He's Jewish? I just lost all respect for the man....

[notfred]

The title of this thread was meant to provoke, so now that you're in the thread, calm down. I just saw in another thread, this comment:

travolta is a supporter of the church of scientology? i just lost a lot of respect for that man.

No one complaions when the church of scientology is insulted. However, many people will consider the statement in the title to be racist or bigoted. What makes one church more valid than another? How can you discriminate against one church, but condemn someone else for doing it to a different church? Or, how can you condemn one church, and then expect other people to accept your church without calling it's members sheep (as often happens to christians) or terrorists (as often happens to muslims), or anything else degrading?

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Because scientology is funny. It's just as crackpot as other religions though.

 

[ScottyB]

the church of scientology is a cult

 

[Stark]

research the church of scientology a little before you make stupid threads.

And a better title would be "He's black? I just lost all respect for the man..."

you're confusing your forms of bigotry.

 

[Fausto]

Originally posted by: ScottyB
the church of scientology is a cult

Define "cult" and then explain how that term can't be applied to all religions, please.

 

[n0cmonkey]

The CoS is an organization known for its scams, falsities, and legal bull. The lives it has ruined are numerous. The legal threats the organization makes over the stupidest of things are deplorable.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: Stark
research the church of scientology a little before you make stupid threads.

And a better title would be "He's black? I just lost all respect for the man..."

you're confusing your forms of bigotry.

This is definitely not a stupid thread. It is a legitimate question, phrased in an attention grabbing way.

 

[ScottyB]

Originally posted by: Fausto1

Originally posted by: ScottyB
the church of scientology is a cult

Define "cult" and then explain how that term can't be applied to all religions, please.

I am too tired right now and I need to go eat lunch. I will get my notes out from my cult section in psychology and post this afternoon. basically it has to do with the fact that real churches ideals are consitent over time and cults change to some degree everyday to hold power over its members.

 

[bsobel]

> Define "cult" and then explain how that term can't be applied to all religions, please.

Why don't you go do your own research. The concept of a religion vs a cult is well established. It's a way of categorizing the type of institution (although do to some wacko's 'cult' has taken on a bad meaning).

> basically it has to do with the fact that real churches ideals are consitent over time and cults change to some degree everyday to hold power over its members.

Sort of. Most religions evolve over time (Christianity evolved from other base religions (some of which still exist) for 1000's of years). Most cults 'spring' into existance without 'building' on an established core belief set.
Bill

 

[Pepsei]

because everyone have their own religions "list". on that list, you write down established religions, and crockpot religions.

Most people have the church of scientology in the crockpot category. Therefore, it's open to pot shots for most people.

Just like you can make fun of a person that most people hate, and get away with it. but making fun of a somewhat popular person, said a former president, you're open to attacks from 1/2 of the population.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: Fausto1

Originally posted by: ScottyB
the church of scientology is a cult

Define "cult" and then explain how that term can't be applied to all religions, please.

There is a sig here in ATOT that I like a lot. It goes something along the lines of: "A religion is a popular cult, a cult is an unpopular religion." Just wanted to throw that out here 🙂

 

[notfred]

Originally posted by: Stark
And a better title would be "He's black? I just lost all respect for the man..."

Judaism is a religion, not a race.

 

[justint]

Originally posted by: notfred

Originally posted by: Stark
And a better title would be "He's black? I just lost all respect for the man..."

Judaism is a religion, not a race.

true...and thier is also no such thing as a race. A better term is ethnicity.

 

[Fausto]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey

Originally posted by: Fausto1

Originally posted by: ScottyB
the church of scientology is a cult

Define "cult" and then explain how that term can't be applied to all religions, please.

There is a sig here in ATOT that I like a lot. It goes something along the lines of: "A religion is a popular cult, a cult is an unpopular religion." Just wanted to throw that out here 🙂

That was more or less my point.....it's a pretty fine line. "Scams, falsities, and legal bull" apply pretty much equally to both.

Main Entry: cult
Pronunciation: 'k&lt
Function: noun
Usage: often attributive
Etymology: French & Latin; French culte, from Latin cultus care, adoration, from colere to cultivate -- more at WHEEL
Date: 1617
1 : formal religious veneration : WORSHIP
2 : a system of religious beliefs and ritual; also : its body of adherents
3 : a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious; also : its body of adherents
4 : a system for the cure of disease based on dogma set forth by its promulgator <health cults>
5 a : great devotion to a person, idea, object, movement, or work (as a film or book); especially : such devotion regarded as a literary or intellectual fad b : a usually small group of people characterized by such devotion

Main Entry: re·li·gion
Pronunciation: ri-'li-j&n
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English religioun, from Latin religion-, religio supernatural constraint, sanction, religious practice, perhaps from religare to restrain, tie back -- more at RELY
Date: 13th century
1 a : the state of a religious <a nun in her 20th year of religion> b (1) : the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2) : commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance
2 : a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices
3 archaic : scrupulous conformity : CONSCIENTIOUSNESS
4 : a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith
- re·li·gion·less adjective

 

[xirtam]

The title of this thread was meant to provoke, so now that you're in the thread, calm down.

Jerk.

 

[MemnochtheDevil]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
The CoS is an organization known for its scams, falsities, and legal bull. The lives it has ruined are numerous. The legal threats the organization makes over the stupidest of things are deplorable.

I'd agree, I even hold the Catholic Church in higher regards than the CoS. At least the Catholics have some of their hierarchy doing good in the world. The CoS is a dangerous cult from everything I've seen. They tend to threaten anyone who tries to look at them with as much legal power as they can. Plus these "hidden secrets" religions all scream of brainwashing to me.

I don't lose all respect for Travolta due to his religion, I just am more wary of his mindset. But it would be fair for someone with bad experiences with the CoS to bash him for it. Plus the CoS is much more a structured hierarchy than the overall Jewish faith.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: Fausto1

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey

Originally posted by: Fausto1

Originally posted by: ScottyB
the church of scientology is a cult

Define "cult" and then explain how that term can't be applied to all religions, please.

There is a sig here in ATOT that I like a lot. It goes something along the lines of: "A religion is a popular cult, a cult is an unpopular religion." Just wanted to throw that out here 🙂

That was more or less my point.....

I know, I was agreeing with you. Maybe I didn't make that clear enough... 😛

it's a pretty fine line. "Scams, falsities, and legal bull" apply pretty much equally to both.

Definitely. The Vatican has been behind some of the biggest scandals in history.

The Scientologists just have louder lawyers and disagree with the whole free speech thing.

 

[Bitek]

Following your logic, we shouldn't criticize David Koresh's followers at Waco, or Raelians (the one's who just claimed to have cloned a human), the Halley's Comet suicide cult, Church of the Sacred Herb (thier communion is tokin' a fat dubie,) etc, etc, or any other nutball "religion" out there. If you wish to be PC to the point of absurdity, then have at it. I on the other hand, wil call them as I see them.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: Hafen
Following your logic, we shouldn't criticize David Koresh's followers at Waco, or Raelians (the one's who just claimed to have cloned a human), the Halley's Comet suicide cult, Church of the Sacred Herb (thier communion is tokin' a fat dubie,) etc, etc, or any other nutball "religion" out there. If you wish to be PC to the point of absurdity, then have at it. I on the other hand, wil call them as I see them.

I don't think criticism is the thing notfred was calling into question here. Its the obvious discrimination against someone for their beliefs that I think is the point. If I missed a turn somewhere, let me know.

 

[rickn]

I've been to their HQ in downtown Clearwater, and them people are a strange bunch. They walk around the area around their HQ like drones.

 

[Soybomb]

Not every organization garners respect. Do we owe any respect to the Heavens Gate cult or the NAMBLA organization? You can accept something as being legitimate or not which is what has been done with scientology for most people. I'm not a religious person at all, but I'll cheerfully laugh at scientologists more than many other religions.

 

[UNCjigga]

AFAIK, only the CoS would ask its members to spend hundreds of dollars on PK meters to read brainwaves in order to practice their religion...and profit from the manufacture and sale of these devices to followers! (devices which have been proven to do nothing...any amount of electromagnetic radiation will set the thing off!)

Sounds like a cult to me...

 

[MemnochtheDevil]

Trying to define the differences between a cult and a religion is a waste of time. They mean different things to different people. If you want you can be the poster who defends the CoS whenever someone speaks ill of them. Do you also want to volunteer to defend the militant Islamic factions\cult\religions?

Bashing someone for their religion is not always wrong, just most of the time. And obviously it will depend on different peoples views on the religions being discussed.

 

[ScottyB]

The number 1 victims of most cults are students. They are targeted because many are lonely and depressed and the cults come off as welcoming and nice people who believe in their members. The CoS on the other hand targets people with wealthy families because they have the members ask their families for money who are usually willing to help out.

 

[rickn]

they are recognized as a religion. my god, they own almost all of downtown clearwater, tax-free