Home Server / Soft Gaming up to 500€

[ruimarto]

Hey. I wan't to build a PC that works as a file server, HTPC and that allows for some gaming.

1. Used for:
- Steam with Rocksmith 2014 (about the only game I play nowadays but I do enjoy some FPS)
- Bitvise SSH Server (secure remote file access)
- CrashPlan (backups from my Macbook)
- TeamViewer
- Synergy
- qBittorrent + uTorrent + Bittorrent
- Plex Server and Home Theater (also streams Full HD content to a Raspberry PI and a Samsung Smart TV)
- Occasionally some heavy Excel use and MS SQL Server (just to play with some SQL tutorials)

2. Price range: About 400-450€

3. Portugal. Prices outside Portugal (inside EU) are not all that different.

4. www.globaldata.pt

5. No brand preference. One of my favorite PCs so far had an AMD X2 3800+. From what I've seen, going with AMD is going to get me more Sata ports and a better integrated GPU. However Intel are less power hungry and run cooler.

6. Already have HDDs (mostly two 2Tb WD Green, one 2Tb Samsung, one 1.5Tb Seagate, one 2Tb MyBook Live and one 3Tb USB 3.0 MyBook Essential) and cases (CM Elite 120 Advanced and an old standard ATX case).

7. I spend most of the time away from home so "undervolting" or anything else that reduces the power bill while I'm away. Only need full power at night and weekends.

8. 40" Full HD (1920x1080) Samsung TV

9. In two weeks or so.

Currently I have an Asus AT5IONT-i (Atom 1.8 Dual Core and Nvidia ION2) with 2x2Gb DDR3 inside a Cooler Master Elite 120 Advanced with LC-Power 75W PSU (with external brick). 1,5Tb+2Tb Internal HDD and lots of external drives. I'm going to sell my PS3 and I want to get rid of all these external enclosures. Also I sometimes notice that it can't keep up with Rocksmith, even with everything set to low.

I've been looking into this hardware:
AMD A10-6800K Black - 122€
AsRock FM2A88X Killer - 88€
Kingston 2x4Gb HyperX - 88€
Corsair CX-430W (80+) - 42€
About 340€

Or
Intel i3 4150 - 103€
AsRock Z97 Extreme4 - 140€
Kingston 2x4Gb HyperX - 88€
Corsair CX-430W (80+) - 42€
About 373€

Low noise and low power consumption is of high importance. The PC will be in my room and on 24/7. Leftover money can revert to an SSD or more HDDs, otherwise a Define R4 case

 

[mfenn]

So really you want a desktop that's hooked to the PC and does file serving on the side, not a dedicated file server.

When you say that you want to get rid of the external enclosures, do you mean pulling the drives out or buying new drives? Have you checked that the drive inside the enclosure is a standard drive and not one with the USB controller built into the PCB?

Do you need an optical drive?

Since your goal is low power, you definitely want to stick with Intel.

Core i3 4150 103€
ASRock B85 Pro4 72€ - 6 SATA ports is enough w/o optical drive, can add SATA controllers later if you buy more drives
G.Skill DDR3 1600 8GB 68€
Corsair 430CX 43€
Fractal Design R4 94€
Total: 380€

You could also go with the Extreme4 that you listed with 8 SATA ports and still be at 410€.

 

[ruimarto]

First of all, thanks a lot! :awe:

Precisely! I've called it a home server / soft gaming rig because file serving will be it's primary task. I'm only home (and awake) about two hours a day and most of the work and social networking stuff I do in my MacbookPro.
I also know that a dedicated file server has his advantages but I had something similar (MyBook World NAS with Transmission + Atom HTPC) and I've come to the conclusion that I rather have my files local. This way it's not limited/affected by network issues (ex: I can reboot my router while watching a movie).
Notice that I could still use my Atom as a dedicated server, but I'd have to buy a PCI-E sata controller and mood the Elite 120 to take on at leats 6 HDDs. And probably replace the 75w PSU. This would mean spending over 100€ more on an old machine plus a buying a new desktop. Selling it reduces the cost of upgrading to a more expandable and future-proof rig.

Getting rid of the enclosures means pulling the drives out. I've opened the enclosures before to mix and match drives and enclosures according to my liking, so I know they're all standard sata drives. But I will also be adding more drives in the future, probably up to 8 or 10.

No, I have no use for an optical drive.

About the board :hmm: I just went for the best chipset I could find and specs looked convenient for future expandability. Is m.2 with and SSD worth it? And how about if I'd like to add a dedicated GPU down the road? And if I do can it switch back to the integrated GPU to save power when I'm not gaming?

Btw, will the PSU meet the demands? Or would it be a good idea to go up to 600w just in case?

 

[mfenn]

About the board :hmm: I just went for the best chipset I could find and specs looked convenient for future expandability. Is m.2 with and SSD worth it? And how about if I'd like to add a dedicated GPU down the road? And if I do can it switch back to the integrated GPU to save power when I'm not gaming?

B85 vs. H87 vs. Z87 vs. H97 vs. Z97 doesn't really make a difference in terms of overall performance, only features. M.2 in it's current Z97 implementation is pretty sketchy. There's not really enough PCIe lanes available to drive all the features at the same time, so most boards end up disabling SATA ports when you plug in an M.2 drive.

As for adding a GPU, yes you can add a GPU to pretty much any board, including the B85 that I linked. You could switch your monitor (TV) between the GPU and IGP outputs if you wanted to, but new GPUs have very low idle power consumption, so it might not be worth it.

Btw, will the PSU meet the demands? Or would it be a good idea to go up to 600w just in case?

430W is plenty for a box with HDDs and a light GPU (up to GTX 750 Ti class). If you want to add a more powerful midrange or high end GPU, then you should bump up the PSU.

 

[ruimarto]

B85 vs. H87 vs. Z87 vs. H97 vs. Z97 doesn't really make a difference in terms of overall performance, only features. M.2 in it's current Z97 implementation is pretty sketchy. There's not really enough PCIe lanes available to drive all the features at the same time, so most boards end up disabling SATA ports when you plug in an M.2 drive.

Nevermind the M.2 then... I think I'll go with Asus H97-Pro. Promises better audio and has 4K TV support, more USB 3.0 ports, all sata are 6Gb/s and has Intel ethernet.

As for adding a GPU, yes you can add a GPU to pretty much any board, including the B85 that I linked. You could switch your monitor (TV) between the GPU and IGP outputs if you wanted to, but new GPUs have very low idle power consumption, so it might not be worth it.

If it's as simple as switching the connection, I can simply use two HDMI cables and just switch between HDMI 1 and HDMI 2 on the AV receiver. On the other hand, during the day everything is turned off, so it might not make a difference.

430W is plenty for a box with HDDs and a light GPU (up to GTX 750 Ti class). If you want to add a more powerful midrange or high end GPU, then you should bump up the PSU.

Yeah, I don't see myself going any higher than that as far as GPUs go. If the IGP is as good as some people say, I don't even see myself buying one at all. Rocksmith 2014 @ medium settings without breaks or lag is enough for me.

Thanks a lot.

 

[Mike Roch]

The iGPU will be fine, esp since you spend most of your time pirate downloading software. Dont need Windows now.

 

[ruimarto]

I could go into OT and show you that A) unless it's about software and watching a TV show/Movie sooner, piracy is rather pointless in Portugal, B) here it's not illegal to download unless there's commercial intent (similar to fair use) and C) I have free legit access to all the software I need except games. Those are paid from my own pocket and that's why I only have about five games: Rocksmith and Rocksmith 2014 (and some older stuff) for PC and CoD MW3, Fifa 2012 and Dirt 3 for PS3. Oh, and I also have League of Legends... which is free.

Also, the reason I rather use the PC for gaming is precisely because I pay for my games. E.g. Rocksmith (without the cable) was nearly 90€ in Portugal which is almost $125. However, since my ex lives in NYC, I was able to use her Amazon US account to buy the game and download it to Portugal, avoiding postage and customs (in Portugal taxes go over 20%). I bought the game for $32.65 which is less than 25€. I paid 60€ each for the CoD and Fifa DVDs, while Dirt3 was 40€ at the PSN Store, so it's a lot more.

Sorry about the offtopic, but Mike, try not to point fingers at people you don't even know, let alone the contents of one's computer.

I'm not saying that I don't do it ever, but there's a lot less of it than you might think. Torrents are mostly to download free software (like linux distros), software for which I have a license but not the installation CDs and rare stuff (like documentaries). The reason I use torrents is because it's easier to control remotely. Even from your phone, you just send the .torrent file to a folder and the download starts. I find this much harder to do with web links.
I also worked as a professional photographer for 5 years, therefore the need for storage and remote access. It's mostly archives of thousands of RAW images and unprocessed HD Video. I still do it as a hobby and since I'm a competitive ballroom dancer I usually keep footage from competitions and practices.

 

[ruimarto]

After talking to the IT guys at work, two questions were raised:

1 - Why not an i5? They say that idle power consumption (80% of the time) is not all that different and that I'll regret the i3 in two years or less. And that for the kind of work I do, I should be using a low end i7, but since it's my home computer they agree it's not worth it, so a low end i5 would be a good compromise.

2 - Server motherboard? They told me that for as little as 100€ more I could get a similar system with a board that's a lot less limited regarding expansion and Sata bandwidth. Even talked about future possibility of dual-CPU, in which CPU2 only kicks in if CPU1 goes over X% usage. But of course that would cost a lot more.

 

[mfenn]

After talking to the IT guys at work, two questions were raised:

1 - Why not an i5? They say that idle power consumption (80% of the time) is not all that different and that I'll regret the i3 in two years or less. And that for the kind of work I do, I should be using a low end i7, but since it's my home computer they agree it's not worth it, so a low end i5 would be a good compromise.

With an ASUS H97-Pro, you're sitting at 420 euros. The least expensive i5, the 4460 is 63 euros more than the i3 that you're looking at. So you could get an i5 if you're OK blowing your budget by ~30 euros.

However, and i5 is completely unnecessary unless you see your usage pattern changing significantly over the next few years.

2 - Server motherboard? They told me that for as little as 100€ more I could get a similar system with a board that's a lot less limited regarding expansion and Sata bandwidth. Even talked about future possibility of dual-CPU, in which CPU2 only kicks in if CPU1 goes over X% usage. But of course that would cost a lot more.

That's, well, silly to put it mildly.

Your machine is not really a server, it's an HTPC with file serving duties. Server motherboards don't typically pipe the IGP out to the VGA (only) output. They instead use a very basic 2D chip based on the ATI Rage128 (I kid you not) because that chip is extremely compatible with server OS's. They also don't include good audio support (if any at all). And dual-CPU is just crazy talk, you'd be spending almost your entire original budget on a dual-processor capable Xeon.

 

[ruimarto]

You're right! I've been googling server MBs and either they're not aware of hardware prices or I just got pranked by one of the IT guys... And definitely a poor choice for HTPCs unless you spend about 100 more on GPU and sound card.

About the i5, I think their point is valid. I only use my home computer about 2h/day and work usually stays at work. But, between processing my photos or rendering a dance video and the times that'll have to bring work home, the i5 will get things done much faster. And both the i3 and i5 will be faster than my Mac (2009 C2D 2.53MHz and 8Gb DDR3).

My biggest concern was power consumption, but what I've read confirms what they say, that in idle it makes no difference. Also they suggested a sleep/wake scheme controlled from my phone to avoid keeping the computer on 24/7.

The budget isn't strick, it's just there for reference and to keep me grounded. And the Define can wait. I can get it cheaper and I'm reading great reviews about the Deep Silence here at Anandtech.

Again, thanks for you're help and time. You've been most helpful.

 

[mfenn]

Glad to help, let us know how the build goes.

 

[ruimarto]

Hey! Had some minor issues with my build. The stock indicator on websites is not very reliable, so most of the hardware was unavailable. Also, I saw a Define XL in another store, so I only ordered components. Turns out the store didn't have any Define XL on stock until August! I then went to the first store to get a Define R4, but since it was a separate order, I couldn't asked them to assemble (it's only 15&#8364.

So, after almost a decade since I've built a PC, here's the result:

- Asus H97-Pro
- Intel i5 4690
- Kingston 8Gb 1600MHz Fury Black
- XFX 450w Pro Power Suply
- 1.5Tb Samsung EcoGreen F2
- 2Tb Samsung EcoGreen F2
- 2Tb WD Caviar Green
- 1Tb WD Caviar Green
- Define R4
- Sound Blaster Audigy SE
- Dell 24" U2414H UltraSharp
- Logitech Media Keyboard (PS2!!!!)
- Wacom Pen&Touch A5

The HDD were all removed from external drives, but I still have two WD MyBook drives, a 3Tb USB 3.0 and a 2Tb NAS.
I also found the Sound Blaster in my garage along with my old keyboard! And it came in handy since the MB doesn't have a SPDIF out (only has the pins inside).

Here are some pics with my old HTPC/FileServer on top:

(Yes, my cable management skills aren't the best)

The inside:

And the screen showing the BIOS:

 

[mfenn]

Glad it went well!

 

[ruimarto]

It didn't... I have no sound. :whiste:

The optical SPDIF connection is only a header and the adapter is sold separately, so I've changed the digital output to HDMI in the BIOS options.

My connections:
DVI > DVI to HDMI cable > Dell Monitor > AKG Headphones (3.5" Jack)
HDMI > HDMI Cable > Yamaha RX-V371 > Samsung TV & Yamaha Speakers

I've manually installed Intel Display Audio Driver and I finally got my receiver to show up in playback devices. The green bars move but I still get no sound.

I removed the Audigy until I find a store that has a SPDIF 3.5" to Digital Coaxial cable available. Other than that, it only has analog outputs.

 

[mfenn]

It didn't... I have no sound. :whiste:

The optical SPDIF connection is only a header and the adapter is sold separately, so I've changed the digital output to HDMI in the BIOS options.

My connections:
DVI > DVI to HDMI cable > Dell Monitor > AKG Headphones (3.5" Jack)
HDMI > HDMI Cable > Yamaha RX-V371 > Samsung TV & Yamaha Speakers

I've manually installed Intel Display Audio Driver and I finally got my receiver to show up in playback devices. The green bars move but I still get no sound.

I removed the Audigy until I find a store that has a SPDIF 3.5" to Digital Coaxial cable available. Other than that, it only has analog outputs.

What format(s) do you have set in the HDMI playback device properties? Does your receiver pick up the carrier at all?

For the headphones, you might as well just plug them into the analog jack on the back, I doubt the DAC in the UltraSharp is amazing quality.

 

[ruimarto]

I've tried with DVD and CD (16bit 48000 and 16bit 44100). No luck... But yes, the receiver shows up the signal indicator, both the red HDMI (video signal) and the speaker setup (sound). The same way the receiver itself is showing on windows playback devices. Still no sound.

I've checked mute settings and I'm using the sound properties panel test function to rule out app related issues.

About the headphones connected to the UltraSharp, it's just for diagnosis purposes, in case the sound goes trough the DVI output. Other than that, they're connected to the receiver as well.

PS: Just tried the case front panel analog output connected to one of the receiver's analog input and sound works, so this is definitely a hdmi output issue.

 

[mfenn]

I've tried with DVD and CD (16bit 48000 and 16bit 44100). No luck... But yes, the receiver shows up the signal indicator, both the red HDMI (video signal) and the speaker setup (sound). The same way the receiver itself is showing on windows playback devices. Still no sound.

I've checked mute settings and I'm using the sound properties panel test function to rule out app related issues.

About the headphones connected to the UltraSharp, it's just for diagnosis purposes, in case the sound goes trough the DVI output. Other than that, they're connected to the receiver as well.

PS: Just tried the case front panel analog output connected to one of the receiver's analog input and sound works, so this is definitely a hdmi output issue.

Go into the supported formats tab of the HDMI playback device properties and uncheck all the boxes that you're receiver doesn't support. For example, I have these checked on mine:

DTS Audio
Dolby Digital
48.0 KHz

 

[ruimarto]

It's not editable.. I see a list but there's nothing to check or uncheck

Whoops, clicked edit instead of quote.

mfenn
General Hardware Moderator

 

[mfenn]

It's not editable.. I see a list but there's nothing to check or uncheck

Are you logged into an admin account?

 

[ruimarto]

Yes, I am. Found the problem! In the graphics options, I have to choose the TV as my main screen and set the UltraSharp as a clone or not in use.
The strange thing is that sound does not alternate according to the main screen. If I set the TV they both play sound, if I set the UltraSharp none of them plays sound. Awkward.