homeowners!

[alphatarget1]

So I'm buying a house... closing on the 22nd! AC doesn't work really well, the home inspector said the coils should be around 40F but it was around 59-60F instead. The unit inside (don't know what it's called) was built in 83. This is a house built in early 80s.

I'm thinking I could either replace the entire system (less duct work and all of that) to get a 30% tax credit, or have it serviced. I don't know how each option would work. Is the AC system an easy job to do by yourself provided that there aren't too many special tools that I need to buy and I have time?

 

[crab]

You cant legally recharge an A/C system yourself...and it requires special tools.

I'd certainly replace a 25 year old system, and have an installer do it properly.

 

[Baked]

Buy some ceiling fans.

 

[alphatarget1]

Originally posted by: Baked
Buy some ceiling fans.

I'm in Texas...

 

[alphatarget1]

Originally posted by: crab
You cant legally recharge an A/C system yourself...and it requires special tools.

I'd certainly replace a 25 year old system, and have an installer do it properly.

But I can do everything else right? As in I can get someone to take out the old refrigerant, install the air handler and the heat pump and then have someone charge it with refrigerant?

 

[Bignate603]

Originally posted by: alphatarget1

Originally posted by: crab
You cant legally recharge an A/C system yourself...and it requires special tools.

I'd certainly replace a 25 year old system, and have an installer do it properly.

But I can do everything else right? As in I can get someone to take out the old refrigerant, install the air handler and the heat pump and then have someone charge it with refrigerant?

Probably, but I would call around and make sure you have someone willing to do it for you. Get quotes on just charging it and also for a system installation so you can compare the total costs and see if you want to do it.

 

[Modelworks]

It depends on the refrigerant. Some of the old stuff uses R22 which is no longer allowed to be used in new equipment, but you can still use it in old equipment. But since the change it has really gotten expensive. Also if it isn't getting cold enough and everything else is ok, then there is a leak. Refrigerant doesn't just go bad, it works as long as the system remains closed from leaks. So at the very least they are going to have to pressurize the system and usually using something like soapy water go over all the lines looking for leaks. Fix the leaks, vacuum out the lines, put oil or additives in to protect the compressor and then add the refrigerant.

It may not be worth it for something that old. A new unit is going to be cheaper to run too.

 

[lxskllr]

Originally posted by: alphatarget1

Originally posted by: Baked
Buy some ceiling fans.

I'm in Texas...

Ceiling fans still help a lot. You can raise the thermostat, and still be comfortable with ceiling fans. The movement also adds interest to the room imo.

 

[mugs]

Replace it. The one you have is probably horribly inefficient. In Texas you'll probably save a ton of money with a more efficient A/C.

 

[bobdole369]

You cant legally recharge an A/C system yourself

Sure you can. Provided you don't vent R-22 to the atmosphere. also new installs should be a different refrigerant. R410a, R-134a, r407c, etc.

However, a 20 year old unit isn't quite efficient, I would replace the whole lot.

 

[squirrel dog]

Get a new unit if you can afford it . The elec. bill will be MUCH lower with a new unit,compared to a 'fixed' old unit . The new stuff carrys a warrenty , a low sear rating,just all around better deal . I don't know about heat pumps , some places they are the way to go . others not(?) I know when I built the house I am in now (94) I went with a 5 ton trane unit , not a heat pump . It cycles on and off in the hotness of South Louisiana like it should . The house I sold the unit would run from about 10 am until 10 or 11 pm , not good . In my secound house(camp) the first thing I did was replace the attic unit(27 yrs old) when they pulled it out , it was as big as the frig . the replacement was way smaller . That made a world of diff. Sure you can fix/patch the old unit , just keep an eye on overall costs. Good luck ..... SD ...

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: crab
You cant legally recharge an A/C system yourself...and it requires special tools.

I'd certainly replace a 25 year old system, and have an installer do it properly.

That is false. As long as you don;t vent gas you can work on your AC system all you like.

 

[Vette73]

OP as old as the system sounds I wourl not get it worked on. If you want to do soem stuff yourself I can offer advice on that but don't waste money on repairs as it will eat you up.


Get a new system and tackle advanatge of the tax system right now. Also if you are handy do the Duct work yourself. That is easy for most homes and saves a lot of money.

Now if you are really handy then just get a new airhandler (inside part) and new AC/Heat pump. Heat pumps should work well where you are at if it does not have one now.

 

[Red Squirrel]

I'd look into the cost of getting a new compressor. That is my guess on why the coils are not cold enough. Either the compressor is not pushing hard enough, or there is a possible leak, but I'm more leaning towards the compressor just not having enough power, so it's not compressing enough, to produce the pressure needed for the gas to cool the coils when it hits that stage.

I'm no AC expert though, I just know the basics of how it works.

Could also be something silly like the compressor not even turning on at all (and just the fan)

 

[boomerang]

You've gotten a lot of good advice here IMO. I'll embellish and add a little bit more.

There are a lot of HVAC companies around here that are switching over to a do-it-yourself method of doing business. Perhaps there are some in your area? If you feel up to replacing the major components yourself, I'm sure they'd be willing to sell them to you and then come out and evacuate and charge the system. Speaking for myself, that's more work than I'd want to take on, but to each his own. You'll want their assistance on sizing the components however. That's pretty important. This is a big expenditure and not one you want to do over because the components are sized too small for instance.

Obviously if you want to save money, have them charge up your existing system. If it's cooling, but not sufficiently, there's a good chance you just need to add refrigerant.

As others have said, you'll save by getting newer, more efficient equipment. The tax savings are icing on the cake.

 

[runzwithsizorz]

Try to find an honest service tech, NOT A / SALESMAN, and see what he says. After that, you could more easily make a decision. How long can you guarantee you'll be in the home?, can you afford it? Is it big enough? Room additions? Replacing an AC unit is not a one man, DIY job. Weigh the costs of, delivery fees, disposal fees, the fees your friends are gonna cost you to muscle the old one out, and the new one in. AFAIK, it is not unlawful to DIY, however, by doing so you will probably void the warranty. And If you think your going to get a tech to sign off on your work, think again, your not in Joyzee.

 

[alphatarget1]

Thanks for the advice guys. The problem is that I probably won't stay at this place longer than 5 years, and I'll rent some rooms out (it's a college town). I'd like to keep the expenses as low as possible for this "investment". I guess if I had the AC serviced and it ends up breaking in a few years before I move out then I'd have to spend money then to replace it, meaning it's probably good to replace it now. I'm leaning towards getting a split system of a heat pump with a SEER of 15 so I can get my bailout from the federal government...

A friend who worked as a receptionist from an AC place out of place told me that it'd cost around $3200 for a 13 SEER system. I need at least 15 SEER to qualify for space cash (south park reference), and I think the most I'd want to spend is $4000. I'll call some places next week to get some quotes.

 

[alphatarget1]

By the way the house is a 1400 sq ft house. I'm thinking a 3 ton unit should do. I'll probably end up adding more insulation in the attic...

 

[dud]

A friend who worked as a receptionist from an AC place out of place told me that it'd cost around $3200 for a 13 SEER system. I need at least 15 SEER to qualify for space cash (south park reference), and I think the most I'd want to spend is $4000. I'll call some places next week to get some quotes.

That seems like a low-side estimate to me. I live in Florida and a slightly larger house. A 13 seer system with heat pump and air handler replacement would cost between $5,000 and $6,500. You are correct about the tax incentives to install energy efficiency into your home but you might want to look into the amount. I believe it is 30% or a maximum of $1,500. Note ? not all ENERGY STAR products will qualify for the tax credit. I actually found an honest A/C company who had been advertising the incentive and was told that yes, you can get it but it is limited to a very limited number of highly efficient units.

Go get at least 3 estimates to verify that price. It seems too low ..

 

[SonnyDaze]

1983....2009 = 26 years.

Yeah it's time for a replacement. It might seem like a big investment now but if you sell the place later it will save you some headaches and add to the value. And you might even get a tax break next year.

 

[GregGreen]

Originally posted by: dud

A friend who worked as a receptionist from an AC place out of place told me that it'd cost around $3200 for a 13 SEER system. I need at least 15 SEER to qualify for space cash (south park reference), and I think the most I'd want to spend is $4000. I'll call some places next week to get some quotes.

That seems like a low-side estimate to me. I live in Florida and a slightly larger house. A 13 seer system with heat pump and air handler replacement would cost between $5,000 and $6,500. You are correct about the tax incentives to install energy efficiency into your home but you might want to look into the amount. I believe it is 30% or a maximum of $1,500. Note ? not all ENERGY STAR products will qualify for the tax credit. I actually found an honest A/C company who had been advertising the incentive and was told that yes, you can get it but it is limited to a very limited number of highly efficient units.

Go get at least 3 estimates to verify that price. It seems too low ..

I don't know about costs, I work for a wholesaler and only know the costs the company that would install the system for you would pay. To qualify for the tax credits, you need a system that meets 13 SEER completely -- meaning that that furnace/air handler, coil (inside unit), and condenser (outside unit) need to work together to meet that rating. A competent installer should be able to tell you what you would need to meet this requirements.

On another note, you cannot buy the equipment yourself because you need to be licensed to work with the refrigerant (R-22 until the end of the year, or R-410A). Supposedly you can buy a system if you buy a complete system, but my company doesn't sell one and I'm not sure if any manufacturers make one (usually sold as separate components).

 

[iGas]

Many older system from the 80s are 9 SEER or less, while more efficient system today may reach as high as 21-22 SEER, and 19 SEER or greater becoming more and more common.

If 10 SEER cost $100 a month to operate, then a 20 SEER system would cost $50.

It make more sense to replace the old inefficient R-22 outside condenser unit with more efficient R-410a system. And, repairing the old system doesn't guarantee that the condenser thinning copper pipes aren't going to develop new pinholes.

Yes, you can do your own blower and control replacement, but good luck at finding installer that will guarantee works that aren't done by them.

I'm not sure of the grant requirement in your area but according to this page, your air source split system must have a minimum HSPF of 8.5, EER of 12.5 and SEER of 15 to qualify for the tax incentives.

SEER or EER is not verything, because you also have to look at the HSPF rating for heating as well. It would make more sense to get higher HSPF rating unit for an area that requires long heating season and sacrifice a bit of SEER/EER performance during cooling period. And, purchase highest possible SEER/EER rating that your wallet can afford for area that required long cooling period with short heating period.

<--- Plumbing/gas/HVAC

 

[drnickriviera]

You also have one more thing to look at. Make sure the home inspector knows what he's talking about. How long was the unit allowed to run? Is it vacant now? I just want to make sure that it wasn't 95 F in the house and he let it run for 10 mins. I know inspectors will try to find something 'wrong' to make it look like they've done something.

 

[microAmp]

Originally posted by: bobdole369

You cant legally recharge an A/C system yourself

Sure you can. Provided you don't vent R-22 to the atmosphere. also new installs should be a different refrigerant. R410a, R-134a, r407c, etc.

However, a 20 year old unit isn't quite efficient, I would replace the whole lot.

You need an EPA certification to recover refrigerant but not one to charge the system but can't buy refrigerant without the certification either.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Replace it with a more efficient unit. You'll spend less in monthly bills, especially if you live in an area where you need to run it a lot.