic.

 

[Vic]

You're poor because you're stupid Vic.

I'm not poor but thanks for caring.

 

[Zaap]

I mean for real, not on the internet. I think it's the natural order of things. That supremely dumb people think they're entitled to reap the fruits of other people's effort is just part of the culture of stupidity.

 

[Vic]

I mean for real, not on the internet. I think it's the natural order of things. That supremely dumb people think they're entitled to reap the fruits of other people's effort is just part of the culture of stupidity.

For absolute real, I'm not poor. Self-made too even.
Nor do I think anyone should ever be entitled to reap the fruits of another's efforts.
You're kind of a broken record it seems.

BTW, the natural order of things is that shit rolls downhill, not uphill. In other words, those who 'feel entitled' aren't nearly a threat compared to those with the ability to take.

 

[nehalem256]

I believe such action would be evil and the antithesis of the inalienable rights of man. That means I would kill and die to have such a law removed from my country. I suspect many others would as well.

so in other words you are going with (B). That poor people have a right to extort money to support their bastard kids

Eugenics as a means of forced population control is not something for the land of the free and the home of the brave.

But yet using children as hostages is apparently in line with freedom?

Lacking the balls to tell people what to do to prevent poverty isn't bravery, its cowardice.

 

[Vic]

so in other words you are going with (B). That poor people have a right to extort money to support their bastard kids



But yet using children as hostages is apparently in line with freedom?

Lacking the balls to tell people what to do to prevent poverty isn't bravery, its cowardice.

Thanks for proving me right. Reactionaries will sacrifice any freedom in order to defend it. It's because you don't think it can happen to you.
You're wrong. Rights are universal.

 

[DrPizza]

This just shows the poor aren't trying to help themselves.

I am sure one or two of those kids said "FUCK THIS!" and did well enough for a scholarship and said screw this place.

I think you're wrong. It's the life they know. It's the expectations of the family and friends around them. They grow up on a farm, and they know that it's expected that they continue to farm.

 

[sportage]

If you are paid a decent wage you do not qualify for assistance. Period.
Walmart knows that all too well.
Thats why tax payers make up the difference, or some of the difference, so that wally world can continue to pay crap wages and get away with it.
If anyone wants to start threads picking on the poor, start with picking on poor little walmart.
Even a 10 year old could figure this out.
Decent wage, decent life, decent society.