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Home Builders Don't Have Enough Workers to Meet New Demand (video clip and article)

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mshan

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2004
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"The shortage is across the spectrum, but especially in need are framers, concrete workers, plumbers, roofers and painters. The shortage is also felt most in areas where housing is coming back strongest, and permitting is easiest, like Texas and much of the West. The situation is not nearly as dire in the Northeast, where home building volume is smaller, and it can take years to get a project off zoned and ready to build. Still, as construction across the nation pulls itself off life support, the bitter irony persists. After years of nobody knocking on the door, suddenly this industry is struggling to meet demand."


http://www.cnbc.com/id/48926517
Video Clip: http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=3000114263&play=1


:cool:
 

chucky2

Lifer
Dec 9, 1999
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Most of which will be filled by illegals so the house can sell for full price/near full price, and the developer and general contractor can pocket the $$$. They need that new Mercedes for the wife and the new 2500 HD Denali for themselves.

What they really mean is, there's a shortage of people at the wages we're willing to pay to keep themselves rolling in the dough. I don't feel sorry for these folks, they'll find (illegal) ways to get the job done for the scammed house buyer, while still making sure to pocket more money than they should be.

Chuck
 

mshan

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2004
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Alot of Mexico is safe and economy in those areas is / was booming (http://blogs.ft.com/beyond-brics/2012/08/16/mexico-delivers-robust-growth/#axzz25ko4yDot).

Many illegals have probably left the U. S. to go back to Mexico for good jobs in their home country.

Plus, article says these new high tech green homes need skilled workers, and builders requiring stringent certification, so sounds like industry may be filtering out unskilled cheap labor they may have used during boom years.

Does seem to answer question as to why construction workers have not shown up as surge in jobs report / decreased unemployment rate. Seems like there is longer than previous lag between housing start this spring and more labor intensive later stages of building a home.
 
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chucky2

Lifer
Dec 9, 1999
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Green homes don't really need more skilled workers. You want to build a wall with 2x6 on 24" centers to increase the amount of insulation used? The same illegals who built using 2x4 on 16" centers can do that w/o any extra training. Same for thermally efficient windows, doors, roofing materials, etc. etc. etc.

Are there techniques that take more skill? Sure. Do people pay for them? Absolutely. Do they get what they payed for? Most of the time. How will the buyer of a house in a housing buildout project know that the finished house they're buying was actually made right? They likely won't (just look at the craftsmanship on the detail work in these builds). Trust the inspector to have caught things? Haha...good one...

Chuck

P.S. I'd expect Mexico to have solid growth. They've done whatever they can to get tens of millions of burdens out of their country and into ours sending our money back to Mexico. Not to mention manufacturing buildout by us there. A better question would be, why wouldn't Mexico be doing good?
 

chucky2

Lifer
Dec 9, 1999
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You've got to know that the Pols were telling these banks and asset holders, 'Hey, you aren't getting rid of this sh1t like you normally would. Bleed this out long term else we're all F'd. Do this and we won't ride the sh1t out of you...'
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
61,515
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You've got to know that the Pols were telling these banks and asset holders, 'Hey, you aren't getting rid of this sh1t like you normally would. Bleed this out long term else we're all F'd. Do this and we won't ride the sh1t out of you...'
Very fundamental misunderstanding on your part. Liquidation won't work well in a situation when the underlying assets' value is based on credit, and that credit is extended on the basis of the same kind of assets being held by lenders in abstract financial instruments.

Lenders like Lehman were allowed to leverage up to 30:1 during the Bush years. Any major loss in the value of their assets, the bursting of the housing bubble, meant that investors liquidated their short term repo agreements as they matured, leaving lenders w/o operating capital. The more the lenders liquidated their own holdings, the faster the value fell, because they couldn't generate the capital to lend to people who would buy those assets.

Market crashes can't occur from sound fundamentals, but rather from credit bubbles, something that was the essence of the faux prosperity of the Bush years.

Pols didn't demand this stretched out process, but rather allowed it & enabled it so that financial institutions could survive. Leverage increases profit enormously on the way up, but turns into an anchor tied around the neck on the way down. The greater the leverage, the more fragile the whole arrangement.
 

rudder

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
19,431
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The title should read:

Builders don't have enough workers to work for the low wages paid to illegal immigrants who are spending the economic down turn back in Mexico. But once the illegals are recalled, all will be right in the world once again.
 

woodman1999

Golden Member
Sep 19, 2003
1,535
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From personal experience, I can say that cabinet makers are also in need of more workers. Stupid Kraftmaid delayed our cabinet delivery from August 6th to September 24th because they don't have enough laborers to keep up with demand. So angry with them...
 

chucky2

Lifer
Dec 9, 1999
10,038
36
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Very fundamental misunderstanding on your part. Liquidation won't work well in a situation when the underlying assets' value is based on credit, and that credit is extended on the basis of the same kind of assets being held by lenders in abstract financial instruments.

Lenders like Lehman were allowed to leverage up to 30:1 during the Bush years. Any major loss in the value of their assets, the bursting of the housing bubble, meant that investors liquidated their short term repo agreements as they matured, leaving lenders w/o operating capital. The more the lenders liquidated their own holdings, the faster the value fell, because they couldn't generate the capital to lend to people who would buy those assets.

Market crashes can't occur from sound fundamentals, but rather from credit bubbles, something that was the essence of the faux prosperity of the Bush years.

Pols didn't demand this stretched out process, but rather allowed it & enabled it so that financial institutions could survive. Leverage increases profit enormously on the way up, but turns into an anchor tied around the neck on the way down. The greater the leverage, the more fragile the whole arrangement.
That makes sense, but, wouldn't they dump enough where it's going to make the most sense on their balance sheet/stock price, i.e. we can dump 30% but not 31%? Seems to me they'd be best served by dumping whatever they think they can get away with as fast as they can get away with it.

You're saying that they did, and this is the rate they picked? Seems really slow bleed to me, I'd have thought they could have dumped far faster than they are now. People wanting to buy those houses in a lot of cases still need loans...from the same places selling the assets.

Chuck
 

Fern

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 30, 2003
26,916
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The OP seems to be on a on-man crusade to persuade us that the economic recovery is rolling right along.

The BLS statistics say employment in construction is virtually flat: http://www.bls.gov/iag/tgs/iag23.htm

And that actual production workers (non-supervisory) have decreased.

I don't think there's much be taken from the fact a couple of construction companies Dallas can't find workers at the wages they're willing to pay.

What stood out to me is problem they face in competing with foreclosed properties. That existing inventory at low/reduced prices is a serious impediment. From what data I can find it appears foreclosures are expected to pick up since the 'robo-signing' issue was resolved earlier this. That issue essentially stopped many banks from foreclosing. I.e., a new flood of foreclosures is expected.

http://money.cnn.com/2012/04/13/real_estate/foreclosures/index.htm

Fern
 

mshan

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2004
7,869
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Chairman & CEO of Manpower Group this morning: http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=3000114255&play=1
Transcript:

"huge disappointment this morning that the employment market only generated 96,000 jobs last month. we're joined by the chairman and ceo of the manpower group. good morning to you. thank you for joining us on cnbc. great to be here. the tragedy is that you know that there are huge labor shortages in parts of this economy. yes. it's really interesting. in some ways, there's no surprise we saw a number like 96,000. we were seeing slowness in the summer months and we can't expect to have pmi numbers down, some hesitation, lots of uncertainty. and then have this pleasant surprise that we're going to get 150,000 jobs in the labor number. what is even more difficult to understand is while we only have this number of jobs created, 96,000, we've got more disenfranchised or discouraged workers leaving and at the same time we're still hearing from employers that, i can't find the right skills and i could hire more. we're in a very unique and difficult position right now. what is the scale of that? those unfilled vacancies, those employers who can't find the worker that is they want? can you give us an idea of the scale? there are some numbers you can throw out. unfortunately i think the numbers get a little distorted. i've heard as high as 1 million, 2 million. you can't really look at some of the data, how it's collected to say that, in fact, yes, that is what -- if we could get those skilled workers, we would fill 1 million more jobs or 1.5 million more jobs. down to a local level where labor markets work, it's 150,000 here. we're not going to be able to fix that problem in a short period of time. it's technical schools. it's really employers actually being a little bit more flexible as well. there's a combination of things. but at the end of the day, most of that can be solved if we had more demand because companies would take more risk on bringing on less qualified employees because they absolutely need the people. jeff, what's your guess on which sectors those people who are not participating in the labor market, whichtors they were trying to look for a job? is it the sectors that haven't expanded their hiring? i think in some cases -- one of the things that was a bit more disappointing than most is you have 15,000 less jobs in manufacturing. and manufacturing has great entry level jobs. that's where we're starting to see the skill levels creep up so that entry level job is where it was before in a skill level. that's one of the ones that's holding us back. it's one of the first i've seen for a while that manufacturing has slipped. we were starting to see 30,000, 20,000, 25,000 jobs in manufacturing. that's great for the economy. that's starting to slip and it coincides with what we saw in the pmi data. jeff, thank you for your insight. it's a big day for the employment market. chairman and ceo of the manpower group. "[
 
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chucky2

Lifer
Dec 9, 1999
10,038
36
86
Not surprising either really. When you have employers who want specific skill sets at the minimum, and on top many times are wanting to chop back the pay scale, it's a lot easier for those with the skill sets, and those without also, to just sit on unemployment and Gov assistance. Employers don't want to spend money and time training people, the want folks ready to go upon starting (it'll take a while anyways for them to get up to speed).

Chuck
 
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