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Help this is driving me nuts>fixed! thanks all.<

B

Bleep

Diamond Member
Crazy computers. Right now I have 2 machines networked with a Hub, I can ping from one machine to the other &amp; I can ping the machine itself but there is no Icon in Networking for the other machine. I installed ICS on my main machine and set up the client software on the other machine. (I am using a modem in my internet gateway machine) The client machine even though it is set up to use the network It is still looking for a modem. I cannot access the gateway machine except by pinging so I cannot connect to the net at all using the client machine. I assigned addresses to both machines using tcp/ip bound to my network card. I do not have a keyboard or mouse connected to the gateway machine as I am using a manual KVM switch, could this be a part of the problem? you can see why this is really driving me berzerk.
Bleep
 
Do you have two nics in the host computer? Your gateway computer should have a private address similar to your client. Do you have anything shared on the host computer? If not, that explains why you don't have anything in the network neighborhood. Can you ping or see the client from the host?
 
cavingjan:
Why would I want 2 niks in my host machine?
I have file and print sharing checked. I have shared the C drive on both machines. Maybe I should have said I am using a 56K modem in the machine




<< Can you ping or see the client from the host? >>


from my post.>

<< , I can ping from one machine to the other &amp; I can ping the machine itself >>






<< Your gateway computer should have a private address similar to your client >>

What do you mean?? The IP on the gateway machine is 192.168.0.1 and the IP on the other machine is 192.168.0.2. They both have the same subnet address and the same workgroup name.
Bleep
 
Sorry, I missed the modem part. I was assuming a broadband connection.
Your IP addresses look ok. But I still am unsure about the pinging here. You say you can ping the host and ping itself. What about the host? Can it ping the client? If not, can it ping itself?
Next set of questions:
Have you tried other cables? Could you possibly have a bad cable in one of the machines or a crossover cable?
Have you tried another protocol? What brand/model nics are you using?
(Let's ignore ICS for the moment and make sure to get the basic network running first.)
 
On the machine without the modem, set the gateway (this is a tcp/ip setting) to 192.168.0.1

Also try running the internet connection wizard and choose LAN...
 
OK the gateway will ping the client and the client will ping the gateway.

I am using realteck fast ethernet and realtek 10 port Hub. I tried using a crossover cable and got the same results, I dont want use a crossover as I have 4 machines I want to connect up.
whizkid

<< On the machine without the modem, set the gateway (this is a tcp/ip setting) to 192.168.0.1 >>

the machine with the modem is the gateway. I know the machines are seeing each other by the ping results why they dont see each other good enough to put up a ICON in network neighborhood I dont understand. I had it going at one time and had to shut my machines down and have not been able to get them going again.
Also when I used the ICS client disk I used connect to LAN
Bleep
Just went back and looked in network neighborhood and played around did not change anything refreshed it a couple of time and got the ICON for the other machine to come up. Exited out went back and could not get it going again.
 
What are your other computers on the network doing? Can any of them see either computer or connect to the internet? AKA can we isolate the problem to the gateway or the client?

Could it be a network browsing issue?
 
cavingjan:


<< What are your other computers on the network doing >>


Nothing.. Just cracking RC5. As to your other question I dont know. I am having one heck of a time getting the networking going, been at it on and off for several weeks, sometimes it works sometimes not, I would think that once each machine sees the other why when I close out network neighborhood everything goes to shlt. As to the gateway machine I am using that machine now to access the net.
Bleep
 
Hi Bleep.

ICS is a very strict and strange animal to get going if ANYTHING in the process is goofed up.

The Win98SE gateway machine MUST be the DHCP server, so don't set your IP addresses manually. As for network neighborhood, do you have all your machines in the same workgroup in network properties>identification tab?

viz
 
Viz:
Yes the win 98SE machine is the gateway.


<< so don't set your IP addresses manually. >>

I dont understand what you are saying. I thought even though I set the IP,s the gateway translates the addresses to the one used by my ISP. I think that if I get the network going right I can get the internet shareing going but until the network gets a little more reliable I dont think I will ever get the share to work.
Bleep
 
I got a 4 computers at home and 3 at work networked together and using ICS (the ones at home are not networked to the ones at work 🙂). It's really not too difficult. On the computer with the modem, when you setup ICS it sets that nic with the 192.168.0.1 IP address. you can not set IP's on the other ones. Make sure they are all set to the same group and that each computers is set to automatically set IP address.

🙂

MOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooooooooo.............

 
SpaceWalker:



<< each computers is set to automatically set IP address >>


I dont understand this. If I let the machines set there own addresses how am I going to know what to put in the ping command. I have assigned IP addresses to all the machines starting with 192.168.0.1 which is the gateway the next machine is the same except .2 and so on. why will this not work?
Bleep
Added---I went back into the configuration on the client machine and set it to set the IP automatically but when I did that I do not have a subnet mask set either. How can it work without a subnet mask?
 
It will automatically get the subnet from the DHCP server (your gateway, assuming that ICS acts as a DHCP server.)
To get which IP address to put in to ping, you will have to use winipcfg to get the IP address of the computer and then go to the other computer and ping it.

Note: for the record I wish to state that I am not familiar with ICS. Just regular networking.
 
cavingjan:
Thanks for the advice. I got the network to work--for now anyway--I have zone alarm on the gateway machine if zone alarm is running it will allow me to ping but not allow anything else. When I shut it down the network works just fine. I run it with no icon in the tray because I dont like the blinking, so I did not even think about it running. I cant seem to be able to change the setup in zone alarm to allow me to use the network but that is another problem for another day. I will work on the ICS tommorrow.
Bleep

 
Bleep, saw your call for help!

Don't you just love win9x and networking? :|

Anyways there are alot of confusion in this thread, so I'll try to clear some issues.

First, there's nothing wrong with assigning IP adresses manually to the other machines, BUT you'll have to enter DNS info as well, since DHCP takes care of that too. The ICS software automatically sets up a DHCP server yes, but it's not a very good one, and it in NO WAY NEEDS to have any machines requesting IPs from it.

Second, your KVM shouldn't interfere with this at all, so don't worry about that 😉

OK now to getting this thing to work 😱 First you might want to remove other protocols than TCP/IP since they can confuse things. Ok since you say you can ping between the machines that means the network is up and running. The problem then if you can't access internet from both machines lies in the firewall software, or your TCP/IP settings on the &quot;client&quot; machine.

Just to make sure I'll go through what I think you should have:

ICS computer NIC:

IP: 192.168.0.1 (automatic when you enable ICS)
mask: 255.255.255.0 (also auto)

&quot;client&quot; comp NIC:

IP: 192.168.0.X (where X is whatever number you like from 2 to 254)
mask: 255.255.255.0 (doh 😉)
default gateway: 192.168.0.1
DNS: (here you have to find the info the ICS comp uses for DNS when it's connected to the net, and enter that: from dos prompt: ipconfig /all (not sure this works in 9x since I haven't used it for some time, but there are proggies that can find this info for you if you don't know it))

OK assuming you've got all that configured correctly you should be able to get access to the internet from both computers. The only thing that might hold you back is the firewall. Try with it disabled first, if it works you know for sure where the problem is. Now to ZA, I assume you use the freeware version, since you haven't specified. The freeware version has a &quot;bug&quot;, that hampers it quite alot IMO, you can't run high internet security and ICS at the same time 🙁 So if that's what you're trying to do, tune ZA to medium internet security, and you should hopefully see a difference. You might have to add the LAN addresses in the config, I had to do that I remember, but I can't remember where that is right now. Look around and you should find it, it says something like trusted IPs or something like that.

With Internet access out of the way only filesharing remains. What you want is to enable &quot;File and Printer Sharing&quot; for the network adapters (I assume you want to share files since you're concerned about the network neighborhood icon). OK now you should share at least one folder on each machine, I read you shared your C: drives STOP THAT RIGHT NOW!!!! BIG security breach right there, NEVER EVER share a complete drive, just subfolders!! I've had issues with 9x and this stuff before, and to be truthful it's a pain 🙁 Try to mount one of the shared folders as a network drive if you can't see them in network neighborhood, you should have a menuitem for it in explorer. Write something like this: \\computername\folderyouwanttoconnectto and chose your driveletter from the drop down menu, if this works you know the sharing is ok and it's just win9x playing havoc with your mind (as it is known to do🙁)

That's all I can think of right now, most important of all, don't give up and you'll beat it into submission sooner or later 😉

Good luck

Two-Face

/edit clarity and some syntax 😱 edit/
 
TwoFace:
Thanks for the reply, you have given me a lot (for me) to digest I will have to mull this over in my mind until it makes some sense to me. About sharing the C drive as the gateway machine really does nothing but D-Net I am not sure it makes any difference. If I get everything working I plan on setting up a little machine with Freesco on it for security. I might ask at this time how do I unshare the C drive, I also have the printer shared as a network printer is this enough?
Bleep
 


<< The Win98SE gateway machine MUST be the DHCP server, so don't set your IP addresses manually. >>



Not true. 🙂 I'm running three computers (1 Win98SE, 2 Win95A) on a LAN with static IP addresses and the Win98SE computer is successfully sharing a 56K modem.

What TwoFace said seems to be correct AFAIK. I have a few other things to add though.

This is on the client computer: Go into the TCP/IP settings for the NIC. Click on the DNS tab. For the host put in the network name for the host computer. My Win98SE computer is called allah, so I have allah under the host setting for all the client computers. Also under the DNS tab put in the DNS servers for your ISP.

Now go in on both computers and add NetBEUI. Bind NetBEUI to file and printer sharing on both computers. Unbind file and printer sharing from TCP/IP on both computers because it's a big security hole. Also on both computers in the network protocols list, you should have Client for Microsoft Networks, and Microsoft Family Logon installed (I dunno if the Family Logon is required, but I have it installed). Also on that screen make sure that the Primary Network Logon is Client for Microsoft Networks. Also go into the file and printer sharing service and make sure it's actually enabled. 🙂

Now go into IE on the client computer. Go into the connections tab of the internet tools screen. Click on the LAN settings. Disable proxy server. Put an X in the box for automatically detect settings.

Also in IE on the host computer go into the connections tab of the internet tools screen. Click on the sharing button and make sure that the sharing is enabled.

Did that work? I don't think I forgot anything.
 
Sukhoi:


<< Also in IE on the host computer go into the connections tab of the internet tools screen. Click on the sharing button and make sure that the sharing is enabled >>


I dont find this. All find are mail and news Sinc. Windows update Related links and internet options and I dont find it in internet options.

TwoFace:
All I share now is the D drive which is the CD ROM. Yes it is the free Zone alarm. It works too good in this instance.
Bleep
 
I see that we are getting into a HUGE difference of opinion here on how to do the same thing. 🙂 Not that any of us are exactly wrong (save for my remark on static IP use for the ICS clients apparently 🙂) but this is an example of the many different ways of setting up a home network. 😀

For the issue of using NetBUI for LAN only connections.....yes, this will work, but unbinding TCP/IP>file and printer sharing from Bleep's gateway host will do the same thing, and be less confusing. Besides, this is the first thing that needs to be done to secure from the Internet.

For sharing the whole 'C' drive, I tend to agree but if he has file and print sharing unbound, AND a personal firewall, he is well protected.🙂🙂

It appears that Zone alarm is protecting the LAN side NetBIOS port, so that is why things start to work when he shuts Zone Alarm down altogether. Can Zone Alarm be configured to only watch the Dial-Up adapter (modem) interface??? I don't know the answer to this question. 😕

I might propose that we have Bleep try to set up the default configuration of Win98 ICS on his network, with DHCP used, AND using the configuration diskette for the client machines. The default ICS install might just be the easiest in the long run, IMHO. 🙂

viz
 
Damn I completely forgot about this thread yesterday evening 😱

I have to agree with viz here, we're starting to offer too many options... focus on one thing at a time Bleep. Your shares should be fine if the only complete drive you share is the CD-Rom, nothing wrong with sharing folders don't get me wrong here, but sharing an entire drive (especially the C: drive) is IMO completely nuts. You DC guys should remember the guys that have come to us complaining about the being hacked, when it really was a worm and an open C: share. Not sure I agree with you about well protected with this tho' viz, never good enough protection is my motto, but then I'm paranoid 😉

So now ZoneAlarm is the only problem? If so I think you are right viz ZA is protecting his LAN side NetBIOS. It's either that or ZA doesn't belongknow what adresses to the LAN and which don't. You'll have to tell it what adresses belong on your LAN Bleep, I only wish I remembered how, since I haven't played with ZA in a while 😱 Oh and don't forget to set both InterNet Security and LAN security to medium (or higher for LAN security if you can live with the decrease in functionality) once you have it configured properly regarding your LAN adresses. Note here that I used LOW InterNet Security, but would never recommend that if you can run medium or higher.

I'll try to check back later this time 😉

Good luck

Two-Face
 
Well everybody I got it going. I was really confused (still am a little) but what do they say confusion is the better part of valor?😉
I want to thank everyone that posted in my thread I appriciate it very much.
One other thing I did not know is that the connection has to be made already on the gateway machine before the shareing would work.
Now on to the firewall problem.
Bleep
 
Hehe good to hear it works Bleep 😎

The firewall is the thing now, but that connection should have an option (same place you enabled sharing of it) that enables Dial on Demand I think it's called. This makes it dial out whenever a computer on the network requests an outside IP, be careful with this if you don't know exactly what's going on in your network tho' since it won't stop and ask you for a password or anything (if it already knows the password that is) it'll just dial and sit there dumb after it connects. Granted it'll disconnect after a while of inactivity if you have that option enabled, I know I don't since M$ OSes have a tendency to regard anything that isn't IE related as inactivity, that means that for instance irc is regarded as inactivity no matter how much you type 😱

Just be careful with it, and configure your DNet clients properly so they don't trigger outgoing calls if you don't want them to 😉

Have a good evening/afternoon/night 🙂

Two-Face

/edit damn I need a speeeel checker 😱 edit/
 
Here's how to get Zone Alarm set up.

Install it. Put it on either medium or low security for the LAN, and medium for the internet side. Go into the advanced security options, and add the IP numbers for the client computers. You might also have to put a check mark on the NIC in the host, I'm not sure. Hopefully that'll work.
 
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