How come my 840 EVO performs very bad when using the IRST driver?

G73S

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Mar 14, 2012
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If I google about installing IRST driver, most forums say that even if you are not running a RAID setup, it is suggested to install the IRST driver.

I did a test with the default msahci driver after installing the Intel Chipset Drivers 9.4.0.1027 and here are the results:

zwdxdl.png


but with the IRST Driver 12.8.0.1016:

rt0ygo.png


I do have RAPID mode enabled seems like it doesn't like the IRST driver but it doesn't make sense, how could the IRST driver affect RAPID's functionality that bad?
 

VirtualLarry

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Aug 25, 2001
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Looks like RAPID only works with the MS AHCI driver, for some reason. Did you check your IRST disk properties, and make sure that you enabled all of the caching (write caching, etc)? Because I think that defaults to disabled, and may affect RAPID, since it is basically a caching driver. Or perhaps RAPID really does just not like the Intel IRST drivers.
 

G73S

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Mar 14, 2012
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Looks like RAPID only works with the MS AHCI driver, for some reason. Did you check your IRST disk properties, and make sure that you enabled all of the caching (write caching, etc)? Because I think that defaults to disabled, and may affect RAPID, since it is basically a caching driver. Or perhaps RAPID really does just not like the Intel IRST drivers.
you are right, and yes, I did check the caching and performance options to ensure all is right before benchmarking, didn't make a different at all.

I wish someone had some technical explanation

what is Samsung's email if I wanna email them about this concern?
 

smakme7757

Golden Member
Nov 20, 2010
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you are right, and yes, I did check the caching and performance options to ensure all is right before benchmarking, didn't make a different at all.

I wish someone had some technical explanation

what is Samsung's email if I wanna email them about this concern?
First the email: http://bit.ly/1rPXo2H

I currently have a Samsung 840 Pro and rapid enabled with the latest IRST driver and it works fine.

The magician software is the same for both SSD drives, so it could be a firmware issue with the EVO line.
 

G73S

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Mar 14, 2012
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First the email: http://bit.ly/1rPXo2H

I currently have a Samsung 840 Pro and rapid enabled with the latest IRST driver and it works fine.

The magician software is the same for both SSD drives, so it could be a firmware issue with the EVO line.

can you post your AS SSD Benchmarks along with the Intel Chipset Software + IRST versions you are using?

computer/laptop specs would also be handy
 

smakme7757

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Nov 20, 2010
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can you post your AS SSD Benchmarks along with the Intel Chipset Software + IRST versions you are using?

computer/laptop specs would also be handy
Unfortunately AS SSD requires .NET 3.5 and I have the drive in a Hyper-V host so I don't want to be installing stuff like that. Additionally a benchmark on the drive now wouldn't produce good results anyway, it's half full and running virtual machines.

However from memory I got around 1GB/900MB p/s with RAPID enabled, and 540/520MBps with RAPID disabled on the drive when it was empty.

It's a Xeon E3-1240v2, MSI Z77A-GD65 motherboard, 32GB RAM, 10 HDD and 2 SSD (1 of the SSDs is the Samsung).
Storage controller is running AHCI and the AHCI Driver version: 9.3.0.1029 - Date: 25.07.2013.
 
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G73S

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Mar 14, 2012
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Unfortunately AS SSD requires .NET 3.5 and I have the drive in a Hyper-V host so I don't want to be installing stuff like that. Additionally a benchmark on the drive now wouldn't produce good results anyway, it's half full and running virtual machines.

However from memory I got around 1GB/900MB p/s with RAPID enabled, and 540/520MBps with RAPID disabled on the drive when it was empty.

my write is like 460 MB on this 1 TB Evo without RAPID, I am not very happy about it

currently Magician reports that 5 TB has been written to both my SSDs since I formatted a lot, don't know if that's killing my drive now.

how many TBs need to be written before the driver performance start to suffer badly?
 

smakme7757

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Nov 20, 2010
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my write is like 460 MB on this 1 TB Evo without RAPID, I am not very happy about it

currently Magician reports that 5 TB has been written to both my SSDs since I formatted a lot, don't know if that's killing my drive now.

how many TBs need to be written before the driver performance start to suffer badly?
It shouldn't be too bad.
I've written 10TB to mine.

I'm still getting very good IOPS and good rawthrough put. The picture below was taken now. The drive is in use though which is why the raw through put is a bit lower than if it wasn't being used.
http://s24.photobucket.com/user/smakme7757/media/samsung_zps82c76997.png.html
 
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BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
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As long as we're discussing the Samsung 840s -- I bought an EVO 120GB for boot drive in my server. I finally got the AHCI drivers set up properly, so that Magician doesn't throw up an error message.

But enabling RAPID-Mode throws up a "failed" message. Was RAPID only supposed to work with the "Pro" drive? The EVO drive? Or both?

I'm wondering if you need to use the Migration software that comes with the Sam drives so the drive is properly "prepped" for "RAPID."
 

Tech_Greek

Senior member
Sep 18, 2011
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Samsung Software doesn't do any prepping for rapid mode.

Which windows server OS are you running? Have you tried putting it into the compatibility mode to fool the program into thinking it's a normal workstation OS.
 

Coup27

Platinum Member
Jul 17, 2010
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I have the system in my sig and I have no issue with the performance of my EVO using the IRST drivers regardless if RAPID is on or off.
 

BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
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Samsung Software doesn't do any prepping for rapid mode.

Which windows server OS are you running? Have you tried putting it into the compatibility mode to fool the program into thinking it's a normal workstation OS.

I was going to chime in on this. I'm no different than anyone else with their opinions, observations, experience and advice: sometimes -- I get some details wrong. Nothing a little research won't cure, and certainly others -- such as yourself -- add to the cumulative input and reduce mistakes from misinterpretation.

I've seen indications that RAPID only works with the EVO. Otherwise, EVO benchmark tests comparing to some 20+ SSDs and including the "Pro" version would include RAPID in the comparison just as EVO does. Or why include the Pro in the mix if the review focused on RAPID? this was a Tech Report review, and I think Tech Report often gets it "right" as often as we'd find here at Anandtech -- they're both good reliable info sources.

But that's just one thought, since I mistakenly installed the "Pro" when I meant to install the EVO, and had to repeat the work with the little screws and tedium.
ESPECIALLY, however -- This:

Just about everywhere I've looked, there are clear, unambiguous statements that "RAPID Mode only works with Windows 7 and Windows 8." Period.

If I were trying to use it with WHS-2011 -- supposedly able to use Win 7 drivers if necessary -- I just might be SOL.

But as Tech-Greek says, it might actually work with a "compatibility" tweak to the program for the WHS 2011 / 2008 R2 OS.

EVEN SO! I have to run it with an SATA-III controller in a PCI-E 1.x slot. RAPID wouldn't give you 900+ MB/s in synthetic benchies. HOWEVER! It might boost to 500 give or take, bottlenecked as it is by the PCI-E bus, but cached and enhanced with system RAM. OF course, in this system, system RAM is DDR2-800. So it would likely depend on the range of speed disparity in the RAM as opposed to the caching effect compared to "non-RAPID."

Then, there's another possibility I have unrelated particularly to the Samsung 840s without omitting them. My controller card uses Marvell Hyper-Duo analog to Intel ISRT (but I understand that the caching is at the file level, as opposed to Intel's patent approach.) This also offers a possible SSD enhancement for certain server applications -- maybe DBMS like SQL Server or ORACLE.

Supposedly, the Hyper Duo approach allows for SSDs using sizes larger than 64 GB for the caching, and it may allow caching of several HDDs at once by the same SSD. I need to review what I'd encountered about Hyper Duo to confirm that feature. It wouldn't make sense for me to have seen "several SSDs and an HDD." Only the other way.

I think I can afford to double my RAM for this old server box to 8GB. Hmm.
 

Tech_Greek

Senior member
Sep 18, 2011
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I've got a 256 GB 840 Pro in my laptop with Rapid enabled in Windows 8.1 with no issues. Intel RST was removed on my system due to random BSOD but performance was the same.

What server are you rocking? I've got a TON of 1GB sticks.

I've got a couple of Evos laying around that I can put in a lab server on Wednesday to test.
 

BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
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Turns out that RAPID Mode is supposed to work for the EVO, the Pro and some other Samsung models.

I think it requires 2GB of RAM, and I only have 4GB in the system of interest.

I also tried Windows Compatibility for "Win 7," and it had no effect. The drive is now running under "AHCI 1.0" I wonder what other "optimization" settings I must tweak -- if any -- to get RAPID to work. Maybe it only works for drives running at full SATA-III speed. Or maybe the software doesn't think that 2GB is feasible. Frankly, I don't think it should be feasible myself.
 

BonzaiDuck

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
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It seems more and more likely that RAPID-Mode will only work with Windows 7 and 8 -- PERIOD. "Compatibility mode" won't help.

That being said, I really shouldn't care about it for my WHS server. Magician shows sequential read benches of 400 MB/s and writes of 340 with an SATA-III controller in a PCI-E 1.x slot.

Nice to have for a workstation, though!