Well, both of these 19" monitors seems to have similar specs, with the Hitachi have a .22dp and the KDS having a .24. I've heard quite a lot of good things about the AV195, but pretty much nothing about the Hitachi...anyone tried the CM771? Both are the same price, and the decision is going to be hard. Suggestions are welcome.
Hitachi CM772 Ergoflat or KDS AV-195TF?
- Thread starter Krish
- Start date
First of all I want to clear up Hitachi's deceiving 0.22mm dp. In a shadow mask monitor, there are a few ways to measure dot pitch size, horizontal dot pitch, and diagonal dot pitch. Hitachi does not specify which one it is(even if they do they can still mislead customers), 0.22mm is Ergoflat's horizontal dot pitch, it's diagonal dot pitch is actually 0.25mm. You see, diagonal is what really counts, so using horizontal dot pitch to mislead customers is not right.
Lets get to the real issue, to be honest, I cannot tell you which monitor is better. Because you're comparing a shadow mask monitor to a aperture grille monitor. I understand they're both equally good in specs, and they're pretty much equally priced as well, both of them are excellent monitors in my opinion. But you'll have to decide yourself because I can't decide for you whether you'll like shadow mask or aperture grille. Check out a retail store and see them with your own eyes. Thats the best I tell you.
Lets get to the real issue, to be honest, I cannot tell you which monitor is better. Because you're comparing a shadow mask monitor to a aperture grille monitor. I understand they're both equally good in specs, and they're pretty much equally priced as well, both of them are excellent monitors in my opinion. But you'll have to decide yourself because I can't decide for you whether you'll like shadow mask or aperture grille. Check out a retail store and see them with your own eyes. Thats the best I tell you.
I completely disagree with the previous poster. Publishing the horizontal dot pitch is the only way to compare Shadow mask to apturture grill technology. Using the diagonal measurement is like comparing apples to oranges. Using Horizontal is like comparing apples to apples. For the truth about dot pitch see the following link. http://www.csf.org.uk look under "dot pitch explained". Hitachi is NOT trying to deceive anyone.
Jim Witkowski
Chief Hardware engineer
Cornerstone
http://www.monitorsdirect.com
Jim Witkowski
Chief Hardware engineer
Cornerstone
http://www.monitorsdirect.com
Ok, I remember seeing all of this when I was shopping for my monitor about a year ago. I think I was comparing a Samsung flat monitor to my CTX FD Trinitron one.
All I can say is that I've always loved Trinitron, and I really like my CTX that I have now (PR711F). I agree with others when they say that this pitch is not like that pitch & so on, but like someone said, look at them and see.
I was considering purchasing the AV-7TF (which is the smaller version of the AV-195TF) when I was looking at monitors, but at the time it wasn't available, and I liked how the CTX had higher refresh rates and an integrated USB hub. I wish it were black though, to complete my scheme.
I hope that I've been somewhat helpful. Any questions let me know! (Or if you want to buy my 17" FD Trinitron instead
All I can say is that I've always loved Trinitron, and I really like my CTX that I have now (PR711F). I agree with others when they say that this pitch is not like that pitch & so on, but like someone said, look at them and see.
I was considering purchasing the AV-7TF (which is the smaller version of the AV-195TF) when I was looking at monitors, but at the time it wasn't available, and I liked how the CTX had higher refresh rates and an integrated USB hub. I wish it were black though, to complete my scheme.
I hope that I've been somewhat helpful. Any questions let me know! (Or if you want to buy my 17" FD Trinitron instead
- Mar 4, 2000
- 27,370
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I did all this research about 6 months ago and settled on the Hitachi CM771 and have not regretted it one bit. I did not want aperture grill and those horizontal wires. KDS is also good . . . but . . . Like the Hitachi's controls better.
Buy the KDS AV-195TF, i have it and by far its the best monitor i've used. This is a very nice monitor, colors are great, no blurryness, and perfect geometry. I love it and i suggest you buy it. And the screen is totaly flat! Great warrenty too.
And for those Horizontal wires....I dont notice them ever, i practicly forgot bout them till u brought that up.
they are very tiny, and you cant see them
they are very tiny, and you cant see them
Gosharkss:
Horizontal dot pitch maybe the only way to compare a shadow mask to an aperture grille, but the thing is the diagonal dot pitch its shadow mask's true dot pitch, and it will be deceiving if you're comparing Hitachi's 0.22mm horizontal to say, BrandX's 0.26mm diagonal, it looks like Hitachi blows away the competition but the fact is its only 0.01 better than BrandX.
Plus, if Hitachi and Samsung, with 0.22mm and 0.20mm horizontal, dont you think its a little bit outrageous how it's so much better than the 0.24-0.25mm stripe pitch of the aperture grille? The fact is shadow masks and aperture grilles are apples to oranges from the start, you can't really compare their dot pitch base on different standards. I would say 0.20-0.22mm horizontal dot pitch is about the same as 0.24-0.25mm stripe pitch in real world.
Heck, even the web site you quoted agrees that manufacturers tend to use horizontal dot pitch because the number appears smaller, its deceiving in a sense that many customers don't know the difference between horizontal pitch and diagonal dot pitch which is what really counts. And there is no mention whatsoever that the only way to compare shadow mask dot pitch to aperture grille stripe pitch is by using horizontal pitch.
Horizontal dot pitch maybe the only way to compare a shadow mask to an aperture grille, but the thing is the diagonal dot pitch its shadow mask's true dot pitch, and it will be deceiving if you're comparing Hitachi's 0.22mm horizontal to say, BrandX's 0.26mm diagonal, it looks like Hitachi blows away the competition but the fact is its only 0.01 better than BrandX.
Plus, if Hitachi and Samsung, with 0.22mm and 0.20mm horizontal, dont you think its a little bit outrageous how it's so much better than the 0.24-0.25mm stripe pitch of the aperture grille? The fact is shadow masks and aperture grilles are apples to oranges from the start, you can't really compare their dot pitch base on different standards. I would say 0.20-0.22mm horizontal dot pitch is about the same as 0.24-0.25mm stripe pitch in real world.
Heck, even the web site you quoted agrees that manufacturers tend to use horizontal dot pitch because the number appears smaller, its deceiving in a sense that many customers don't know the difference between horizontal pitch and diagonal dot pitch which is what really counts. And there is no mention whatsoever that the only way to compare shadow mask dot pitch to aperture grille stripe pitch is by using horizontal pitch.
This is exactly why we should be educating people not spreading rumors that companies are deceitful. We need to show everyone how dot pitch is measured like the web site www.csf.org.uk does and let them make a decision on their own. You seem to want to put down products and companies instead of trying to help.
I can make the same argument about aperture grill companies saying their products are brighter than shadow mask monitors. Let's ask them to publish brightness specifications and see the truth.
We also need to push the manufacturers to publish better specifications. Ask them how they define dot pitch. In my opinion Hitachi is honest, at least they tell us it is measured horizontally, no deceit here if you ask me. This is also why I tell people to call the manufacture and ask these questions before they purchase.
What I think is deceitful is companies that do not publish what dot pitch measurement they are using. Some companies are now starting to publish the Mask pitch, which will always be slightly smaller than the phosphor pitch, that most companies including Hitachi use.
BTW how to you define TRUE dot pitch? What specifically do you mean? Shadow mask monitors where invented long before AG and the diagonal measurement became a standard. When AG came on the market there had to be a way to compare apples to apples and the horizontal measurement is it.
Jim Witkowski
Chief Hardware Engineer
Cornerstone / Monitorsdirect.com
I can make the same argument about aperture grill companies saying their products are brighter than shadow mask monitors. Let's ask them to publish brightness specifications and see the truth.
We also need to push the manufacturers to publish better specifications. Ask them how they define dot pitch. In my opinion Hitachi is honest, at least they tell us it is measured horizontally, no deceit here if you ask me. This is also why I tell people to call the manufacture and ask these questions before they purchase.
What I think is deceitful is companies that do not publish what dot pitch measurement they are using. Some companies are now starting to publish the Mask pitch, which will always be slightly smaller than the phosphor pitch, that most companies including Hitachi use.
BTW how to you define TRUE dot pitch? What specifically do you mean? Shadow mask monitors where invented long before AG and the diagonal measurement became a standard. When AG came on the market there had to be a way to compare apples to apples and the horizontal measurement is it.
Jim Witkowski
Chief Hardware Engineer
Cornerstone / Monitorsdirect.com
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