Home> Politics Obama Pledges To 'Degrade and Ultimately Destroy' ISIS

[Attic]

The only way to defeat a terrorist group is by removing the poverty. There are 2 ways to remove poverty, both are incredibly insanely expensive and complicated. One involves unforgivable and genocidal crimes against humanity, the other involves empathy and charity on a scale not seen before.

Win.


Where do I vote for this? Oh,.. lose.

 

[Attic]

KK.

Irrelevant, at this point, as all those Iraqis Dubya trained threw all theirs on the ground too, and let em capture a few airbases etc.

Pretty lame.

Ask for proof. Get it, and then go into political crap and perversion of thinking.


Our involvement with funneling arms and munitions in various parts of the world indirectly arms terrorist organizations. We might be able to get away with saying this wasn't our intent. But when you do something and you know what will happen regardless of intent then their is responsibility for outcomes because awareness is now present. Awareness is responsibility enough given what's at stake.

We can only pretend to be a fool to the outcome once before any reasoned mind should start asking what we are willing to tolerate with what Obama is now talking about doing. Obama's (D) insignia is enough to create mass stupidity and perversion of thinking amongst many folks, so if needed pretend it's "Dubya" up there and reason what it means when viewpoints and tolerance then magically changes for what "Dubya" is getting involved in, again. It means those people whose viewpoints change don't really give a shit, the nation is roughly 70%+ this mentality. It explains why government can so easily take improper advantage of the sweat and blood of its people through the proxy of a 2 party system.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Win.


Where do I vote for this? Oh,.. lose.

There is of course no option for a more rational approach, however I'd suggest that poverty is not the issue here and never was. It is more about ideologies and religious practices in this case. The peasants aren't revolting because they don't have a chicken in every pot. It's nothing to do with any of that. It's about the regional cults of personality, but there is real oppression and those who know use that to their personal advantage.

 

[BurnItDwn]

There is of course no option for a more rational approach, however I'd suggest that poverty is not the issue here and never was. It is more about ideologies and religious practices in this case. The peasants aren't revolting because they don't have a chicken in every pot. It's nothing to do with any of that. It's about the regional cults of personality, but there is real oppression and those who know use that to their personal advantage.

The cult of the personality indeed plays a part, But i think deep down at the very bottom of it, its the poverty. Really its poverty combined with discontent. If they were poor as shit, but they were pacified with big macs and shitty cable TV, they would probably sit on their asses rather than go out and raise hell ...

Education can of course cure many of their ailments, but access is difficult..

 

[MongGrel]

You write like an absolute loon.

+1

 

[MongGrel]

More nations willing to fight Islamic State than took on Iraq in 2003

http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-us-international-coalition-20140911-story.html

 

[MongGrel]

Education can of course cure many of their ailments, but access is difficult..

Of course, they intentionally suppress it other than religious indoctrination for the most part.

 

[Fern]

Question: why was a congress vote called when Obama wanted to bomb Syria, but no vote is needed now?

Obama wanted political cover for Libya. It was unpopular in the polls etc. and if Congress refused it it gave him an 'out' for his 'red line' threat.

The mid term elections are soon, and again for political reasons, he doesn't want a Congressional vote because it will put Dem candidates in a potentially difficult position: either vote for war/military action or vote against Obama.

Fern

 

[Fern]

I still want to see someone show me a link to were we armed the rebels in Syria prior to begin with.

Jeez, just google it: http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...cf2ed8-1b0c-11e3-a628-7e6dde8f889d_story.html

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424127887323419604578569830070537040

Obama announced weapons etc to Syria in June of last year.

And could it be that weapons from from other countries such as Saudi Arabia were at least provided because we ask requested it?

Weapons have also flowing into Syria (via Turkey) from Benghazi even before our 'embassy' was attacked two years ago. Hmmm..., wonder what country might have been involved with that?

Fern

 

[MongGrel]

Jeez, just google it: http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...cf2ed8-1b0c-11e3-a628-7e6dde8f889d_story.html

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424127887323419604578569830070537040

Obama announced weapons etc to Syria in June of last year.

And could it be that weapons from from other countries such as Saudi Arabia were at least provided because we ask requested it?

Weapons have also flowing into Syria (via Turkey) from Benghazi even before our 'embassy' was attacked two years ago. Hmmm..., wonder what country might have been involved with that?

Fern

I'll admit to dropping the ball on that one, so much goes on there.

I had it in my head they delayed that in Syria just because they were worries over who were vetted to receive them.

Irrelevant ATM though really, it's spilled milk more or less.

I've always gritted my teeth over things Turkey and Saudi Arabia has been doing myself for years, even if considered allies.

It's obviously not a perfect world.

 

[Fern]

More nations willing to fight Islamic State than took on Iraq in 2003

http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-us-international-coalition-20140911-story.html

That's a 'maybe'.

We'll see. Here's a list of the coalition countries for the 2003 Iraq war, it's about 50. They were partners in various capacities, not all fought, not even close.

http://usiraq.procon.org/view.resource.php?resourceID=000677

I'm not familiar with the nonprofit providing the info. Here's what wiki has on them: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ProCon.org

I've heard the ISIS coalition stands at less than 10 and there's been little info on what each is willing to do.

Fern

 

[MongGrel]

US too late on Syria: former Pentagon chief



http://news.yahoo.com/us-too-syria-former-pentagon-chief-011158254.html

 

[MongGrel]

Rouhani says US should move past nuclear fears, focus on extremism



Of course he would say that with a straight face too, I'm sure.


http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Late...ld-move-past-nuclear-fears-focus-on-extremism

 

[Zorkorist]

Are you saying you called it Mongrel?

You might have called it.

-John

 

[unokitty]

Wrong Turn on Syria: No Convincing Plan

President Obama has put America at the center of a widening war by expanding into Syria airstrikes against the Islamic State, the Sunni extremist group known as ISIS and ISIL. He has done this without allowing the public debate that needs to take place before this nation enters another costly and potentially lengthy conflict in the Middle East.

He says he has justification for taking military action against the Islamic State and Khorasan, another militant group. But his assertions have not been tested or examined by the people’s representatives in Congress. How are Americans to know whether they have the information to make any judgment on the wisdom of his actions?

There isn’t a full picture — because Mr. Obama has not provided one — of how this bombing campaign will degrade the extremist groups without unleashing unforeseen consequences in a violent and volatile region. In the absence of public understanding or discussion and a coherent plan, the strikes in Syria were a bad decision.

New York Times Editorial Board on record...

"No Convincing Plan." "...a bad decision."

Uno

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Wrong Turn on Syria: No Convincing Plan


New York Times Editorial Board on record...

"No Convincing Plan." "...a bad decision."

Uno

Well Congress wasn't doing it's job so the President has to. The Constitution and the law don't really matter. It's Doing the Right Thing as Obama sees it that matters. So we get another war and maybe wreck the region even more and who knows how many die, but Obama has no choice. He's a helpless victim of corporatists and Republicans so he must bomb Syria or they'll be unhappy with him. But it's OK. We got Obamacare. Like the old song says, "Stand by your man." Bush! McCain! ARRGH! Let Obama be Obama. The media is to blame!

Whatever.

 

[cabri]

As long as "intelligence" will show that

• air campaign is having an impact on the ISIS control AND
• no aircraft are lost AND
• no boots are shown to be on the ground

Obama can get away with it and Congress will not utter a peep.
Maybe there will also be a back room deal on costs accounting.

 

[unokitty]

First U.S. Stealth Jet Attack on Syria Cost More Than Indian Mission to Mars

... F-22 is extremely expensive to operate and difficult to maintain. In 2013 the Raptor cost the Air Force about $68,000 per hour to operate once maintenance and other factors are added in, according to documents provided by the Center for Defense Information.

The Raptors were only one of the line items for Monday night’s raids. The Daily Beast has tallied up a rough estimate of the cost of the initial air trikes in Syria. According to the Pentagon, the Navy fired 47 Tomahawk missiles, each of which cost about $1.6 million, for a total of $75.2 million. Assuming a mission duration of about six hours, and a strike package consisting of four F-22s, four F-15Es, four F-16s, two B-1 bombers and four MQ-9 Reapers—which would be consistent with Air Force doctrine—the total cost of Air Force portion of the bill would be about $3.9 million. Combined with the cost of the cruise missiles, the Syria raid cost the American taxpayer roughly $79 million, based on the Center for Defense Information data.

India sent a vehicle to another planet for less money than the US spent sending a bombing mission to Syria?

This former dog soldier believes that General Eisenhower got it right in 1953.
"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed."

More proof that what man learns from history is that man does not learn from history.

Uno