help pick audio equipment for new house

[simas]

buying a new house and would like to pick audio equipment (receiver +speakers), and would like your input.
current house equipment is Westinghouse TV paid with Sony 5.1 system I bought from ABT 10-12 years ago.

I will be buying Vizio P series TV , and thinking of right receiver to add - what should I be looking for?
DHCP 2.2, "HDR" support, ?

Don't care about playing music off my mobile devices, my media collection is on NAS (in both MP3 and FLAC), don't care about Bluetooth streaming. single room set up.

budget : not sure - where is the price/performance curve on this? $500 for receiver and 4-600 for speakers ok?

thank you

 

[giantpandaman2]

You just miss the best deal on a Vizio P. On CyberMonday they had the p65-c1 for $1499! Doh!

As for your basic value receiver that will sound decent and last a good while, you're probably looking at a Denon in your price range. As for speakers, I'd say Pioneer or ELAC. Everyone has a different sweet spot on what they want to pay for what they get in terms of sound, but that will get you started with some really good values that sound good. You didn't mention how big of a space you want to fill and how loud you want it to get...if you could give more detail there we might be able to point you in a more specific direction.

 

[mdram]

is that 500-600 for 2.1? 3.1?5.1?

how big is the room? HxWxL?

how much sub do you want?

 

[simas]

Thank you for heads up- I will keep an eye on P65-c1 as well

For the room - it is 19x14.5, sort of weird shape (sloped/vaulted ceilings) so I wonder whether 'smart' room learning receivers would benefit. The primary media appliance device is probably Nvidia Shield TV and some TDB BR playback device (old PS3 died so looking for replacement).

I try to buy things either from newegg or from ABT locally (Chicago) - and happen to stumble of advertisements on newegg yesterday for various Yamaha lines , i.e. RX-V481
How do those manufacturers compare?

 

[giantpandaman2]

Thank you for heads up- I will keep an eye on P65-c1 as well

For the room - it is 19x14.5, sort of weird shape (sloped/vaulted ceilings) so I wonder whether 'smart' room learning receivers would benefit. The primary media appliance device is probably Nvidia Shield TV and some TDB BR playback device (old PS3 died so looking for replacement).

I try to buy things either from newegg or from ABT locally (Chicago) - and happen to stumble of advertisements on newegg yesterday for various Yamaha lines , i.e. RX-V481
How do those manufacturers compare?

Almost any modern receiver will have some sort of room correction.

The difference between brands is open to a lot of debate. I have an A-Series Yamaha that I'm quite happy with. Bulletproof, well built, sounds good, but that's a tier above the RX-line. I don't know how close they compare. At the price range you gave, I'd say just get the best value. Right now, Denon is probably your best bet. You could try for a refurb if you want a better deal. I'm leery of Onkyo's of late because they tend to break in a few years. Both my sisters had Onkyos. They both broke (though one was able to get Onkyo to replace the fried chip) within 5 years.

Your room sounds pretty large. The low end Pioneer speakers sound great for the money...but demand quite a bit of power to get loud. For a surround sound system, though, you won't get close to the sound at that price. The ELAC's are better for stereo listening, may be too expensive for a full home theater with 5 speakers. None of them will look particularly good, but that's a given if you want good sound at a relatively low price. If you want a louder HT system and don't mind sacrificing a little quality (especially for music listening) then the Take Classic 5.1 system is still a good bet.

 

[mdram]

start with 2.1
add a center
add surrounds

$500 or more for a sub for that room would not be out of line

 

[poofyhairguy]

I have had all the different major brands of AVs and by far my favorite is Denon. It has the best auto-room correction (which is HUGE), and they often have a ton of features for the price. Just avoid the refurb ones, Denon doesn't do a great job testing them.

 

[simas]

Thank you for all of the comments - what I should be looking for in new Denon? or what new Denon should I be looking for in 300-500 range?

Regarding speakers - I think I am reading that those would be significantly more than I thought. What is 'not junk' threshold on speakers right now? what should I be looking for?

 

[giantpandaman2]

The Pioneers are the cheapest I would go that are definitely "not junk." You can get a full 5.0 set within the price you mentioned. Adding a BIC sub for a few hundred would be okay for HT applications, but I wouldn't use BIC's for music. The difficulty is that your space is so big the Pioneers might not get loud enough.

If I were in your shoes, I'd probably get an ELAC system, working my way from 2.1 up into a 5.1. The sub would either be a DIY flatpack (via dayton audio) or an SVS.

 

[simas]

Ok. thank you - for a neophyte here, any way to decode this?
ELAC is the manufacturer (I am looking at their offerings now), correct?
BIC? SVS? Brands? Models? How would this go with Denon receivers ?

 

[gpse]

I recently moved into a house and bought this setup about a month ago:
Denon AVR-S720W
Pioneer Andrew Jones Front Towers, Centre Channel, and Book Shelfs for surround
BIC America F-12 Sub

The sound quality is amazing for the price, I watch a lot of movies and didn't know what I was missing!

 

[nathanddrews]

@simas do you want to use Atmos/DTSX? It's definitely worth considering. IMO, height speakers alongside a 5.1 configuration sounds much more immersive than a regular 7.1 setup. Sounds like your ceiling would pose challenges to install overhead speakers though. You can also use speakers pointed up to reflect off the ceiling. While not as immersive, it's still pretty good. Just a thought that if you are buying a system to be "futureproof", you may want to consider it.

As for AVRs, I have been a long time Yamaha owner (mostly RX-V8xx+ and Aventage products), but I really like some of the options Denon offers when it comes to room correction and subwoofer EQ. You can't really go wrong between either of those brands, but in all honesty you likely won't be disappointed by anything in the $500 range. It's when you get into the $100-300 range that sometimes things can get kinda bad. Sometimes.

 

[giantpandaman2]

@simasYou can also use speakers pointed up to reflect off the ceiling.

Terrible idea. Vaulted ceilings will not "bounce" the sound correctly. Bouncing sound also only "works" for only a single position. Also, Atmos isn't worth it in the price range we're discussing. (I daresay it's barely worth it at all.)

Back to Simas's post.

ELAC and SVS are both manufacturers. ELAC's you will have to get through a retailer. The new Andrew Jones designed speakers are all very highly rated.

SVS sells subwoofers direct via their website.

 

[simas]

If it helps, the back wall goes up to the normal height of the first floor, front wall goes up to height of the second floor, there is also an opening between vaulted family room and loft upstairs. the room borders kitchen on one side so it is not at all enclosed box. I tried to attach picture downloaded from redfin but am not sure how to do it.

I looked at and think am comfortable with Denon AVR-2300W (https://usa.denon.com/us/product/hometheater/receivers/avrx2300w) which seem to tick off the right boxes for current DRM requirements (HDCP 2.2, etc) and format support (Atmos , DTS:X). Not sure what I am missing from Audyssey 'Gold' levels , ok with paying $600 for it.

now to speakers - anything specific I should be looking at within ELAC and SVS? $1000 to start with , floor standing.

 

[giantpandaman2]

Pair of ELAC Debut F5 towers and a Hsu VTF-2's will put you slightly over. I like SVS subs, but at this price (500-600), I think the Hsu's are a better value. (Hsu Research subwoofers are highly regarded though at the top end I prefer SVS.) The towers are expensive, so if you need to stay under, I'd get the B6 bookshelves first that can be relegated to your surrounds later. Honestly, you'll probably be pretty happy with how the bookshelves sound as left/right if you have the subwoofer handle the low frequencies.

 

[WhiteNoise]

I'll second Hsu Research for the sub; I own one and it is pretty amazing. I also own a velodyne sub as well which is another brand to consider if you don't mind dropping some good coin. SVS is also a very good sub company.

 

[mdram]

If it helps, the back wall goes up to the normal height of the first floor, front wall goes up to height of the second floor, there is also an opening between vaulted family room and loft upstairs. the room borders kitchen on one side so it is not at all enclosed box. I tried to attach picture downloaded from redfin but am not sure how to do it.

I looked at and think am comfortable with Denon AVR-2300W (https://usa.denon.com/us/product/hometheater/receivers/avrx2300w) which seem to tick off the right boxes for current DRM requirements (HDCP 2.2, etc) and format support (Atmos , DTS:X). Not sure what I am missing from Audyssey 'Gold' levels , ok with paying $600 for it.

now to speakers - anything specific I should be looking at within ELAC and SVS? $1000 to start with , floor standing.

look for a 2200 on clearance
or a 3200, there have been some very good deals on these lately
they are last years models, but are hdcp2.2

 

[simas]

as a small update - picked up two of the SVS SB12-NSD off Amazon to be my subs.
Missed two of the good Fry's sales for Denon, keeping eyes open
Also looking at Elac pricing to complete speaker build once moved in.

 

[giantpandaman2]

If you don't mind the old 2200 model it's a good deal.

Elac speakers don't seem to go on sale much. I haven't paid close attention though.

 

[simas]

I don't mind older model but the refurbished pieces is what scares me - no experience with this. Is this broken/repaired equipment, somebody's returns, etc? Some things refurbished are ok if they are a good you will use for a short amount of time, for me audio receiver/TV is a thing you buy until it breaks or a lot of time passes (my last TV and 5.1 theater in the box are both >10 years old).

So I am watching Fry sales (they had two recently on new Denons) and waiting for pick up 2300W or later models.

 

[cmdrdredd]

as a small update - picked up two of the SVS SB12-NSD off Amazon to be my subs.
Missed two of the good Fry's sales for Denon, keeping eyes open
Also looking at Elac pricing to complete speaker build once moved in.

I have Elac F5 Tower speakers and a C5 center in my game room and have been very pleased with their performance for the price. I could have gone with more expensive speakers but I took the chance and found them to be surprisingly good speakers. I also use a Denon x2200w AVR to power them and have been very happy with it as well. The rest of my setup includes some bookdhelf speakers I had unused here for surrounds, Pioneer ATmos Modules for overhead effects and a Power Sound Audio 15v subwoofer with an Anti-Mode 8033s-II EQ. The Denon AVR does a great job with the Audyssey XT room correction and has had no trouble powering all my speakers at high volumes. I've gone up to reference level on the AVR and it never had problems. My room isn't setup for that volume level so I don't go past -10dB with movies.

Anyway don't be afraid of the x2200w or any of the 2015 Denon models if you find a good price.

 

[simas]

awesome, thank you. Elac speakers (F5? F6? B6 if I do bookshelves) and center is what I am planning to go with. house purchase is 3 days away and moving is probably 4 weeks so I have time.

I know I asked a lot - any recommendations on proper wiring for these speakers?
just run the think gauge speaker wire down and across basement ceiling into the location of back speakers? Any reason to do anything other than speaker wire ? the reason I am asking is that I will be wiring the house with standard RJ45 (standard cat6 cable) and wonder what else I need to wire ..

Thank you

 

[simas]

Picked up new Denon AV-X3300W at Fry's special deal for $540 (https://slickdeals.net/f/9624212-de...es-01-07-17?src=SiteSearchV2_SearchBarV2Algo1) so now it is to speakers and wiring..

 

[cmdrdredd]

awesome, thank you. Elac speakers (F5? F6? B6 if I do bookshelves) and center is what I am planning to go with. house purchase is 3 days away and moving is probably 4 weeks so I have time.

I know I asked a lot - any recommendations on proper wiring for these speakers?
just run the think gauge speaker wire down and across basement ceiling into the location of back speakers? Any reason to do anything other than speaker wire ? the reason I am asking is that I will be wiring the house with standard RJ45 (standard cat6 cable) and wonder what else I need to wire ..

Thank you

The b5 is their base model bookshelf and the b6 is the step up. They offer a higher end line called UniFi but I don't think you could do wrong with the entry level speakers if on a budget. The F5 are floor standing speakers. You can make your own speaker wire if you wanted but I just buy the big spool of it from amazon and use that. Unless you have an unusually long run any standard 16gauge wire should be fine. You can simplify the connections by adding banana plugs to the end but I personally don't use them. I just twist and tin the ends with a bit of solder and use the wire straight to the posts. I don't unplug my gear so I didn't feel the banana plugs would benefit me. You have a lot of options on how to wire it up. You can put in a wall plate with speaker terminals and hook the speakers up there, run the wire direct to the speakers mounted on the wall. Depends on what the setup will be.

 

[giantpandaman2]

What dredd said was accurate. The main differences are in the bass when you go from b5-b6. B6 will have legitimate 48hz low end, which is quite good for a bookshelf. This means they can do most music fine without a sub. You'd still need one for movies, however. The floorstanders are usually easier to situate for a home theater and will likely sound the best.

As for wiring, I'd probably just pick up a big spool from monoprice along with any wall plates/banana plugs I might use. 16 gauge should be fine for your short runs, but I might go down to 14 or 12 gauge for the longer runs. There's a calculator for it somewhere, but I don't remember where. Probably not necessary, but why not? As for the banana plug/wall plate/directly letting the wire run through...that's really more for aesthetic reasons and ease of use if you plan on changing things later. Sound wise they're pretty much all the same.