Home Theater - Yamaha665/6.1 setup questions...

[rivbyte]

Hello...
I have a HDTV Display mounted on the wall with one HDMI cable presently connected to my Time-Warner-DVR STB, soon to be connected to my new Yamaha rx-v665,along with a 6.1 speaker setup.
It's not hooked up yet, because I'm going round and round trying to figure out the best way to do this with less cabling in the walls. Besides, I would have to take the TV back down to connect any additional cables in it and that would be a BIG hassle.

Now, with this receiver, I'm thinking all I have to do is keep the one HDMI from Display to the AVR, and then all the other components into the AVR. In doing this, will I still get 6.1 from the display via the receiver?

I was told this?
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"Put simply, if you run an HDMI from your display to the receiver you will only get 2.1 audio (some sort of restriction due to copyright laws)." IS THIS TRUE?

"You must pass all audio through the receiver first in order to get all the audio formats in proper 7.1."

"If you want to sometimes just have the display on without the receiver you can run a separate optical cable for audio and a component video feed directly to the display from the cable box/sat receiver." I?d rather not.
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I kind of wanted to have a choice on either listening to the TV speakers for just watching regular broadcast, or the AVR, but this seems like a lot more of a hassle

MY YAMAHA RX-V665 Receiver -
http://www.yamaha.com/yec/prod...ID=1504&DETYP=RELATION

HSU Speakers - http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/performance2.html

What else do I need to do to get all the Audio/Video features from the AVR and the Display to play through all the 6.1 speakers? Anything at all, or am I good to go? Currently, I think there a few 5.1 Dolby programming channels on TV, and the 6th rear-center speaker matrixes along with the rear-right and rear left speaker.
I thought this AVR did it all.
Thanks a bunch!

Basically, what would result if using the one HDMI from the TV to the receiver,with the TW-DVR Cable and Blu-ray also connected via HDMI into the receiver?

 

[yours truly]

id like to add a rear centre speaker to make a 6.1 configuration also, but as theres only one centre channel on the amp (rx-v3900) so im not sure how it can work

what i mean is, you'd have to connect the rear centre to either the left or right surround channel and not both. wouldnt that make the sound imbalanced?

im sure theres a work around though

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Originally posted by: rivbyte

"Put simply, if you run an HDMI from your display to the receiver you will only get 2.1 audio (some sort of restriction due to copyright laws)." IS THIS TRUE?

I think they might have meant that if you go

Cable box connected to TV, then TV connected to Receiver
Then you will probably not get 5.1 (or 6.1) unless you apply prologicII or some other fake surround

If you do Cable box connected to Receiver, then Receiver connected to TV
Then it should work.

I think you should even be able to turn on the TV's speakers this was too?

I believe you only run into trouble if you try to connect to the TV first and then the receiver.

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Originally posted by: hopeless74
id like to add a rear centre speaker to make a 6.1 configuration also, but as theres only one centre channel on the amp (rx-v3900) so im not sure how it can work

what i mean is, you'd have to connect the rear centre to either the left or right surround channel and not both. wouldnt that make the sound imbalanced?

im sure theres a work around though

The receiver should be able to detect there's only one speaker hooked up or have an option for you to select how the rear speakers are configured.

The manual probably tells you which rear speaker output to connect to in the case that you want a 6.1 setup.

One of the benefits of 7.1 is that with 6.1, it's hard to tell if sounds are coming directly ahead or behind you. 7.1 spreads out the rear sounds and then it's obviously coming from behind you.

 

[rivbyte]

ok and thanks.

The speakers I purchased are the 6.1 HSU performance VT-12 Ventriloquist system, (the Link is on above post of mine) and is an unconventional way of hooking up the speakers,with the left and right rear surround going to the receiver, but the left and right fronts are wired into theri front center channel,then from the center to the receiver. The center has an on/off switch which on "on" gives it more presence. Instead of having the center-rear with it's own direct wire to the AVR. Also, the center rear has four wire posts so each of the rear surrounds are bi-wired to that center-rear speaker.

If I hook it up like the following,what result would I get? I know this way, I would not be able to have a choice on listening to either the TV or the AVR? I thought this Yamaha 665 can do it all,with a basic config like this. Not using any tos digital audio. I read that people are running TOS digital out from Cable box to Receiver...do I have to?

1) One HDMI from Display (TV on wall) into receiver. (hdmi)
2) Time-warner DVR into the receiver. (hdmi)
3) Sony Bluray into receiver. (hdmi)
4) Progressive scan DC/DVD player.into reciever. (component)
5) OR get a new upconverter DVD/CD /Mp3/jpeg player with HDMI.then hook up the VCR using those component inputs ..I haven't thought about that yet.

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Honestly I don't see the point in most cases for people using TV speakers integrated into the TV when they have a more capable speaker system in the same room. Volume controls are totally controllable by the user and a receiver would likely have some sort of night mode / dynamic range compression setting that would help if the goal is to keep the volume low but have everything still audible.

Is being able to use the TV speakers important to you? From the OP it sounds like you kind of want that option... could you explain more about why this is important to you? Is it only to be used when watching off the DVR?

My first receiver with HDMI capability is still sitting in my livingroom waiting for me to build a rack for it, so I only have limited audio HDMI experience.
I do believe that with the Time Warner DVR hooked up to your receiver via HDMI that the receiver will pass both Audio and Video on to the display so you'd still be able to choose to use your TV speakers if you wanted to (someone correct me if I'm wrong, I haven't looked into this issue since it doesn't apply to me).

What do you mean by the Yamaha 665 "can do it all"?
For the DVR and Bluray player, the Yamaha will be able to take audio off the HDMI. (This is assuming the DVR sends both audio and video through HDMI)

Maybe I'm missing something - are you using the tuner in the display itself as a source? Is the cable hooked up to the display directly and not through the DVR?

For your DVD player if it's hooked up with component, you'll need either digital optical or digital coaxial to hook up audio from that source to the receiver. If you will always be using the receiver for audio with the DVD player, you do not need to make an additional audio connection to the TV.

If you hook up a VCR, it will probably have composite or maybe s-video as video output. You'd need to hook that up along with red/white analog audio cables to the receiver. Looking at the specifications, I believe the 665 with convert this to 1080p HDMI video for you, so you'd still be ok with just one HDMI cable running from receiver to display.

 

[rivbyte]

YOyoYOhowsDAjello,

Your absolutely right! I don't need no stinkin' TV speakers when I have a surround setup to listen to. Besides, TV is already on the wall with one HDMI going to the AVR, when hooked up. For now, it's into the TW-DVR Cable box.

You asked me ,"What do you mean by the Yamaha 665 "can do it all"?
Well, I have been so misled that thinking that the older Onkyo's that I originally thought of purchasing would need more HDMI/component/tos Digital hookups, but the salesman told me this newer Yamaha 665 is "good to go". I would only need one HDMI from the TV display into the AVR receiver and I would not need any other cabling. Then everything else would HDMI into the receiver,except for the component VCR or the CD/DVD player. No matter what people tell me about me not having a clue is right.

 

[yours truly]

yoyo do you think a 6.1 setup would be worth it? id like 7 speakers but i havent the space

would dolby digital, true hd and dts hd take advantage of the rear centre?

many thanks

 

[rivbyte]

YOyoYOhowsDAjello,

Your absolutely right!

You said, "This is assuming the DVR sends both audio and video through HDMI". Time Warner just confirmed that it does.

I don't need no stinkin' TV speakers when I have a surround setup to listen to. Besides, TV is already on the wall with one HDMI going to the AVR, when hooked up. For now, it's into the TW-DVR Cable box.

You asked me ,"What do you mean by the Yamaha 665 "can do it all"?
Well, I have been so misled that thinking that the older Onkyo's that I originally thought of purchasing would need more HDMI/component/tos Digital Optical hookups, but the salesman @ FRYS told me this newer Yamaha 665 is "good to go". I would only need one HDMI from the TV display into the AVR receiver and I would not need any other cabling. Then everything else would HDMI into the receiver,except for the component VCR or the CD/DVD player. No matter what people tell me about me not having a clue is right. I just called TimeWarner and he said that I was on the right track with TV Display to AVR and then all other components into Receiver via HDMI.

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Originally posted by: hopeless74
yoyo do you think a 6.1 setup would be worth it? id like 7 speakers but i havent the space

would dolby digital, true hd and dts hd take advantage of the rear centre?

many thanks

Dolby Digital EX uses matrix technology to give you 6.1 or 7.1 playback (7.1 would have the rear speakers playing back mono I believe).
DTS-ES might be matrix or might have a discrete rear channel in some cases.

I'm not as familiar with TrueHD and DTSHD (my first receiver with HDMI audio input is still sitting in my livingroom waiting for me to hook it up). These formats are able to give you discrete 7.1 playback (or 6.1 if you have it configured that way). From what I understand, good surround / rear usage is becoming increasingly common.

Before you decide whether to add any speakers at all, make sure you'd be able to set them up well.

http://www.dolby.com/consumer/...inment/roomlayout.html
Dolby has guidelines for how to set up speakers effectively. If you can't set up 6.1 or 7.1 effectively, then don't bother.

I have a 7.1 setup and have enjoyed it when movies take advantage of surround effects. Often times, movies use the surround / rear effects rarely or for little impact beyond basic ambiance. In these cases, going from 5.1 to 6.1 or 7.1 would be relatively insignificant.

Maybe you should start your own thread about this so you can get more opinions on your own situation. I could move these replies to that new thread.

EDIT: I got your PM but you have replies disabled.
"Sounds good" was my intended reply

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Originally posted by: rivbyte
YOyoYOhowsDAjello,

Your absolutely right!

You said, "This is assuming the DVR sends both audio and video through HDMI". Time Warner just confirmed that it does.

I don't need no stinkin' TV speakers when I have a surround setup to listen to. Besides, TV is already on the wall with one HDMI going to the AVR, when hooked up. For now, it's into the TW-DVR Cable box.

You asked me ,"What do you mean by the Yamaha 665 "can do it all"?
Well, I have been so misled that thinking that the older Onkyo's that I originally thought of purchasing would need more HDMI/component/tos Digital Optical hookups, but the salesman @ FRYS told me this newer Yamaha 665 is "good to go". I would only need one HDMI from the TV display into the AVR receiver and I would not need any other cabling. Then everything else would HDMI into the receiver,except for the component VCR or the CD/DVD player. No matter what people tell me about me not having a clue is right. I just called TimeWarner and he said that I was on the right track with TV Display to AVR and then all other components into Receiver via HDMI.

If you're not worried about using the TV's integrated speakers, then I think you're set to go with the 665.

The specifications were a little bit vague about video capabilities stating "Analog video upscaling to full HD 1080p"
I assume that means 1080p via HDMI (rather than through component).

Actually... looking at ProductWiki, it states "No video upconversion to component video" as a negative, which means that the upconversion of all sources to 1080p must mean HDMI as well. (I'd look it up in the manual, but Yamaha requires registering to get manuals and such and I didn't want to do that initially).

Based on what I can see about it, I think you'll be in good shape hooking up all your sources to the receiver and then a single HDMI cable to the TV. The receiver should be able to convert all incoming signals to HDMI for the TV while taking audio off the sources (HDMI or other) and playing back the audio in stereo or full surround when appropriate. If you have a stereo source (like MP3s, many cable shows, etc.), you can apply a surround processing mode like Dolby Prologic II and get pseudo surround if you prefer that to stereo playback.

 

[yours truly]

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello
EDIT: I got your PM but you have replies disabled.
"Sounds good" was my intended reply

thanks i appreciate it

didnt realise my pm's were set to disable,

cheers

edit, wtf have i done here,

- end quote!!

Quotes fixed
AV&HT Moderator YOyoYOhowsDAjello

 

[rivbyte]

Okie-Dokie, all up and running...

Thank you for all who contributed to my questions on setting up my HT system. I ended up running 16 gauge to the fronts and center, and 14 gauge to the rear and surround back (center-rear channel) and so far, it sounds good.One HDMI from Display (in-wall) to the AVR,and everytthing into that. The only bummer is I have three different remotes..Turn on/off TV with Samsung,2) turn off Time-Warner cable with TW remote,and 3) push the Master power OFF on the top right side, usually twice to shut off. As far as programming,I inputted the codes for each component,VCR,CD/DVD player,Time Warner cable and Samsung TV,so is it still normal to use three different remotes? No Biggie.

All I have to do is to read more on my RX-V665 Yamaha receiver as far as the surround modes go. Basically, I'm guessing I won't get all the good stuff as far as effect features from this AVR until I watch a BD movie?

On watching regular TV broadcasts, I am using the DOLBY DIGITAL setting. From there I can use the 7 channel,or 2 channel Stereo setting, or the Straight Enhancer. There are other buttons on the remote like the PURE DIRECT,which when I press the SURROUND DECODER, it displays"NOT AVAILABLE".

In order to use the other features on this AVR, I'm guessing I can get more effects out of this AVR by watching a 5.1 broadcast,or a Bluray, then and only then, will I see features like the Dolby TrueHD,DTS-HD Master Audio,Kick in. I have not checked out the Neural surround with the music feature.

Not a big deal, but is this normal? When I turn UP the volume on the remote,the sound level on the AVR displays that it going minus(-) down,not up. ie: -20.00db,instead of +20.00db


This receiver is running hotter than I thought, it is in it's own cabinet shelf, with the window open all the time. I will consider buying an "Antec Low Profile AV Component Cooler" for on top of the receiver to help cool it...if they really work.

PS. My speakers are from HSU Research Sound in Orange County, Ca. They are amazing!
Thanks again for all who chimed in to help me.