Help with Upgrade Choice...

[Bassman2003]

Hello,

I have a dilemma about upgrading my system. I do video production and am currently using an i7 4790k chip based system. I was going to wait for the upcoming Skylake-X and build a system in the early fall. But to be honest, my confidence about speed improvements is not very strong considering Intel's approach.

My video editing program likes clock speed for the actual editing but anything that is encoded out prefers more cores. 8-10 cores is optimal for video encoding. My issue with the enthusiast chips is that they come in at a lower clock speed than the i7 gamer chips. So one has to basically overclock them quit a lot to get them close to the i7 speeds. Paying $1600 for the 10-core chip and being forced to overclock a lot just to match the $350 chips just drives me crazy.

I want to hope that Skylake-X will be a better performer than the current 10-core chip but I can not say I am confident,

So, my choices seem to be just upgrade to the Broadwell 10 core chip now to get better performance or wait until fall and upgrade to Skylake-X. Either way I am handing over the big bucks.

Do you see any large advantages to waiting for Skylake? Will the new 299 chipset bring anything substantial that I would use?

The frustrating thing is that the new chipset thing makes these CPU purchases permanent. You can not build up a nice system and upgrade the CPU over time. So I really am trying to time the right time to dive in as it is one and done.

Thanks for listening to me ramble and for your thoughts.

 

[Burpo]

If you can hold off a mo., Ryzen's release is imminent, and may turn out to be exactly what you're looking for.

 

[Bouowmx]

Try video ASICs: AMD VCE, Intel Quick Sync Video, and Nvidia NVENC. Fast and efficient.

Curiously, you did not mention the hotly anticipated Ryzen: I do not see a reason to drop any money right now.

If Intel Skylake-EP is to be manufactured on 14 nm + featured in Kaby Lake (https://www.servethehome.com/new-intel-xeon-e5-2699a-v4-skylake-ep-details/), then I expect improved overclocking on Skylake-X over Broadwell-E.

And then there is Intel Coffee Lake 6-core for 2018 (https://benchlife.info/intel-will-not-announce-skylake-x-kaby-lake-x-with-x299-in-computex-01222017/) for mainstream (socket H, integrated GPU, 2-channel memory, 16 PCIe lanes).

 

[Bassman2003]

Well, from back in the day Intel was always better for instruction sets and video editing programs. I have not considered an AMD processor for many years. Go with the behemoth as they always find a way to win etc...

Where I lose a lot of time is waiting for x.264 encodes. I often shoot in 1080p60 and with 4k in the mix, the encoding time ties up the system. Maybe I need a dual system approach rather than one. But that gets complicated with storage and shared files. In the past, deliveries were more straight forward - DVD. Now I end up spitting out an MP4 for YouTube, a DVD or Blu-ray and possibly an archive of the same project. That is a huge strain on CPU power.

Quick sync is fast but quality limited. I do not know much about NVENC but I do not think my encoder plugin supports it.

Speaking of overclocking the extreme chips, I remember seeing something about being able to focus on one core inside the chip to bring it up to the gamer chip speeds. Do you think this will be expanded in the Skylake-X ships?

 

[Bouowmx]

Speaking of overclocking the extreme chips, I remember seeing something about being able to focus on one core inside the chip to bring it up to the gamer chip speeds. Do you think this will be expanded in the Skylake-X ships?

Intel Broadwell-E has per-core overclocking and Turbo Boost Max Technology 3.0: the designated "best" core can possibly be overclocked further than the remaining cores. I expect these features to carry over to Skylake-X.

 

[Bassman2003]

Thanks for your replies. The per core overclocking sounds like a great feature to make up the clock speed differences for single core applications.

 

[Elixer]

It still is worth waiting for Ryzen, you could very well see intel price cuts.
For pure encoding, a 8 core 16 thread Ryzen for ~$500(rumor) could be very good for you.

 

[Bassman2003]

Good point. I will give Ryzen a shot. If it lives up to the hype it will be a nice alternative.

 

[Bassman2003]

Doing a little more research on Ryzen has me cautiously optimistic. Looks like AMD has really set their targets in the right place. After being out of the race for so long they decided to hit Intel where they are overpriced imho. Thanks for the suggestion. I will keep a close eye on this release now.

 

[crashtech]

Too bad we don't have something similar to big.LITTLE in x86 space, four extra fast cores as in a 7700K coupled with sixteen slower cores as in a Xeon D-1581 or the like would make a potent combo for some use cases.

 

[lopri]

Used Xeon E5s are an option. You may be able to find them a lot lower than list prices.

 

[crashtech]

I think he wants high ST for some tasks, though. Made me think of that fancy Lian-Li desk case that's made for two motherboards.

 

[Bassman2003]

I would enjoy a dual setup like you mention. The problem with Xeons is they are often a lower clock speed. A parallel Ryzen setup would be about the same price as one Intel extreme edition. Any chance AMD is making these things compatible with each other in a dual CPU setup? That would make my year.

 

[crashtech]

I would enjoy a dual setup like you mention. The problem with Xeons is they are often a lower clock speed. A parallel Ryzen setup would be about the same price as one Intel extreme edition. Any chance AMD is making these things compatible with each other in a dual CPU setup? That would make my year.

As much as I am looking forward to Ryzen, there's little indication that its ST performance will meet Intel's current offerings. That, to me, presents a conundrum in your situation.

 

[unseenmorbidity]

Hello,

I have a dilemma about upgrading my system. I do video production and am currently using an i7 4790k chip based system. I was going to wait for the upcoming Skylake-X and build a system in the early fall. But to be honest, my confidence about speed improvements is not very strong considering Intel's approach.

My video editing program likes clock speed for the actual editing but anything that is encoded out prefers more cores. 8-10 cores is optimal for video encoding. My issue with the enthusiast chips is that they come in at a lower clock speed than the i7 gamer chips. So one has to basically overclock them quit a lot to get them close to the i7 speeds. Paying $1600 for the 10-core chip and being forced to overclock a lot just to match the $350 chips just drives me crazy.

I want to hope that Skylake-X will be a better performer than the current 10-core chip but I can not say I am confident,

So, my choices seem to be just upgrade to the Broadwell 10 core chip now to get better performance or wait until fall and upgrade to Skylake-X. Either way I am handing over the big bucks.

Do you see any large advantages to waiting for Skylake? Will the new 299 chipset bring anything substantial that I would use?

The frustrating thing is that the new chipset thing makes these CPU purchases permanent. You can not build up a nice system and upgrade the CPU over time. So I really am trying to time the right time to dive in as it is one and done.

Thanks for listening to me ramble and for your thoughts.

You should wait for Ryzen, no ifs ands or buts. This isn't even a contest....

You can put together an 8 core system with a decent OC on it for less than $500 for a motherboard and CPU. A similar intel setup would cost you $1200!

As much as I am looking forward to Ryzen, there's little indication that its ST performance will meet Intel's current offerings. That, to me, presents a conundrum in your situation.

Idk where you got this from, but it's not true. It won't match a 7700k obviously, but that's only a 4 core processor. If you are looking at intel's enthusiast series, then Zen will fall between 5960x and the 6900k in performance. The difference between these two is only a few percent, which is basically nothing.

 

[TemjinGold]

I would enjoy a dual setup like you mention. The problem with Xeons is they are often a lower clock speed. A parallel Ryzen setup would be about the same price as one Intel extreme edition. Any chance AMD is making these things compatible with each other in a dual CPU setup? That would make my year.

Wait for Naples perhaps?

 

[lopri]

Depends on how much ST performance you want. Some Xeons (notably E5-26_7 lines) do 3.5 GHz and beyond for ST workload. You do not have to have them in pairs, either. You can install one on the X79 (v1,v2) / X99 (v3,v4) board and it will work. You have one of the fastest CPU when it comes to ST performance and there is no other CPU that will give you more throughput without adding more cores. Note the 6950X ($1.7K) is slower than your CPU in ST workload, and the situation is unlikely to change with Skylake-X, whenever it arrives.

 

[Bassman2003]

Yes, it is kind of a complex situation. I am seeing Ryzen as the most affordable way forward with comparable performance.

 

[cbn]

What video editing program do you use?

 

[Bassman2003]

I use Grass Valley Edius. Many have never heard of it as the company is more on the broadcast side of things. At this time the program does not offer GPU acceleration but it has always been very tidy with its code and has been the best choice for real time playback/editing. I hope they do add GPU acceleration like Premiere has. The GPUs have a lot of power these days. It is a shame to not use it.