Help me set up an Pc based audio system...

[imported_Tango]

I have all my music collection ripped into MP3s and stored on my notebook PC. Now I have decided to start building a new desktop computer, and I am quite done choosing everything but I really can't understand what my possibilities are in the audio department.

I will experience every media with my computer, I will buy a 24" monitor as a TV (with a TV tuner card) and will be listening to the music stored in the PC as well.
I don't have great surround needs, but a 5.1 system would be nice. What I am quite demanding about is the quality of the sound for my mp3s... I am not interested in the Iper-Bass sound usually associated with games orientered speakers. I will mostly be listening to Jazz music.

Here's my idea: instead of investing money in a good 5.1 computer speaker system, why not connect the PC to a media center receiver, and from there to some good 5.1 loudspeakers?
I have no idea about the required connections, gadgets, accessories needed for this setup, and reading on the forum I got the idea that this is not something very popular among you experts... why is that? A good speaker setup thought for music/HT wouldn't outperform any computer speaker setup?
Also... if I connect my PC to an external receiver, will it be the receiver taking care of developing the sound, or still my audio card will be the most important part of setup?
Sorry for the newbie kind of question... but the whole thing confuses me...

Ok.. I'll be waiting for your advices...
Thanks and Regards

 

[Excelsior]

YoYohowsdajello should reply to this thread soon, seeing as he is the soundman, but I will give my 2 cents.

You are already on the right track, considering you think it is a better idea to get a receiver and pick your own speakers to go with it. That definitely is the way to go.

This sound card can putput 5.1 through the digital outputs unlike any other consumer card on the market. I would get that card if I was concerned about getting true 5.1 sound out of my computer.

However, you can just get a receiver that has analog 5.1 inputs and then use any card that supports 5.1. Id still go the digital route myself.

I am assuming you don't have any speakers or a receiver yet, right?

If so, what is your budget?

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

🙂

Yeah, it's all about budget really.

Some guys here will spend $500 on a videocard every year or two but think you're crazy to suggest that Logitech z-5500s might be worth upgrading from.

Excelsior covered the connecting to a receiver. It's pretty simple really.

If you want the soundcard to do the work, then get a receiver with 5.1 analog input (also called 6 channel direct or 8 channel if you have a 7.1 receiver).

If you want a receiver to do the Digital to analog conversions and decode DD streams etc, then you'll want a digital connection.
If you don't need surround sound in games, then you can get a cheap $25 card to do this. If you want to stay digital for everything then the X-Mystique that Excelsior mentioned is a good one.

If your budget is less than $400, then I'd stay stick with computer speakers.

Beyond that, you can get some decent HT solutions going.

Just to throw a some numbers out there, you could get a really nice sub for about $450, a nice receiver for $300 or $400, and a nice 5.0 speaker set for about $1200.

You can certainly do it for less of course, but you have a lot of great options in that range.

As for connecting to the receiver, if you do it with analog, you just need three 1/8" to dual RCA adapters. For a digital connection, just an optical or coaxial cable (possibly an adapter if you have an Audigy card).

Also, if you haven't done so, check out AVSforum for more info.

 

[imported_Tango]

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello
🙂

Yeah, it's all about budget really.

Some guys here will spend $500 on a videocard every year or two but think you're crazy to suggest that Logitech z-5500s might be worth upgrading from.

Excelsior covered the connecting to a receiver. It's pretty simple really.

If you want the soundcard to do the work, then get a receiver with 5.1 analog input (also called 6 channel direct or 8 channel if you have a 7.1 receiver).

If you want a receiver to do the Digital to analog conversions and decode DD streams etc, then you'll want a digital connection.
If you don't need surround sound in games, then you can get a cheap $25 card to do this. If you want to stay digital for everything then the X-Mystique that Excelsior mentioned is a good one.

If your budget is less than $400, then I'd stay stick with computer speakers.

Beyond that, you can get some decent HT solutions going.

Just to throw a some numbers out there, you could get a really nice sub for about $450, a nice receiver for $300 or $400, and a nice 5.0 speaker set for about $1200.

You can certainly do it for less of course, but you have a lot of great options in that range.

As for connecting to the receiver, if you do it with analog, you just need three 1/8" to dual RCA adapters. For a digital connection, just an optical or coaxial cable (possibly an adapter if you have an Audigy card).

Also, if you haven't done so, check out AVSforum for more info.

Ok... you already helped a lot understanding the picture...

So the idea is getting a decent audio card, from there going into receiver/amplifier and then to the speakers.

Now, some more dumb questions:

- The difference between buying a card that has digital Dolby Live outputs like the one that Excelsior proposed as opposed to analog conncetions is only in the lack of a large bundle of cables or also in the quality of sound? How would this sound card be compared to the common Audigy 2 or Audigy 4 that so many people use... or compared to the new Creative X-Fi?

- Now... could you (if it's possible) explain me in VERY simple terms what part of the job would be done by the card and what part by the receiver? I understand it's something very technical and probably you are banalizing the whole thing trying to explain it to a newbee like me... still any effort in this direction is very appreciated.. 🙂
I understand you already replied to thi question here:

Quote:
If you want a receiver to do the Digital to analog conversions and decode DD streams etc, then you'll want a digital connection.
If you don't need surround sound in games, then you can get a cheap $25 card to do this. If you want to stay digital for everything then the X-Mystique that Excelsior mentioned is a good one.

But I still am not sure to have a clear idea of the differences in these approaches...

- A 2.0 or 2.1 system would be better than a 5.1 system if only music were involved? My use will probably be something like 80% music listening, 18% movies, 2% (or less) games... so if a good stereo system has clear advantages over a 5.1 I would consider it an option.

I am right now considering a setup with an X-Mystique card, a receiver (any idea about this?) and some Fluance 2.0 or 5.0 speaker system plus a Subwoofer.
How do these speaker generally perform? I see they are pretty cheap... on the other hand my apartment is pretty small so I don't require a LOT of power... I live in the quintessential small New York 1-bedroom, and the people living upstairs probably wouldn't enjoy, my midnight Jazz listening as much as I do....

So: Fluance SV-10
Fluance SM-938
Fluance SX-HTB
Fluance AV-HTB

Of course any other brand would be fine to me... I just browsed on the forum and saw you generally consider them pretty good for the money...

Ok... I'll shut up.. I already wrote too much...

Thanks again for your time.. you're helping a lot...
Best regards

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Sorry it took me a while to get back to this... personal problems 🙁

Uhhh... lets see (sorry if I say something dumb in my post here, my concentration is kind of broken)

For the soundcard....

A couple issues with an analog connection:

Your receiver might do a better job than a software/soundcard solution for decoding a DD/DTS stream from movies.

You wont be able to set crossovers as far as I know with this.... issue with this would be that your sub and speakers would both be getting full range signals and there might be a good deal of overlap in the 50 to 200hz range if there isn't a crossover between them. I don't know if you can set crossovers with any of the Audigy cards: Stolen from a post Astrallite made regarding crossovers: "No...bass redirection does not work like you think it does. It's not a crossover. It only sets what the subwoofer plays (or doesn't play). Creative Europe forums had like a 200 page running forum over this issue. Creative admits its a problem, but it's not high on their list of fixes. (In other words, they aren't interested in fixing any of their problems, just adding new technologies to keep you occupied...while creating new problems). "

If you're doing analog for music, the older Creative cards aren't the best at this. An X-Fi would probably be a good investment if you're getting a real HT setup.

Issues with a digital connection:

NON-DDL card-
You can get a card that just does PCM stereo out for games and music... this will give you a straight connection of the source material to your receiver and your receiver will convert this to analog and amplify it. The limit in quality here will be your receiver's quality. You will only get a stereo signal, so if you want music/games on more than just the front two speakers and sub, you'll need to enable a surround processing mode like Dolby Prologic II or even just 5 channel stereo.

I forget if this was mentioned above, but you woudn't get 5.1 sound from games then for real. You could get it out of all the speakers, but you wouldn't be able to tell a guy was behind you etc.

You'd still get to send out an AC3 stream to your receiver for DVDs etc and those would work just fine

DDL Card:
PCM stereo for music same as above

You'd get a DD stream from games which would give you 5.1 surround from games

AC3 for DVDs same as above


I don't know if that answered any questions or not....

As for receiver vs soundcard doing the work, I tried to include that above... did that make any sense?



2.0/2.1 vs 5.1 would be better for music if you spend the same amount of money on each.

With the amount of music you're listening to, it might be a good idea to get the best stereo or 2.1 set you can afford now and leave yourself and upgrade path for 5.1 down the road.

That's what I should have done probably. I ended up getting a Fluance SX-HTB set, a nice receiver, and a $109 dayton 10" sub. I guess it was a nice learning experience, but I don't have any of it anymore (1.25 years later).
I didn't know if I was really serious about this stuff back then, so I guess it's good I waited to go overboard right away.

For 2.0 vs 2.1, generally really high end setups will just be 2.0
You have to spend a lot to get really deep bass out of speakers alone though. I think it would be a better idea to get a sub than a 2.0 set.

More expensive speakers aren't necessarily going to be any louder than cheaper ones... so that's not what it's all about.

I forget what you said your budget is...

If it's really low (like my first one was) then a Fluance SX-HTB set along with a dayton 12" sub and a cheap receiver (like a sub-$200 one) might be a good plan for you.

I really don't know much about the Fluance sets beyond their AV and SX sets. I'm not sure about their $300/pair range stereo speakers, but I know there are some great options out there from other companies close to that range.
Ascend 170s
Axiom M3tis
ELTs with bass stations (skip the sub then)
Paradigm atoms/titans/focus ($199/$229/$319)
JBL e series (Best Buy has them)

There's a bunch of others too.

Pair most of those with a dayton 12" sub or something similar and you'd have a nice 2.1 set going.

So, overall I think if you're doing mainly music it would be a good idea to concentrate on a 2.0/2.1 set for now along with a 5.1/6.1/7.1 receiver for now and then add in other speakers as you go if you feel the need (center next).

 

[Excelsior]

Agreed. Since he said he is listening to 80% music, then a good 2.0/2.1 system should be his best bet. In that case he could get something like the Chaintech, for now, and use its optical out.

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Originally posted by: Excelsior
Agreed. Since he said he is listening to 80% music, then a good 2.0/2.1 system should be his best bet. In that case he could get something like the Chaintech, for now, and use its optical out.

Good idea on the Chaintech. I meant to say that above.

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior
Agreed. Since he said he is listening to 80% music, then a good 2.0/2.1 system should be his best bet. In that case he could get something like the Chaintech, for now, and use its optical out.

Good idea on the Chaintech. I meant to say that above.

Yeah, I figured. I mean...if he just wanted to have a good 2.0/2.1 system for now, then the Chaintech would suit him just fine. Then later when he added more speakers he could upgrade the sound card.

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior
Agreed. Since he said he is listening to 80% music, then a good 2.0/2.1 system should be his best bet. In that case he could get something like the Chaintech, for now, and use its optical out.

Good idea on the Chaintech. I meant to say that above.

Yeah, I figured. I mean...if he just wanted to have a good 2.0/2.1 system for now, then the Chaintech would suit him just fine. Then later when he added more speakers he could upgrade the sound card.

Or keep it if gaming is only 2% of what he's doing 🙂

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior
Agreed. Since he said he is listening to 80% music, then a good 2.0/2.1 system should be his best bet. In that case he could get something like the Chaintech, for now, and use its optical out.

Good idea on the Chaintech. I meant to say that above.

Yeah, I figured. I mean...if he just wanted to have a good 2.0/2.1 system for now, then the Chaintech would suit him just fine. Then later when he added more speakers he could upgrade the sound card.

Or keep it if gaming is only 2% of what he's doing 🙂

But what about movies? Or would he just use a software decoder and run analog 5.1 to a receiver?

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior
Agreed. Since he said he is listening to 80% music, then a good 2.0/2.1 system should be his best bet. In that case he could get something like the Chaintech, for now, and use its optical out.

Good idea on the Chaintech. I meant to say that above.

Yeah, I figured. I mean...if he just wanted to have a good 2.0/2.1 system for now, then the Chaintech would suit him just fine. Then later when he added more speakers he could upgrade the sound card.

Or keep it if gaming is only 2% of what he's doing 🙂

But what about movies? Or would he just use a software decoder and run analog 5.1 to a receiver?

I was thinking he's use the digital output from the Chaintech so he'd get an AC3 stream for DVDs he watched.

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior
Agreed. Since he said he is listening to 80% music, then a good 2.0/2.1 system should be his best bet. In that case he could get something like the Chaintech, for now, and use its optical out.

Good idea on the Chaintech. I meant to say that above.

Yeah, I figured. I mean...if he just wanted to have a good 2.0/2.1 system for now, then the Chaintech would suit him just fine. Then later when he added more speakers he could upgrade the sound card.

Or keep it if gaming is only 2% of what he's doing 🙂

But what about movies? Or would he just use a software decoder and run analog 5.1 to a receiver?

I was thinking he's use the digital output from the Chaintech so he'd get an AC3 stream for DVDs he watched.

Really? The Chaintech can output an AC3 stream? ..I thought it just did stereo through the digital out.

I am so lost.

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior
Agreed. Since he said he is listening to 80% music, then a good 2.0/2.1 system should be his best bet. In that case he could get something like the Chaintech, for now, and use its optical out.

Good idea on the Chaintech. I meant to say that above.

Yeah, I figured. I mean...if he just wanted to have a good 2.0/2.1 system for now, then the Chaintech would suit him just fine. Then later when he added more speakers he could upgrade the sound card.

Or keep it if gaming is only 2% of what he's doing 🙂

But what about movies? Or would he just use a software decoder and run analog 5.1 to a receiver?

I was thinking he's use the digital output from the Chaintech so he'd get an AC3 stream for DVDs he watched.

Really? The Chaintech can output an AC3 stream? ..I thought it just did stereo through the digital out.

I am so lost.

It can do PCM for stereo and will pass a DD stream to a receiver if it's encoded already.

The only reason to get a DDL card is if you want 5.1 for games really.

Looking back I don't play games enough to justify my own upgrade from the Chaintech to the X-Mystique.

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: Excelsior
Agreed. Since he said he is listening to 80% music, then a good 2.0/2.1 system should be his best bet. In that case he could get something like the Chaintech, for now, and use its optical out.

Good idea on the Chaintech. I meant to say that above.

Yeah, I figured. I mean...if he just wanted to have a good 2.0/2.1 system for now, then the Chaintech would suit him just fine. Then later when he added more speakers he could upgrade the sound card.

Or keep it if gaming is only 2% of what he's doing 🙂

But what about movies? Or would he just use a software decoder and run analog 5.1 to a receiver?

I was thinking he's use the digital output from the Chaintech so he'd get an AC3 stream for DVDs he watched.

Really? The Chaintech can output an AC3 stream? ..I thought it just did stereo through the digital out.

I am so lost.

It can do PCM for stereo and will pass a DD stream to a receiver if it's encoded already.

The only reason to get a DDL card is if you want 5.1 for games really.

Looking back I don't play games enough to justify my own upgrade from the Chaintech to the X-Mystique.

Oh snap...thats great.

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Guess I don't feel bad anymore keeping him waiting an hour and 45 mintues on Saturday 😉

Where did you go, dude?

 

[imported_Tango]

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello
Guess I don't feel bad anymore keeping him waiting an hour and 45 mintues on Saturday 😉

Where did you go, dude?

LOL.. sorry. Now I feel guilty. I had a girl preventing me to get online during the weekend...

I just realized I left something out of the picture: I will be doing some serious video editing work on my PC... does the audio card mean anything here? I used to work on an apple for the video editing stuff, but now I am going 100% PC...

I checked what you have been saying and I am quite set on getting an X-mystique card (but if the cheaper chaintec will do the same job apart from games then it'll be the chosen one) then a 5.1 receiver and a 2.1 speakers system... leaving space to upgrade to a 5.1 system in the future.... probably going for a couple of Fluance speaker plus a Subwoofer..

Now... I don't really have a budget, but I would like to stay cheap.... mainly because I am changing country a lot, so basically it might very easily happen that next year i will be selling everything because I have to move... I don't feel like investing A LOT of money on hi-fi equipment right now. I had even thought about keep working on the laptop, but I just cannot afford anymore the long waiting times in Adobe and Macromedia, the small screen etc etc.

What do you suggest as a receiver?

And again: you guys rock! Thanks so much and have a great week!

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Oh good, it was a girl and not death preventing you from posting :thumbsup:

If by video editing you mean 2d stuff, then CPU and ram are going to be big factors.
If video editing involves 3d stuff (like 3d rendering) then a videocard would also be important... but you're probably not doing that.

If you don't game, the Chaintech will do everything you need it to do.

As a receiver if you want to stay cheap, getting a refurbished one is a good way to go. You can get a cheap Onkyo or something off ecost for example.

 

[CSMR]

Go with a stereo system and a stereo receiver. If you want multichannel later, replace the receiver then. I would advise and E-MU 0404 and a Sharp EX-111 - loook on ebay, audio circles, or head fi for one of these. Speakers are the most important component - look on the Audio Asylum for speakers that jazz-listeners there recommend. If you can get stereo speakers with lower bass extension that would be preferable to a subwoofer at your budget from what I read.