Hourly 'rate my PC building plan'

[clange]

Ok, first let me say i dont know much about this stuff. Actually i havent checked out any hardware stuff since i got a p3 450 like 5 years ago. Over the past couple days i think i've found some pretty decent parts that will work together. Pretty much just looked around newegg for stuff i thought i'd like, could afford, and had good reviews. So..

AMD Athlon XP 2600+ "barton" 333FSB, 512 cache
ASRock "K7S8XE" SiS748 Chipset Motherboard for AMD Socket A CPU
Crucial 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-2700
Maxtor 160GB 7200RPM IDE Hard Drive, Model 6Y160P0, OEM
Lite-On Black 52X32X52 CD-RW Drive, Model LTR-52327S, OEM
SONY Black 1.44MB 3.5inch Floppy Disk Drive, Model MPF920, OEM
ASPIRE Turbo Case X-Dreamer Black Mid-Tower Case with 350W Power Supply, Model "ATXB3KLW/350W"
POWMAX Demon 480W Power Supply, Model "PSDE480"

I was advised elsewhere that the 350w power supply (that probably isnt anyway) wouldnt be enough. Plan is to give the 350 to my dad (who's running his athlon on a 250 currently) when i toss in the 480.

I orginally planned a ATI radeon 9600 AIW but knocked it down to a 9600pro to save cash. Now i'm leaning towards a powercolor 9800SE in the hopes i can mod it to a near 9800pro.

So how does this look? I really dont have much cash. With the 9800SE this comes out to $593, which is barely doable. I could save a bit more by getting a 9600pro, which i heard was pretty close to a stock 9800se. Is the $40 worth the shot at a near 9800pro? This computer will be replacing my old pos, so anything i get will probably shock me. Along those lines (and i suspect this may be a stupid question) is $10 worth the jump from a 2500+ barton to a 2600+? I also dont know anything about mother boards so if that one sucks or if you know of better for similar cash..

Lastly will the heatsink and fan that comes with the processor be ok? I could go for an OEM one and get a better fan but i dont know if its needed.

Thanks.

 

[ElFenix]

350 should work fine. i had a 330 with a 2 GHz athlon, 9800 pro, and 3 hard drives, not a problem.

i'd recommend the mobile barton if they still have it, they overclock really well (mine does 2.3GHz at 1.75 volts, stock is 1.8) and you can always run them at lower voltage to quiet the computer some (which is what i'm doing now, less power output = lower temps... lowest voltage setting i can go and 2.0 GHz)

i wouldn't go with the 9800SE simply because i've never been able to figure out if the card has full memory bandwidth or not. the 9600 pro overclocks really well last i checked.

i have no idea about that board. albatron is a pretty good inexpensive brand, in my experience.

retail HSF is ok, not the best. i don't remember if mine was loud or not, but it was also on a slower processor so they might change the fan on the better one. probably be easiest just to save some money by getting the 2400+ mobile and overclocking it, and getting a nice temp controlled fan

 

[mechBgon]

The PowMax PSUs seem to be a troublesome brand; could you swap in a Fortron, Antec or Enermax unit? Or pick up an Antec SLK3700AMB case/PSU, it comes with an Antec SL350 power supply and is nice quality with lots of drive capacity. The link in my signature shows an SLK3700AMB getting built with black drives, if you want to see what it looks like both inside and out. I liked it

 

[tweeve2002]

Whats wrong with the PowMax PSUs?

I have two friends using them and they seem to be working fine.

 

[mechBgon]

Originally posted by: tweeve2002
Whats wrong with the PowMax PSUs?

I have two friends using them and they seem to be working fine.

Maybe I have a skewed opinion since I spend up to 12 hours a day trying to wrap my brain around other peoples' problems here at the Forums But if there is a person having a problem with his computer, and it has a PowMax PSU in it, guess what the problem generally ends up being...? Yeah. :frown: Antec = 3-year warranty that they'll stand behind if you have a problem with their product, and considering the amount of Antec PSUs around here, it's pretty seldom that they prove to be defective. So that's my story, and I'm stickin' to it :evil:

Glad to hear they've made at least two PSUs that work, anyway

 

[clange]

i'd recommend the mobile barton if they still have it, they overclock really well (mine does 2.3GHz at 1.75 volts, stock is 1.8) and you can always run them at lower voltage to quiet the computer some (which is what i'm doing now, less power output = lower temps... lowest voltage setting i can go and 2.0 GHz)

What are the differences and advantages of the mobile ones (besides overclocking like you said)? I see the FSB on the mobile ones are 266, the one i was looking at is 333? There is a 2400+ for $77, 2500+ for $88, and 2600+ for $99. All would need a fan and heat sink which would put the price of the 2400+ mobile above the 2600+ i was looking at..

i have no idea about that board. albatron is a pretty good inexpensive brand, in my experience.

Apparently asrock is made by asus? Unless the review thing was wrong. Sounded good in reviews at newegg, but they delete the bad ones lol.

The PowMax PSUs seem to be a troublesome brand; could you swap in a Fortron, Antec or Enermax unit?

Yeah, i havent bought anything yet. Open to suggestions.

The link in my signature shows an SLK3700AMB getting built with black drives, if you want to see what it looks like both inside and out. I liked it

Believe it or not, i was browsing other threads and saw that link after i posted this thread. Read it and came back to find some replies here. It should be pretty helpful when i assemble this thing.

Edit:

i wouldn't go with the 9800SE simply because i've never been able to figure out if the card has full memory bandwidth or not. the 9600 pro overclocks really well last i checked.

Uh dont know what you mean. The one i was looking at was the 256bit version, where (if all went well) it would end up pretty close to a 9800pro right? If not it would be like a 9600pro, maybe a little worse, that cost $40 more.

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: clange
What are the differences and advantages of the mobile ones (besides overclocking like you said)? I see the FSB on the mobile ones are 266, the one i was looking at is 333. There is a 2400+ for $77, 2500+ for $88, and 2600+ for $99. All would need a fan and heat sink.

the mobiles are all unlocked, run whatever FSB you like. the advantage is that they run cooler since they can run at way lower voltages for the same speeds, usually. $77 + that fan will run as fast as that 2600 easily, and be pretty much dead silent and cool running.

Uh dont know what you mean. The one i was looking at was the 256bit version, where (if all went well) it would end up pretty close to a 9800pro right? If not it would be like a 9600pro, maybe a little worse, that cost $40 more.

at best i've heard 50/50 chance of the SE getting to 9800 pro levels.

 

[Corporate Thug]

quote:
i'd recommend the mobile barton if they still have it, they overclock really well (mine does 2.3GHz at 1.75 volts, stock is 1.8) and you can always run them at lower voltage to quiet the computer some (which is what i'm doing now, less power output = lower temps... lowest voltage setting i can go and 2.0 GHz)


What are the differences and advantages of the mobile ones (besides overclocking like you said)? I see the FSB on the mobile ones are 266, the one i was looking at is 333? There is a 2400+ for $77, 2500+ for $88, and 2600+ for $99. All would need a fan and heat sink which would put the price of the 2400+ mobile above the 2600+ i was looking at..

less voltage means they run cooler

i have no idea about that board. albatron is a pretty good inexpensive brand, in my experience.


Apparently asrock is made by asus? Unless the review thing was wrong. Sounded good in reviews at newegg, but they delete the bad ones lol.

i believe it is Asus's budget line

i wouldn't go with the 9800SE simply because i've never been able to figure out if the card has full memory bandwidth or not. the 9600 pro overclocks really well last i checked.


Uh dont know what you mean. The one i was looking at was the 256bit version, where (if all went well) it would end up pretty close to a 9800pro right? If not it would be like a 9600pro, maybe a little worse, that cost $40 more.

it wouldnt be close to a 9800 pro cuz it still only has 4 pipelines

 

[clange]

the mobiles are all unlocked, run whatever FSB you like. the advantage is that they run cooler since they can run at way lower voltages for the same speeds, usually. $77 + that fan will run as fast as that 2600 easily, and be pretty much dead silent and cool running.

Ok. Can the non-mobile ones not be overclocked more? Could they go higher too, just they'd be hotter? (i really dont know anything about this lol) Like if a overclocked 2400+ mobile can do better than a 2600+, what can the 2600+ do?

And i guess i'll probably get the 9600pro. Dont see much point in spending another $40 on crappy odds. With the money saved i could get a faster mobile processor. Sound good?

Edit:

it wouldnt be close to a 9800 pro cuz it still only has 4 pipelines

Apparently you can open the other 4 but theres no guarantee they'll work. Thats the gamble.

 

[Corporate Thug]

Originally posted by: clange

the mobiles are all unlocked, run whatever FSB you like. the advantage is that they run cooler since they can run at way lower voltages for the same speeds, usually. $77 + that fan will run as fast as that 2600 easily, and be pretty much dead silent and cool running.

Ok. Can the non-mobile ones not be overclocked more? Could they go higher too, just they'd be hotter? (i really dont know anything about this lol) Like if a overclocked 2400+ mobile can do better than a 2600+, what can the 2600+ do?

And i guess i'll probably get the 9600pro. Dont see much point in spending another $40 on crappy odds. With the money saved i could get a faster mobile processor. Sound good?

since they have a lower default vcore, they almost always OC better than the non mobiles

 

[clange]

Ok, new plan.

AMD 45 Watt Mobile Athlon XP 2400+, 266FSB, 512K Cache - OEM
Arctic Cooling CPU Cooler For AMD Athlon Socket 462 up to 3400+
Shuttle "AN35N-Ultra" nForce2 Ultra 400 Chipset
Crucial 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-2700
Maxtor 160GB 7200RPM IDE Hard Drive, Model 6Y160P0, OEM
Lite-On Black 52X32X52 CD-RW Drive, Model LTR-52327S, OEM
SONY Black 1.44MB 3.5inch Floppy Disk Drive, Model MPF920, OEM
ASPIRE Turbo Case X-Dreamer Black Mid-Tower Case with 350W Power Supply, Model "ATXB3KLW/350W"
Antec P4 ATX12V 350 Watt Power Supply With 2 Fans, Model "SL350"

SAPPHIRE ATI RADEON 9600PRO Video Card, 128MB DDR, 128-bit, DVI/TV-Out, 8X AGP, Model "ATLANTIS RADEON 9600PRO" -RETAIL

$592.22 before shipping. What do you think?

 

[randumb]

Uh dont know what you mean. The one i was looking at was the 256bit version, where (if all went well) it would end up pretty close to a 9800pro right? If not it would be like a 9600pro, maybe a little worse, that cost $40 more.

Here's how the 9800SE works. When ATI tests their 9800 Pros to see if they can all run at 9800 Pro level, they test maybe a few out of a fairly large batch. If one of the 9800 Pros fails the test, then they take the whole batch, mark them as 9800SEs and run them at lower clock speed. However, sometimes the whole batch was not flawed and some of the 9800 Pros marked down as 9800SEs can actually run as 9800 Pros. If you're lucky enough to get one of these, then you will probably hit 9800 Pro speeds.

 

[clange]

Originally posted by: randumb

Uh dont know what you mean. The one i was looking at was the 256bit version, where (if all went well) it would end up pretty close to a 9800pro right? If not it would be like a 9600pro, maybe a little worse, that cost $40 more.

However, sometimes the whole batch was not flawed and some of the 9800 Pros marked down as 9800SEs can actually run as 9800 Pros. If you're lucky enough to get one of these, then you will probably hit 9800 Pro speeds.

And if i'm unlucky i paid $40 more for a card that basically does what a 9600pro does right?


BTW, what about the hard drive? I was looking at 120s with similar numbers (7200rpm, 8mb cache) and the prices are pretty close to the 160 i'm looking at. What gives?

 

[robcy]

Does the 160gb HD have 8mb of Cache? If not then the larger size comes at the expence of lower performance which equals about the same price. The 2400+ Mobile is default at 1.45volts most will run 200fsb x 11multi at 1.6volts, but you will need DDR3200, your DDR2700 will be the limiting factor there. The Shuttle is a good board (I have one). Stick with the 9600PRO unless you like to gamble. Sometimes budgets are what they are, but in this case your 9600PRO will be the limiting factor of your build. If at all posible I would search the sofa for loose change just to be able to move up into the 9700PRO/9800NP/5900 (not 9800SE, please...) territory if at all possible, belive me the diffrence will be greater than with any other single component you can change.

 

[Muzzy]

Crucial 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-2700

You do realize that it's best to have 2 sticks of 256 MB memory if you want total of 512 MB? The nForce2 Ultra chipset support dual channel memory.

Antec P4 ATX12V 350 Watt Power Supply With 2 Fans, Model "SL350"

For a $1 more, I would go with the Fortron power supply.

And if you serious about overclocking, get this heatsink.

Everything else look decent.

 

[theslug]

Crucial 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-2700

You do realize that it's best to have 2 sticks of 256 MB memory if you want total of 512 MB? The nForce2 Ultra chipset support dual channel memory.

I'm building a similar system with the Asus A7N8X board, would it still work with 1x512? How would two sticks of 256 be better?

 

[Muzzy]

Originally posted by: theslug

Crucial 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-2700

You do realize that it's best to have 2 sticks of 256 MB memory if you want total of 512 MB? The nForce2 Ultra chipset support dual channel memory.

I'm building a similar system with the Asus A7N8X board, would it still work with 1x512? How would two sticks of 256 be better?

It would work just fine, but you're not using the full bandwidth of the memory path built in the mobo. You have already paid for the feature, why not utilize it? The difference in performance is about 10% if I remember it correctly.

 

[mect]

I'm no pro, but I've heard with amd the dual channel doesn't make a huge difference, and if you just use one stick of 512 it'll make it a lot cheaper if you want to upgrade to a gig of memory later on.

 

[farscape]

Built a number of systems with the AN35N-Ultra - Very nice and stable board.

For the CPU cooler take a look at the Speeze Falconrock - quiet and cool.

I've used the Lite-on 52x burners - fast, but LOUD when they get crankin'.

Aspire case = nice. My most used case. Never had a PS problem with it.

If you can, and the $ isn't too much, consider DDR 3200 - if you decide in the future that you'd like to try your hand at OCing, you'll have the additional headroom and will hold tighter timings. And you'll be able to get 200 FSB out of that chip.

 

[drkavnge99]

I have the xdreamer II case which has the window on it, I also have that same board (good one for the price). Just FYI the thermistor on the board reads a little high compared to actual temps so make sure you have a good HSF on there other wise you'll get automatic shutdown sporatically even though your temps are really fine. I didn't see thermal paste on your list.. very good investment (artic silver 5). I'm running a 2600+ barton. In that case you will prolly want to either mod a 92mm fan into it or put 1 or 2 quiet new ones in the ones it comes with are noisy as hell. Otherwise good luck.

 

[clange]

If you can, and the $ isn't too much, consider DDR 3200 - if you decide in the future that you'd like to try your hand at OCing, you'll have the additional headroom and will hold tighter timings. And you'll be able to get 200 FSB out of that chip.

Yeah i'll eventually get into that, or at least thats the plan by switching to the mobile.

I can get 512mb of kingston DDR PC3200 for the same price as the PC2700 crucial. I didnt know about two sticks being better, but shouldnt this work fine for awhile? I'll probably go to 1gig eventually.

Aspire case = nice. My most used case. Never had a PS problem with it.

Do you think i should give it a shot? I could save some money by using it, but the reviews on newegg say they're junk..?

Does the 160gb HD have 8mb of Cache?

Yeah.

160GB Maxtor, $103
120GB Maxtor, $95

Are the hitachis good? I could get a 120gb one for $88. Has fluid dynamic bearing (?) which i heard was good. Or a samsung for $93 with the same thing.

If at all posible I would search the sofa for loose change just to be able to move up into the 9700PRO/9800NP/5900 (not 9800SE, please...) territory if at all possible, belive me the diffrence will be greater than with any other single component you can change.

I'll look around a bit but there isnt much more change in the sofa.

 

[drkavnge99]

The aspire case powersupplies suck... I changed mine out immediately for my 350 classic antec. Then I put the aspire one into my old tbird 1400 running 2 hd's, cd-rom, and gf2 ultra card; 2 weeks later the PS failed.

 

[clange]

For the CPU cooler take a look at the Speeze Falconrock - quiet and cool

What about this? Speeze "WhisperRock II" CPU Cooler

Its a dollar less, slightly louder but moves quite a bit more air.

Or a variable one like suggested earlier. I'm not sure hom much noise matters (or rather how to relate these decibel ratings to anyhting i know).

Edit: Looking at that artic cooling one from earlier, it matches the max numbers so for $5 more it would be quieter sometimes. How is the gel that comes with that?

 

[robcy]

Stick with the 1 x 512 DDR3200, you can always get another stick later, and then you have 1gig in dual channel. The diffrence on AMD between Dual channel (2 sticks) and single (1 stick) is less than 5% which is unnoticeable to anyone but benchmarks.

With that board make sure you geta HSF that will fit, since the socket is very close to the top, and might bump against the PSU. I use a CoolerMaster that works great with little noise.

Go for the 120gb, and now you are $8 closer to the 9700PRO/9800NP/5900, I am telling you this is the one area you should not skimp on, even if it mean a not so pretty case.

 

[clange]

With that board make sure you geta HSF that will fit, since the socket is very close to the top, and might bump against the PSU. I use a CoolerMaster that works great with little noise.

$45, ouch. Does anyone know if the Arctic Cooling Copper Silent 2TC will work with that board?