how do radio stations know how many people listen?

[MonKENy]

I know how cable works. You have to request the station so they can track how many people are watching any show.

But how does a radio station know? It just sends out a signal and anyone withing range picks it up. But they don't receive feedback directly of who is receiving

 

[Aluvus]

I know how cable works. You have to request the station so they can track how many people are watching any show.

While there are some systems that work this way, no, not all cable TV works like this. The conventional approach to cable TV is that the cable company streams all of the channels down the wire, and your TV tunes in the channel it wants. Functionally this is very similar to radio, but without going through the air. There is some movement now toward systems that require two-way communication.

But how does a radio station know? It just sends out a signal and anyone withing range picks it up. But they don't receive feedback directly of who is receiving

Radio ratings are produced in essentially the same way TV ratings are, and (due to a recent acquisition), they are event produced by the same company: Nielsen. The methodology is not terribly complex: they just ask people.

On the TV side of things, there has been some progress toward having the data collected automatically by your DVR or whatever. I'm not aware of anything similar in radio.

 

[phucheneh]

While there are some systems that work this way, no, not all cable TV works like this. The conventional approach to cable TV is that the cable company streams all of the channels down the wire, and your TV tunes in the channel it wants. Functionally this is very similar to radio, but without going through the air. There is some movement now toward systems that require two-way communication.

Really? Then why can't people pirate cable anymore (that I know of)? I thought the switch to digital meant they had to 'turn on' the content specifically for you...you can't just grab a signal by hooking up a tuner.

It's not the same as IPTV like ATT ('you request it, we stream it to you' kinda tech), but I assumed the days of 'broadcast all the channels at once' were gone.

 

[Dr. Detroit]

Arbitron measures radio station ratings - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arbitron

They are using a portable people meter now - http://www.arbitron.com/portable_people_meters/home.htm


Triton Digital does measurement for online radio - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triton_Digital

 

[Markbnj]

Really? Then why can't people pirate cable anymore (that I know of)? I thought the switch to digital meant they had to 'turn on' the content specifically for you...you can't just grab a signal by hooking up a tuner.

It's not the same as IPTV like ATT ('you request it, we stream it to you' kinda tech), but I assumed the days of 'broadcast all the channels at once' were gone.

It's not that simple. But for the purposes of this thread you can assume that all the channels that aren't "on-demand" are sent down the pipe at the same time, and the set-top box decodes the specific stream that you've requested.

 

[zanejohnson]

It's not that simple. But for the purposes of this thread you can assume that all the channels that aren't "on-demand" are sent down the pipe at the same time, and the set-top box decodes the specific stream that you've requested.

this, and assuming who this guy is, i doubt we should go into any more depth.. (sorry about "this guy," i dont hang out ever in the programming subforums, but i'm smart)

 

[disappoint]

Years ago I got a survey in the mail asking me to fill out a daily journal of every radio station I listen to every hour of the day for 1 or 2 weeks. It was a long time ago I don't remember how many weeks or which company it was.

 

[disappoint]

Arbitron measures radio station ratings - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arbitron

They are using a portable people meter now - http://www.arbitron.com/portable_people_meters/home.htm


Triton Digital does measurement for online radio - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triton_Digital

From the wiki link:

On December 18, 2012, the Nielsen Company announced that it would acquire Arbitron for $1.26 billion.

Doh! Monopoly. Anyone else get the feeling one day one company will own everything? Google will own the whole world one day. You can have your Google pizza, Google beer, see your cardiologist at Google Medical Group, head on down to the Google pharmacy and pick up your Google Lipitor so you don't end up on Google life support after suffering a massive MI from eating your Google unhealthy cholesterol laden Google snacks. Apple trees will be extinct. There's no money in keeping people healthy. 😉 Just kiddin. I think...I hope.

 

[techs]

They have people who drive around and ask other drivers for directions. When they roll down their windows they listen to hear what station the people are listening to.

 

[Farang]

Funny thing is a couple of years ago they changed the formula for how they calculated listeners, at least in the Seattle area, and it totally rearranged the rankings of stations. Some got totally screwed and some rose to become premiere stations overnight.

 

[blankslate]

How do they track people who stream? just count the unique ip addresses of people who connect to their streaming server?

Funny thing is a couple of years ago they changed the formula for how they calculated listeners, at least in the Seattle area, and it totally rearranged the rankings of stations. Some got totally screwed and some rose to become premiere stations overnight.

sounds like something the conspiratorially minded can make a new theory out of 😛

 

[DrPizza]

I recently received an Arbitron survey (and it included a dollar! LOL) If I filled it out, I was promised 5 more dollars (LOL.) Well, I filled it out anyway, online. Took all of 5 minutes. And, a couple weeks later, I got my $5 bill. Oddly, the paper that it was folded inside of had picked up ink from the bill, as if the bill was freshly printed. The bill was crispy brand new. Things that make me think, "hmmmmmmmm."

Can brand new bills transfer ink to paper?

Anyway, I don't listen to any radio at all, except for streaming music. So, it was an easy survey.

 

[wirednuts]

you cant pirate digital cable because its highly encrypted. not sure if anyone has ever broken it...

 

[IronWing]

You offer free tickets and count the callers. "We have nine listeners."

 

[phucheneh]

you cant pirate digital cable because its highly encrypted. not sure if anyone has ever broken it...

Is that it? I was curious, but most people seem to have that on their 'don't touch with a ten foot pole' list of topics. I wasn't requesting the means pirate cable, I was just curious as to what changed if it wasn't a hypothetical movement of the cable 'valve' from client to provider.

Back in...'the day'...people used to steal basic cable from anywhere there was a hookup. Then you could descramble 'premium' stuff. That, or you had a forged 'cable card'. Either way, you were basically just opening the door to the signal.

Cable now seems like it's very controlled at their end. I guess it's more accurately just that the communication is more complicated?

 

[Dari]

From the wiki link:


Doh! Monopoly. Anyone else get the feeling one day one company will own everything? Google will own the whole world one day. You can have your Google pizza, Google beer, see your cardiologist at Google Medical Group, head on down to the Google pharmacy and pick up your Google Lipitor so you don't end up on Google life support after suffering a massive MI from eating your Google unhealthy cholesterol laden Google snacks. Apple trees will be extinct. There's no money in keeping people healthy. 😉 Just kiddin. I think...I hope.

As a famous futurist once said: The future is already here, just unevenly distributed.

In S. Korea, Samsung is already like that. You can get your cake from a Samsung bakery. There's also Samsung cars, life insurance, apartments, hospitals, etc...

 

[Mixolydian]

They are spying on us. 😵

Cable now seems like it's very controlled at their end. I guess it's more accurately just that the communication is more complicated?

Yes. Digital cable is very tightly controlled/monitored. I don't know if this applies to all cable companies, but I know with Comcast that each set top box is linked to the address listed on your account - so if you took your cable box and hooked it up somewhere across town, it wouldn't work.

 

[Markbnj]

Back in...'the day'...people used to steal basic cable from anywhere there was a hookup. Then you could descramble 'premium' stuff. That, or you had a forged 'cable card'. Either way, you were basically just opening the door to the signal.

Yeah, you could fiddle with it in the box outside and enable premium channels by unplugging a filter or something. A year or so ago Comcast unplugged my friends service one night while we were out at dinner. He pays his bill, but his neighbor had been out of work and having some problems, so we figured it was a mistake. Went outside and flipped the cover open on the box, screwed the coax back in, and closed it up 🙂.

These days, as mentioned above, the digital channels are encrypted with 256 bit QAM (most of them). Comcast used to just encrypt certain channels, and maybe four years ago you could still get 70+ clear channels with any cable-ready device. But since then they have encrypted pretty much everything except the main network stations that the FCC requires them to broadcast in the clear. So now you need either an STB or a Cablecard to receive them.

 

[wirednuts]

Is that it? I was curious, but most people seem to have that on their 'don't touch with a ten foot pole' list of topics. I wasn't requesting the means pirate cable, I was just curious as to what changed if it wasn't a hypothetical movement of the cable 'valve' from client to provider.

Back in...'the day'...people used to steal basic cable from anywhere there was a hookup. Then you could descramble 'premium' stuff. That, or you had a forged 'cable card'. Either way, you were basically just opening the door to the signal.

Cable now seems like it's very controlled at their end. I guess it's more accurately just that the communication is more complicated?

yes. like said, it used to be analog and it wasnt encrypted. a simple frequency filter outside would cut out the channels they didnt want you to have.

but now, its all encrypted. think of it like cellphones. you connection to the company is 256bit encoded, and it would be a nightmare to try to crack. and even if you could, the newest cable boxes have monitoring and 2 way reporting on them so i doubt it would work at all.

this is how the cable companies thought they could bring in money. just eliminate the pirates and everyone will pay the shitty full price. what really happened though? everyone just bought netflix and told the cable companies to f themselves. someday, corporations will learn that people are willing to pay only so much for things they dont need.