House passes bill to make voters show ID

[wiin]

The ACLU, of course, is not happy with this ACLU Condemns Voter Integrity Act
Together with democrats, the ACLU is fighting this in many states. Excuses they use ranges from poll tax, minority can't afford, to loophole in the state constitution(in Missouri).

 

[ayabe]

Originally posted by: wiin
The ACLU, of course, is not happy with this ACLU Condemns Voter Integrity Act
Together with democrats, the ACLU is fighting this in many states. Excuses they use ranges from poll tax, minority can't afford, to loophole in the state constitution(in Missouri).

Get a job and that won't be a problem, hold off on getting your next tattoo, don't buy rims for your car, don't have kids you can't afford, don't buy jewelry, don't buy $100 sneakers, don't buy Luis Vuitton purses.

Any combination of the above will net the $10-15 required for an ID.

 

[CaptnKirk]

Interesting, the House went ahead and passed a bill that Federal Judges have already ruled as illegal and unconstitutinal in the State of Georgia.

Another few hundred thousand dollars wasted by a do-nothing, cover your ass, Congress -that is playing games of diversion to display something, anything, to their mindless base.

What they are offering isn't even a soultion, and it never addresses the real problems.

 

[Genx87]

I find it funny the hypocrits who complain about diebold are the same people who dont want people to prove who they are when they vote.

Voter identity is vital to faith in the system high.

 

[Todd33]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060914/ap_on_re_us/voter_id

Missouri just struck down a voter ID law, maybe you guys should go look into why it was struck down, and no it's not some urban myth about illegals voting.

The bottom line is the myth about fraud, dead people, illegals etc is just stories the right use to make laws to suppress people who generally vote Democratic. If that demographics swung toward the GOP they would never float these laws. The working class, single parents and poor already have a burden when trying to vote, this is just another hurdle to discourage them. We already saw 8-9 hour lines in the inner cites in 2004, I wonder who that helps?

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Todd33
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060914/ap_on_re_us/voter_id

Missouri just struck down a voter ID law, maybe you guys should go look into why it was struck down, and no it's not some urban myth about illegals voting.

The bottom line is the myth about fraud, dead people, illegals etc is just stories the right use to make laws to suppress people who generally vote Democratic. If that demographics swung toward the GOP they would never float these laws. The working class, single parents and poor already have a burden when trying to vote, this is just another hurdle to discourage them. We already saw 8-9 hour lines in the inner cites in 2004, I wonder who that helps?

From now on I dont want to hear a peep out of you about Diebold. The system is broken from the second the person walks into the voting booth, before diebold even gets involved.

 

[imported_dna]

I wonder how voters identify themselves in other democratic countries......

 

[2Xtreme21]

It's not gonna matter.. we'll still have Ohio to chuck 750,000+ democratic votes and districts not allowing people to vote unless they vote republican.

Welcome to America!

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: techs
The real goal is to make it difficult for working class and poor people to vote.
Yes, the id cards are "free".
But do you need to go and get one? Take time off from work?
Pay to get to the place where they take your photo and issue you a card?
Do you move around a lot? Makes it difficult to get a card.
Lets be HONEST. It is an attempt to decrease the vote of the working class and poor.
And the RIDICULOUS notion that illegal aliens VOTE is just that, RIDICULOUS.
Imagine an illegal alien risking being caught an deported just to vote.

Not that I believe they are in risk, but even if they are caught it's a free one or two week vaction back home and then they just come back. As if there's anything stopping them on the border.

 

[FuzzyBee]

Originally posted by: 2Xtreme21
It's not gonna matter.. we'll still have Ohio to chuck 750,000+ democratic votes and districts not allowing people to vote unless they vote republican.

Todd33 will be along in a moment to tell you how much this is a myth, I'm sure.

 

[Todd33]

Originally posted by: Genx87

From now on I dont want to hear a peep out of you about Diebold. The system is broken from the second the person walks into the voting booth, before diebold even gets involved.

What is your logic? You think people walk up and give someone else's name and address and vote? While it could happen, what are the stats? If someone wants they could have a fake ID, but what is the motivation, one vote out of millions?

Diebold is 100% different problem. All it takes is one person to change thousands of votes with no record. It's like comparing a shop lifter to Enron. Sure, they are both crimes, but one is on a scale so much more massive it demand much more attention.

But with a new law and more paperwork, people will get discourages and just not bother. It would great for the GOP is 5% more working class and poor stop voting, they win when people don't vote. They count of low turnouts by the general population so that their army of fundamentalist can sway elections.

But back to your urban myths of dead people and illegals voting, it soo common....

 

[newmachineoverlord]

"bill stipulates that states must provide the identification cards free of charge to those who can't afford them."

Great first step, but big problems remain and it is still an unconstitutional poll tax because:

1. "who can't afford them" stipulation still means they're going to assume people can afford them who can't, disenfranchising many people
2. If the state requires some other form of ID to get the state ID, then the government should pay for those forms of identification as well, birth certificate copy, etc.

If the "can't afford them" stipulations are removed and all forms of ID are always paid for by the government throughout the nation, then this would no longer be an unconstitutional poll tax and my opinion would shift to favor it.

Of course the dominant forms of fixing elections lie in disenfranchising blacks and the poor while manipulating the counting methods/hacking.

http://itpolicy.princeton.edu/voting/

 

[forfor]

What the hell, IDs weren't required? Actually, now that I think of it.... :Q

 

[Darkhawk28]

If they allowed for same-day registration and same-day acquisition (at the polling place for both) of these cards FOR FREE, then I wouldn't have as big a problem with it.

Now, some people will be affected because some who don't currently have an ID (the elderly, the extremely poor (yes, those people get to vote too, sorry Republicans), the indigant because they won't have the knowledge or the means to obtain birth certificates or passports. How do you mass-educate the voting populace, first, the need to get a voter ID and not just spring it on them a couple of days before an election? And second, how would you be able to financially support those that cannot afford to get a birth certificate so that the individual's cash flow does not get affected?

On the subject of individual vote fraud, the percentage of votes cast illegally (and proven in a court) is probably 0.0000002%. That's not an "OMG" problem. Sorry, ProfJohn. Tell your team leaders that your arguments weren't convincing enough.

And the strawman argument about illegals voting is silly.

Let's discuss what a much wide fraud problem is...

The RNC hiring Sproul and Associates to throw away tens of thousands of Democratic registration across six states.

The RNC jamming Democratic phone lines in New Hampshire.

And I could go on, but I won't because I don't want to hijack the thread.

 

[Darkhawk28]

Originally posted by: Todd33

Originally posted by: Genx87

From now on I dont want to hear a peep out of you about Diebold. The system is broken from the second the person walks into the voting booth, before diebold even gets involved.

What is your logic? You think people walk up and give someone else's name and address and vote? While it could happen, what are the stats? If someone wants they could have a fake ID, but what is the motivation, one vote out of millions?

Diebold is 100% different problem. All it takes is one person to change thousands of votes with no record. It's like comparing a shop lifter to Enron. Sure, they are both crimes, but one is on a scale so much more massive it demand much more attention.

But with a new law and more paperwork, people will get discourages and just not bother. It would great for the GOP is 5% more working class and poor stop voting, they win when people don't vote. They count of low turnouts by the general population so that their army of fundamentalist can sway elections.

But back to your urban myths of dead people and illegals voting, it soo common....

The stat that I heard was since 2002, out of 190,000,000 votes cast, there have been only 52 cases of actionable voter fraud.

0.0000002%

And in Missouri, there hasn't been an actionable case of voter fraud in 50 years.

 

[Zorba]

Originally posted by: Todd33
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060914/ap_on_re_us/voter_id

Missouri just struck down a voter ID law, maybe you guys should go look into why it was struck down, and no it's not some urban myth about illegals voting.

The bottom line is the myth about fraud, dead people, illegals etc is just stories the right use to make laws to suppress people who generally vote Democratic. If that demographics swung toward the GOP they would never float these laws. The working class, single parents and poor already have a burden when trying to vote, this is just another hurdle to discourage them. We already saw 8-9 hour lines in the inner cites in 2004, I wonder who that helps?

Anyone who works, ie the working class, has to have an ID to complete the I-9. So eiher they aren't working or their company is breaking the law but not making them complete an I-9 form.

 

[Pabster]

Originally posted by: Genx87
I find it funny the hypocrits who complain about diebold are the same people who dont want people to prove who they are when they vote.

Voter identity is vital to faith in the system high.

Funny how that works isn't it. "The machines are all rigged", "No don't check any IDs!"

 

[Pabster]

Originally posted by: Darkhawk28
Let's discuss what a much wide fraud problem is...

The RNC hiring Sproul and Associates to throw away tens of thousands of Democratic registration across six states.

The RNC jamming Democratic phone lines in New Hampshire.

And I could go on, but I won't because I don't want to hijack the thread.

The DNC slashing tires so Republican votes can't make it to the polls.

Oh, wait, they'd never do anything like that...

 

[umbrella39]

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: umbrella39
Already have to show ID to vote in some parts of the country. Should be a req'd of all voters, an ID and a voter reg card.

You neocon shill!

OK dems, here's the perfect opportunity - you told me that voting legislation would never hit the floor. Now is the chance for a "Diebold amendment". I'm prepared for ownage if one is introduced and voted down...personally I don't think one will be introduced because that's just another diversionary conspiracy - "useful idiots" to the dems.

LOL, I don't toe the party line on everything

While I think our country could improve on electronic voting and the long lines that seem to predominate the urban centers across the country, I don't see a voters card and a picture ID as some insurmountable obstacle that can not be overcome by an able bodied American. We are better than that, we can handle such obstacles.

 

[Wheezer]

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: Genx87
I find it funny the hypocrits who complain about diebold are the same people who dont want people to prove who they are when they vote.

Voter identity is vital to faith in the system high.

Funny how that works isn't it. "The machines are all rigged", "No don't check any IDs!"

 

[piasabird]

Personally, I think we need a standardized ID Card and a National database for all Traffic related crimes. It can be a drivers license if it is standardized accross the US and people need to be able to get an ID for free if they dont drive. This is my opinion. I know some people are paranoid about a National ID Card, but it is really an infantile fear. The Governemnt already knows more about us than we realize.

 

[430752]

Man o man. Showing my id to vote. Soon we'll all have to answer the police questions in the name of national scurity, the govt will be able to search your house without getting a warrant first. there will be secret police who will be able to steal you off the street without anyone knowing, without any writ of areest, without habeous corpus. Then, next thing you know, there will be secret trials where you don't even get to see your accuser!

Oh, snap, we're already there! I we gave these rights up voluntailry!

look, dem or repub, illegal or legal, why do I have to prove who I am in order to exercise the franchise? Am I not a citizen and thus have the constitutional right to vote, which trumps any petty state or federal law enacted? Are you saying I'm not a citizen until I prove I am one? Aren't you supposed to assume I am one until you have reason to suspect I'm not?

man, people gotta get their heads our their poopers and see what's going on. And this ain't a dem v repub thing. This is a control thing. The govt wants you to obey them, but govt's are supposed to obey their people.

curt j.

 

[babylon5]

Isn't it kind of insulting to presume poor people are too stupid or lack the resource to get an ID?

 

[senseamp]

All the more reason to be a permanent absentee voter.
Don't have to be worried about some Repug operative denying you your rights, because he doesn't "think it's you in the picture."

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: umbrella39

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: umbrella39
Already have to show ID to vote in some parts of the country. Should be a req'd of all voters, an ID and a voter reg card.

You neocon shill!

OK dems, here's the perfect opportunity - you told me that voting legislation would never hit the floor. Now is the chance for a "Diebold amendment". I'm prepared for ownage if one is introduced and voted down...personally I don't think one will be introduced because that's just another diversionary conspiracy - "useful idiots" to the dems.

LOL, I don't toe the party line on everything

While I think our country could improve on electronic voting and the long lines that seem to predominate the urban centers across the country, I don't see a voters card and a picture ID as some insurmountable obstacle that can not be overcome by an able bodied American. We are better than that, we can handle such obstacles.

Elections are almost always run by local boards and committees. So you really can't blame the long lines on the federal government or either party.
Maybe the government could find a way to help inner cities run better elections though money and grants, but not sure if this would work. One major reason for long lines is the inability to get poll workers in many parts of the country so they can only open so many polling places.

Here is Florida local counties run the elections and design the ballots. It is ironic that a ballot designed by a Democrat in a Democrat county could have been responsible for Bush winning in 2000 since the ballot design confused so many people creating double votes and votes for Buchanan. Bush "won" the election fairly, but had the ballot design been better there is a very good chance he would have lost and it would have been President Gore and we'd all be driving hybrids that get 100MPG and would be complaining about global cooling making the summers too short.