Hero Status to you if you can answer this...

[LexCruiser]

For background, check this first:
Clicky

Since that thread, I've gotten a new motherboard, set everything up and still got the same result; 3 or 4 beeps on startup, no post, no display. Also, it started doing different sequences of beeps and also powered off on its own.

today, I took it to a shop where we switched out the vid card, RAM chips, PSU and even the CPU... STILL the same, no display no bootup.
So basically, we tried all new components on a brand new mobo and STILL no dice.
THEN we tried another mobo from the shop (and Intel board, mine's an ASUS), with all different combinations of components from the shop and my own (vid card, cpu etc etc) and amazingly, STILL nothing! Even w/ completely different equipment.
We were all completely and utterly stumped. This included 3 techs and myself (been building and doing technical for close to 10 yrs) so with our combined experience, we couldn't come up w/ a rhyme or reason to this problem.

I thought I was gonna be stuck in the house a55ed out w/ no computer to play HL2 on thru this huge blizzard we're having. =P
So just for the heck of it, we decided to connect an older PCI vid card (I have an x800 xt PCI-E card) into one of the slots and booted up.
And guess what.
It booted up.....

SO THEN, we put my PCI-E x800 back into the machine, et voila, machine was alive again. Swapped all my components back on and everything was working. So after going thru all new RAM chips, CPU, mobo and PSU, the culprit was ... ???
I still have no idea what caused it and why it started working again after booting up w/ just the PCI (NOT PCI-E) vid card...

So the question is..... WHY?? Why did my machine die and then work again after plugging in the PCI card?
The machine had originally died after running 3DMark05 and Memtest86.. Did that somehow affect the PCI-E slot on my mobo? But I even switched mobo's... did it affect my vid card somehow? Then did that status transfer to the INTEL mobo from the shop??? If this all sounds insanely confusing, .. you're right. It is.
Can anyone see any sort of logic behind this?

I also now have an extra Asus P5AD2 Deluxe mobo (if anyone's interested) thats in perfect working order. Maybe I'll build another system. =P


************************UPDATE********************************** 1/27/04

Hi Bozo.. Not sure if you're still monitoring this thread, but the problem came back. =T

Originally, it happened after running 3DMark05 & Memtest86...
Now yesterday, on a whim cuz my CPU temps were running high, I re-applied AS5 to my HSF/CPU and upon bootup, same problem as before! No display and system beeps! I don't have the PCI vid card w/ me so I gotta get it back before I can see if it'll fix the issue again, but why would this happen upon re-applying thermal paste??? I understand w/ yours, the system didn't boot cuz you were flashing your vid card BIOS. Mine seems to happen at completely random times... this is frustrating as h3ll!!

Also, I didnt have my speakers on the last time, but this time, the board actually produced vocal post msgs. On bootup, I get a "System failed due to CPU overclocking." Thing is, my system isn't even OC'ed. I checked around and found that a lot of people were having this problem w/ Asus boards and all fixes seemed very random. Also, after the OC'ed error msg, I get a "VGA test failed" msg also. Another interesting thing to note, if I take out my vid card, the system doesn't give the OC error msg and just the VGA Test failed msg... Can my vid card be forcing my CPU/BIOS to overclock somehow??

 

[ohnnyj]

Let's see if the AT crowd is more insightful than the crowd.

 

[Bozo Galora]

If I read right - the original system DID actually work for a while.

FWIW:
Back when I was more adventurous I used to reflash vidcard bios on a regular basis. Since there are versions for ea incarnation of cards (video out etc.) I often flashed the wrong code and then had to blind flash back to previous or dif version. This resulted in black screen no boot, even after reflashing. So in desperation I loaded a PCI vid card (same as you) to see if anything was working. I would leave in the agp card and set bios to boot from PCI (vga) first. And, like you, the PC would boot fine. Then (while holding my breath) I would take out the PCI card and reset to AGP boot first and the thing would work again. APPARENTLY, bad bios - wrong for card - or CORRUPTED BIOS for card involved seems to scramble the mobo bios chip. The PCI card is kind of a "reset" for the code and has saved my butt many times. I ALWAYS keep an elcheapo PCI card around for trouble shooting (SIS 305).

Based on the trouble that some 6800GT boards had when they first came out - wouldn't boot due to bad shipped bios that only a reflash would fix, and other probs with those cards not being recognized until chipset drivers have been removed and reinstalled, I would always boot new card into safe mode delete system devices (AGP/CPU bridge esp.) in dev man and reboot, redetect and reinstall while the new card was in. I would also temp disable WFP (windows file prot) in regisry.

Other thoughts:
I have also had vidcards go bad due to bga ram chips not contacting correctly and bending card would change whether they wotked or not. I could make a screen go checkerboard by twisting the card.
PCI-E is new tech - maybe bios code is not up to task yet.
Maybe ASUS boards have film on PCI E contacts - spray contact cleaner on card traces as you push in and out card. Pulling the card in and out may have a cleaning effect.
Your case may not be allowing card to seat fully - always test by trying out of case.

Shame that I am on an AMD kick now, or I'd buy that mobo from you, I am sure its fine, only needs a bios reflash

 

[LexCruiser]

Originally posted by: Bozo Galora
If I read right - the original system DID actually work for a while.

FWIW:
Back when I was more adventurous I used to reflash vidcard bios on a regular basis. Since there are versions for ea incarnation of cards (video out etc.) I often flashed the wrong code and then had to blind flash back to previous or dif version. This resulted in black screen no boot, even after reflashing. So in desperation I loaded a PCI vid card (same as you) to see if anything was working. I would leave in the agp card and set bios to boot from PCI (vga) first. And, like you, the PC would boot fine. Then (while holding my breath) I would take out the PCI card and reset to AGP boot first and the thing would work again. APPARENTLY, bad bios - wrong for card - or CORRUPTED BIOS for card involved seems to scramble the mobo bios chip. The PCI card is kind of a "reset" for the code and has saved my butt many times. I ALWAYS keep an elcheapo PCI card around for trouble shooting (SIS 305).

Based on the trouble that some 6800GT boards had when they first came out - wouldn't boot due to bad shipped bios that only a reflash would fix, and other probs with those cards not being recognized until chipset drivers have been removed and reinstalled, I would always boot new card into safe mode delete system devices (AGP/CPU bridge esp.) in dev man and reboot, redetect and reinstall while the new card was in. I would also temp disable WFP (windows file prot) in regisry.

Other thoughts:
I have also had vidcards go bad due to bga ram chips not contacting correctly and bending card would change whether they wotked or not. I could make a screen go checkerboard by twisting the card.
PCI-E is new tech - maybe bios code is not up to task yet.
Maybe ASUS boards have film on PCI E contacts - spray contact cleaner on card traces as you push in and out card. Pulling the card in and out may have a cleaning effect.
Your case may not be allowing card to seat fully - always test by trying out of case.

Shame that I am on an AMD kick now, or I'd buy that mobo from you, I am sure its fine, only needs a bios reflash

AH. So I'm not the only one to have experienced something like this! Makes me feel better (kinda). =P
I was also thinking of keeping a cheap PCI vid card around just for that purpose. Great points you've brought up tho, and yes, the system was working for about 3 months before this happened.

Mr. Bozo Sir, I think you are the leading candidate for the Hero award at the moment.
:thumbsup:

 

[Bozo Galora]

addenda:

It also helps to bring back mobo bios by doing a complete cmos reset:
remove battery
short pins and leave jumper on
turn off PSU
unplug from wall
wait 24 hours
replug
unshort pins
turn on PSU add batt
go into bios - reset to failsafe

It may sound crazy, but a one hour downtime does not work in advanced cases, when sometimes a full day wait will.

 

[LexCruiser]

Originally posted by: Bozo Galora
addenda:

It also helps to bring back mobo bios by doing a complete cmos reset:
remove battery
short pins and leave jumper on
turn off PSU
unplug from wall
wait 24 hours
replug
unshort pins
turn on PSU add batt
go into bios - reset to failsafe

It may sound crazy, but a one hour downtime does not work in advanced cases, when sometimes a full day wait will.

Hi Bozo.. Not sure if you're still monitoring this thread, but the problem came back. =T

Originally, it happened after running 3DMark05 & Memtest86...
Now yesterday, on a whim cuz my CPU temps were running high, I re-applied AS5 to my HSF/CPU and upon bootup, same problem as before! No display and system beeps! I don't have the PCI vid card w/ me so I gotta get it back before I can see if it'll fix the issue again, but why would this happen upon re-applying thermal paste??? I understand w/ yours, the system didn't boot cuz you were flashing your vid card BIOS. Mine seems to happen at completely random times... this is frustrating as h3ll!!

Also, I didnt have my speakers on the last time, but this time, the board actually produced vocal post msgs. On bootup, I get a "System failed due to CPU overclocking." Thing is, my system isn't even OC'ed. I checked around and found that a lot of people were having this problem w/ Asus boards and all fixes seemed very random. Also, after the OC'ed error msg, I get a "VGA test failed" msg also. Another interesting thing to note, if I take out my vid card, the system doesn't give the OC error msg and just the VGA Test failed msg... Can my vid card be forcing my CPU/BIOS to overclock somehow??

Arghhhhhhhhh.

 

[Tarrant64]

I just had that System failed due to CPU overclocking around 4:30am. Funny thing is, I wasn't OC'ed at the time. Is it possible for the mobo to get 'stuck' in an OC state?

 

[LexCruiser]

Is it the same system as in your sig? Try taking out the vid card and see if you're still getting the 'failed due to OC' msg... I wonder if it may be some kinda conflict w/ ATI cards? Or just vid cards in general?

What have you tried so far to troubleshoot?

 

[MrControversial]

Did you plug the 12V 4pin power connector in the motherboard. The CPU needs this voltage in order to work.

 

[LexCruiser]

Originally posted by: MrControversial
Did you plug the 12V 4pin power connector in the motherboard. The CPU needs this voltage in order to work.

Course I did.

 

[DrCool]

I'm just making an assumption here, but you did take the motherboard completely out of the case and try running on a desk / cardboard / wood, right?

if you had a grounding issue, it would look exactly like what your describing, and if you weren't smart enough to do this, you'd think the problem was sloved by something else.. if your motherboard is being grounded to your case, it might work sometimes, and not at others.. and the reason would seem random..

also, it is completely possible you have a DEFECTIVE video card, sometimes there is a bad apple in any bunch, and you just have to replace it.. that's the beauty of RMA

 

[LexCruiser]

Originally posted by: DrCool
I'm just making an assumption here, but you did take the motherboard completely out of the case and try running on a desk / cardboard / wood, right?

if you had a grounding issue, it would look exactly like what your describing, and if you weren't smart enough to do this, you'd think the problem was sloved by something else.. if your motherboard is being grounded to your case, it might work sometimes, and not at others.. and the reason would seem random..

Yup, when it initially happened last week, we tested 3 diff mobos out of the case so i don't think its a grounding issue. Seemed like a total fluke when it worked again (w/ mobo still out of case) after putting in a regular PCI vid card (my board takes PCI-E). It worked for a full week until last nite when I decided to re-apply the thermal paste. In the event that is a grounding issue w/ the case, what would I need to do w/ the case to correct it? I didn't try taking the mobo out of the case last nite since it seemed like it was doing the same thing as last week.. but I guess its worth another try..

 

[LexCruiser]

Originally posted by: DrCool

also, it is completely possible you have a DEFECTIVE video card, sometimes there is a bad apple in any bunch, and you just have to replace it.. that's the beauty of RMA

I've tried 2 other PCI-E vid cards on my mobo w/ the same results...

 

[Bozo Galora]

This error message seems to be exclusive to ASUS motherboards.
Its coming back to me now about the 875 PC800 and all the probs they had with this
a.) There was a large blob of solder underneath the board right where the CPU retention HW would go that would sometimes short out. They issued a Rev 2.0 with dif traces.
b.) there was a HSF mount tension issue - that the cradle with stock hsf was so tight it was bending boards.
when final tension was applied installed while not in case
c.) Even the AMD boards had this error mess that was fixed with a BIOS update. This might be necessary with your board.
d.) The vendor for the cpu socket may be selling ASUS some faulty units.

I am feeling now that if you bought a dif brand mobo, this prob will disappear with your current components.

http://www.pctechtalk.com/foru...hp?p=141924#post141924
http://directron.infopop.net/2...=286097824&m=201102013
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/37921/
http://www.techspot.com/vb/archive/index/t-7061.html
http://www.abxzone.com/forums/...index.php/t-70867.html

And you HAVE to try things with the mobo out of the case to be sure your case is not preventing cards from seating properly or not grounding ONLY on standoff pads, not traces.

 

[Tarrant64]

I have to agree with Bozo. I mean, I love my mobo and all, and it's always been stable. But sometimes little problems like the OC error message come up and just everything starts actin' up. Even when I'm not OC'ing it's still confused. Resetting the BIOS and what not didn't help either. I have decided to keep this board though and am currently planning a new system for a 939 socket, and will be using another Asus board for that as well. I am hoping that the problems I have with the 754 will go away.

FYI, I have the 1005. whatever version BIOS for my ASUS K8V SE. Didn't have problem until I updated it too. I was using 1003 before that.

 

[JediJeb]

The having to restart with a standard PCI vid card reminds me of the ECS K7S5A boards when they first came out. AGP wouldnt boot but PCI would. The trick there was to take the AGP card and insert and remove it many times to break in the slot then boot with PCI and set BIOS to AGP and everything would work. Maybe these PCI-E slots just need breaking in before they work.