HELP ME!!! - UNEXPLANABLE UNSTABLENESS!!! everybody check this out, i need as much help as possible !

E3000

Member
Aug 23, 2002
78
0
0
Hey people,
My luck with computers is unbelievably bad and always has been, but my latest problem far eclipses all those that ive had in the past (and thats pretty bad). The problem i have is that i bought a brand new computer (custom-built) and although it is a powerhouse, it is just about the most unstable computer ive ever seen in my life.

The computer randomly freezes or reboots itself at any point in time and me, my mates, and all the tech-heads ive asked, have no idea what causes this whatsoever. Sometimes it happens as soon as i boot into Windows, sometimes after half an hour, sometimes after a couple of hours, when im listening to an mp3, playing a game, surfing the net... whatever! the computer will suddenly freeze up and there will be nothing i can do except reboot it (not even push power-off button), or it will reboot itself uncontrolably and i will lose whatever i am doing.

I am pretty sure that it is not a Software/Microsoft Windows problem because it happens with both Windows ME and XP (i dual boot the two). I returned the hardware to the point of purchase, where they tested the parts and sent them back saying they were all OK (im not sure what methods they used to test them). I have tried using minimum spec (CPU, Motherboard, RAM, GFX, HDD) but the problem is still there. Maybe it is a hardware compatability issue? I dont have a clue :(

Here is a list of my hardware components:

CPU: Intel P4 Northwood 2A GHz
Motherboard: ASUS P4533-E (updated with the latest version of the bios too)
RAM: 256MB PC2100 DDR SDRAM
GFX: Gainward 64MB GeForce4 Ti-4200 Golden Sample
HDD: Maxtor Diamondmax 40GB ATA133 7200RPM (x2)
and the usual extras such as CDROM, CDRW, FDD, etc


Other problems include dodgy shutdowns (i think this may be a Windows ME thing tho), the screen going black (and the monitor going into standby mode - only comming out when the ESC key is pressed), Jumpy framerates/music/games... etc.

Could this be a problem with the power supply (PSU)? A program that came with the Motherboard, ASUS Probe Utility, sometimes reports the CPUfan is below the threshold; although the fan is still spinning constantly and the CPU is NOT overheating (somewhere around 40degrees c). I once read somewhere that Intel P4's underclock themselves if the fan isnt functioning properley or if they start overheating... this could explain why games start jittering and framerate drops while playing (maybe). Also, sometimes after a random reboot, the BIOS reports that the CPU speed has changed or is incorrect.


Im not sure what the problem could be... I thought power supply because i can sometimes hear a whining sound when the computer is shut off (shouldnt it be silent?); also, the same sound was heard when i plugged the 12v power connector into the Motherboard.


I hope there is someone out there who can help me... and i hope this long post hasnt put all the potential helpers off. :eek:
 

Stark

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2000
7,735
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0
if you can, return it (if they can't fix the problem, they don't deserve your money).

if you can't, take it back and have them replace the motherboard, psu, and memory.
 

DARRIN

Platinum Member
Feb 25, 2000
2,756
0
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I would guess power supply or RAM. If you have 2 sticks of RAM try them one at a time. How many watts is you PS?
 

thorin

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
7,573
0
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1) Try running a memory test on it (MemTestx86
2) What temp is your CPU running @ ? (If you don't hav ea utility installed that can tell you then run your sys with normal usage for a while then reboot and check in the BIOS ..... Read your MB manual if you don't know where to find the reading [RTFM])
3) What case/PSU are you using?

Thorin
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
Yeah sounds like a PSU, or memory...could also be poor household voltage since you mention this problem in the past.

 

Insidious

Diamond Member
Oct 25, 2001
7,649
0
0
You shouldn't have to spend your time troubleshooting a computer that never worked!!!!!!!

If they can't make the hardware work, then gently express your dissappointment while you are insisting on a complete refund.

Better Business Bureau needs to know the name of this builder if it/they are a business and won't supply what you paid $$ for.

Finally, all else tried.............. That's what small claims court is for.

You can't let them buffalo you into believing it is your fault when the system they built for you doesn't work.

Stick to your guns................ This bogus stuff from computer suppliers has to stop......



note: Of course, all this ranting assumes the computer never worked. If it worked for a while then quit, you need to backtrack....... all the way to a format and undo whatever was done to make it quit.
 

Duvie

Elite Member
Feb 5, 2001
16,215
0
71
I am not sure about winme, but winxp has a feature that by default is set to restart the computer for any fatal error or basically what normally would be a BSOD or bue screen of death....Try turning that off and see if you get errors instead....

When computer restarts in winxp does it tell you to send an error report??? (another defaulted thing) If not it is unlikely ram....

May be PSU....sounds like it could be...what is the psu, wattage, etc...

Take it back to them and tell them you want a refund....YOu have a problem and that is the best they can do...I bet you those a-holes likely turned the pc on for a brief period and said "works fine to me"...
 

staticfly

Member
Feb 16, 2001
179
0
0
well.. ive build enought computers to know how you feel.

Between VIA, bad power supplies and incompatible video cards... i'd say go for the power supply first.

Just try a different one. Try one stick of memory. Try a different stick of memory.

If you still have probs, rma the mobo.

If you STILL have problems. Try a different gfx card. I've had video cards that literally caused files to get corruped over time. Don't ask, it still doesn't make any sense.

When you've done all this, bump this thread and tell us what it was.
 

Telsari

Member
Oct 6, 2002
26
0
0
I agree, you should return the whole thing to the place you bought it from. You shouldn't waste time and effort on something THAT unstable.

Even if it is the PSU or the RAM, it would still be too much of a headache.

Politely explain your problem and ask for a full refund.

If they do not refund your money, then notify the BBB.

LAST resort, (you probably don't need to do this), sue them.
- I had a friend who bought a laptop from an *unnamed location* (can't tell me, part of settlement), the laptop broke multiple times, he got it fixed multiple times at their service center. Then it breaks yet again! He gets an expert to check it out and documents HORRIBLE servicing, including taped together parts, a totally melted down modem, broken heat shields, etc. Of course, when he files suit, the company settles rather than go through expensive lawyer fees, lol.
 

Chad

Platinum Member
Oct 11, 1999
2,224
0
76
Definately sounds just like when my Power Supply went bad, I would suspect it first. I recommend sending it in and having the people you bought it from fixing it.
 

E3000

Member
Aug 23, 2002
78
0
0
Thanks for all the help guys...

Thing is, i bought the stuff from a few places (risky, i know) and assembled it myself with a mate. I know it aint the way i assembled it that is/was the problem because i have done this many times; but this is the first time ive had a problem like this and nobody seems to have seen a problem similar.

Im using a full Tower case with a 350w PSU. I think (but im not sure) that the 12v P4 power connector on the PSU is faulty because it made a funny noise when i plugged the power cable into the PSU (and the wall), but was silent when i took the 12v connector out; (this is with the computers power switch off).

The thing that made me think it could be the CPU (or its fan) was that the ASUS Probe Utility reported that it was below the threshold. I could be the Motherboard's built-in features (CPU overheat protection, etc) messing up; but i have had the motherboard replaced so i doubt it. It could also be the GFXcard because the system doesnt feel accelerated at all (when it DOES work, you can only tell its more powerful when playing games... desktop and all other use is practically the same as my old PII333 with Voodoo3).

That was the reason for asking you all... because if anyone had had a similar problem in the past they might be able to help me get to the root of the problem. Ill maybe try to get a CPU replacment and if that doesnt work then PSU replacement. If that doesnt work then...

:(
 

Shagga

Diamond Member
Nov 9, 1999
4,421
0
76
Originally posted by: E3000
Ill maybe try to get a CPU replacment and if that doesnt work then PSU replacement. If that doesnt work then...


:(

I would try the PSU first! :frown:
 

Bovinicus

Diamond Member
Aug 8, 2001
3,145
0
0
I agree with the PSU problem; that is most likely the cause. Run only the necessary components as you said you were at some point (Motherboard, CPU, Memory, Video). If you already replaced the motherboard, then I highly doubt that is the problem unless you ran into some seriously bad luck. First, goto www.memtest86.com and download their utility. Have it run for several hours. If it reports no errors, then your memory is probably fine. Then, replace the PSU. A bad PSU can wreak havock in a large variety of strange ways. Next, try to get ahold of a spare video card. Replace your current one, and see what happens. If that is still not the problem, then perhaps the slow spinning fan is a problem. Unless this is a motherboard with ASUS's Q-Fan technology, then it should not be changing more than about 500RPMs. Replace the fan, and see what happens. If you STILL suffer from problems, then perhaps you did get a bumb CPU. Try to get ahold of another P4 for testing purposes (I know, that's going to be hard), and just RMA it if you can't. Good luck.
 

mrman3k

Senior member
Dec 15, 2001
959
0
0
Try getting a good PS like Antec, Enermax. Keep us posted so we can help get this thing working.
 

E3000

Member
Aug 23, 2002
78
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0
MemTest86 v3.0 reported the following errors...


WALL TIME = 5:29:25

TST PASS FAILING ADDRESS GOOD BAD ERR-BITS COUNT
5 14 00004FB6928 -79.3MB DFFFFFFF FFFFFFFF 20000000 1
5 14 00005FB6908 -95.3MB DFFFFFFF FFFFFFFF 20000000 1
5 22 0000EFAC3E8 -239.7MB EFFFFFFF FFFFFFFF 10000000 1
5 22 0000FF23B48 -255.1MB FFFFFFFF FFFFFFFF 10000000 1
 

CrazySaint

Platinum Member
May 3, 2002
2,441
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Originally posted by: E3000


Im using a full Tower case with a 350w PSU. I think (but im not sure) that the 12v P4 power connector on the PSU is faulty because it made a funny noise when i plugged the power cable into the PSU (and the wall), but was silent when i took the 12v connector out; (this is with the computers power switch off).
:(

Try using the EZ Boot (or whatever its called) feature where you can plug one of the standard 4 pin power connectors directly to the motherboard. The 4 pin connector should be near the ATX connector.
 

nigham

Junior Member
Oct 14, 2002
1
0
0
If you're not sure about your 12V connector... can't you check the 12 V voltage through your BIOS?
 

E3000

Member
Aug 23, 2002
78
0
0
Just checked the HARDWARE MONITOR in my BIOS... heres the results:

VCORE VOLTAGE - 1.53v
+3.3v VOLTAGE - 3.15v
+5v VOLTAGE - 5.08v
+12v VOLTAGE - 12.09v
 

skyking

Lifer
Nov 21, 2001
22,766
5,929
146
four errors in memtest86 over a 5 hour period is not good, but not unheard of with "workable" ram. Good ram will give 0 errors for 24 hours of memtest86.
The ram is returnable, IMO. The kicker would be to test the RAM in any other machine. If it still gives errors, it is outta there!
 

E3000

Member
Aug 23, 2002
78
0
0
It seems the system is slightly more stable when using Windows XP than in Windows ME (no surprise there), but im still convinced that it is a hardware problem as i have seen these crashes and reboots happen with both. After my latest (few) crashes, the system has gone straight into the BIOS on startup (after rebooting the machine) and the following message has been displayed:

"During your last boot-up, your system hung for an improper speed setting. Your system is now working in safe mode. To optimize the system performance and reliability, make sure the CPU speed conforms to the specifications of your CPU".



This leads me to think that the problem has GOT TO BE with either the CPU or the Motherboard.

Also, a dodgy CPU/PSU/Motherboard could also cause MemTest86 to produce errors couldnt it? If the power isnt constant then the whole system would be unstable... same as if the CPU was dodgy (or am i wrong?).
 

Trevelyan

Diamond Member
Dec 10, 2000
4,077
0
71
CPU hardware problems are pretty rare.. I would be leaning towards the motherboard, memory, and PSU...

Try returning all of them, one at a time and see if stability increases.
 
Mar 29, 2002
286
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i had exact same problem as you describe, its gone since i bought better ram..
2.4 p4
gigabyte IHXP
maxtor pci card
2 x wd1200jbs
2 x maxtor 80gb dx740s
2 x maxtor 4g160j8 160gb
1 DVD & 1 Lite on Burner 1 floppy
antec 1035 case w/300 watt PS
i have win 98 win XP win2 adv serv in it, in all three while just browsing the web a window would close hmm, whats that about i thought, it got worse when i tried to RAR/ACE an archive, the bigger the archive the worse the CRC errors where, hmm, never seen that before i thought?
ok lets rip a DVD to see how much faster this new puter is = no go, instant reboot, try photoshop 7 same thing = reboot
hmmm, this unit was 100% stable w/1.8 & pc800 in here, ok buy real 1066 kingston, sure enough the 2 sticks arrived and my reboot probs are gone..
rip DVDs / create archives not a hint of problems..
"laughs" my PS is marginal but functional antec PP-303XP = 300watt
hope this helps, i bet the ram has issues..