HD-DVD and Blu-ray Output to be Degraded if Not Over a Protected Digital Connection

[ramuman]

Posted over at Ars:

Story

and Ars discussion:

Discussion

It would seem both camps are doing everything they can to ensure neither format is ever adopted.

First off, let's not turn this into a thread about how to pirate or anything like that. This is a thread on the format war.

The discussion over at Ars has some funny points, particularly a few posts down

[Sarcasm]
You know, they might as well make sure that people who buy the nex gen DVD format should have to scan their purchase reciept into the player everytime and have it verified over the internet before allowing the player to play it. Of course HDCP over HDMI should be mandated too because everyone has the latest Onkyo and Denon recievers with HDMI switching or a Sony XRD with multiple HDMI inputs. This all assumes that the core encryption algorithm is strong enough not to be broken - and we know how great its worked for DVDs
[/Sarcasm]

 

[duragezic]

Ah well. I never understood why people thought the lack of HDCP makes the 2005FPW crap, because standard DVDs look fine on it, and if the new ones will look even a little better without HDCP, I guess I can't complain! It'll be a long time before I own a HDTV so with 956x540 should be good enough for me for a couple of years.

 

[Lonyo]

Repost. x11ty billion.

 

[Looney]

We've known this from the VERY beginning.

 

[ramuman]

Originally posted by: Lonyo
Repost. x11ty billion.

link?

EDIT: Oops:
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...atid=38&threadid=1785594&enterthread=y

I searched for HD DVD, not Blu ray and I didn't see a thread specifically on the down converting, sorry.

 

[0roo0roo]

yea reposty. but damn those %@# companies. hopefully asian pirate factories plug this hole quick..

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

This sucks for those folks with a set that doesn't support HDCP.

If it's any consolation, these discs should look considerably better than your average DVD. The constrained resolution is a bit higher than DVD and you get an added advantage of higher color sampling (link).

 

[Ornery]

...those folks with a set that doesn't support HDCP

What percentage of the ATOT early adopters do you think that would be?

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: Ornery
...those folks with a set that doesn't support HDCP

What percentage of the ATOT early adopters do you think that would be?

*shrug* Might be a good opportunity for a poll.

 

[0roo0roo]

makes one wonder if sony will follow its own rules. will they degrade their output from the ps3?

 

[BD2003]

Originally posted by: ramuman

It would seem both camps are doing everything they can to ensure neither format is ever adopted.

Seriously. Its as if they consider their product to be an absolute necessity handed down by god himself.

I won't buy into it until theres a single format that can output HD on ANY HDTV.

 

[mercanucaribe]

Originally posted by: KnightBreed
This sucks for those folks with a set that doesn't support HDCP.

If it's any consolation, these discs should look considerably better than your average DVD. The constrained resolution is a bit higher than DVD and you get an added advantage of higher color sampling (link).

Pretty lame! How is that going to prevent piracy again?

 

[BD2003]

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: KnightBreed
This sucks for those folks with a set that doesn't support HDCP.

If it's any consolation, these discs should look considerably better than your average DVD. The constrained resolution is a bit higher than DVD and you get an added advantage of higher color sampling (link).

Pretty lame! How is that going to prevent piracy again?

Because theoretically, one can copy the full HD stream over DVI with no loss by hacking into the cable and hijacking the stream.

But as others have said before, it wont be long before its cracked. In all the history of A/V electronics, has there EVER been a widely adopted security standard that HASNT been cracked? To my knowledge, there is none.

 

[newParadigm]

hmm...i JUST bought a Panasonic XGA DLP projector. It has DVI input, but it was designed for use with a computer. (dvi-? vs dvi-i, is that the problem).

Does anyne know if it is likley it supports HDCP?

 

[BD2003]

Originally posted by: Looney
We've known this from the VERY beginning.

We may have, but the problem is that the vast majority of people in the market for this not only do not know what HDCP is, but they are not going to find out that they wont be able to use it properly until AFTER they buy it, if they even do figure out why.

And it wouldnt be fair to berate them for not knowing every little detail about buying their equipment ahead of time.

To be fair, its the studios that are asking for this to be enforced, and we all know how incredible their decision making has been in the recent past.

The way its currently set up, retailers, studios, and manufacturers will all likely lose tons of money because of all of this.

 

[Rickten]

there will be conversion cables that you can buy from china or something that will fake the security and pass the signal onto anything. Why are people worried about this.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: newParadigm
hmm...i JUST bought a Panasonic XGA DLP projector. It has DVI input, but it was designed for use with a computer. (dvi-? vs dvi-i, is that the problem).

Does anyne know if it is likley it supports HDCP?

What model is it? You should be able to find out at projectorcentral.com

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: Rickten
there will be conversion cables that you can buy from china or something that will fake the security and pass the signal onto anything. Why are people worried about this.

its the matter of putting us through such bs in the first place.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: BD2003

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: KnightBreed
This sucks for those folks with a set that doesn't support HDCP.

If it's any consolation, these discs should look considerably better than your average DVD. The constrained resolution is a bit higher than DVD and you get an added advantage of higher color sampling (link).

Pretty lame! How is that going to prevent piracy again?

Because theoretically, one can copy the full HD stream over DVI with no loss by hacking into the cable and hijacking the stream.

All you would need is a DVR with component input and a hard drive and you could record the full resolution signal. By requiring HDCP and a digital signal, studios can prevent casual copying/recording of their movies.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo

Originally posted by: Rickten
there will be conversion cables that you can buy from china or something that will fake the security and pass the signal onto anything. Why are people worried about this.

its the matter of putting us through such bs in the first place.

HDCP encryption is more than just a cable. You will need a box to strip the protection off the signal and pass it onto the display.

And you can expect the MPAA to attempt to shut down anybody distributing them - keeping the black market for them "small potatoes" in the grand scheme of things.

 

[0roo0roo]

so does anyone know? does the ps3 degrade its output for films?

 

[Rickten]

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo

Originally posted by: Rickten
there will be conversion cables that you can buy from china or something that will fake the security and pass the signal onto anything. Why are people worried about this.

its the matter of putting us through such bs in the first place.

HDCP encryption is more than just a cable. You will need a box to strip the protection off the signal and pass it onto the display.

And you can expect the MPAA to attempt to shut down anybody distributing them - keeping the black market for them "small potatoes" in the grand scheme of things.

my point is if you have an older tv that doesn't have the correct input I predict you will easily be able to find a solution at a one time cost. Early adopters always get screwed its just the nature of things.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
so does anyone know? does the ps3 degrade its output for films?

AACS is required for both Blu-ray and HD-DVD movie playback. If the PS3 plays movies, you can be 100% guarenteed it will have to abide by the ICT.

To answer your question, yes the PS3 will have to lower the resolution for movies over component (I assume the PS3 has component outputs) if the movie requires it.

 

[EightySix Four]

There's already a small box device out on the net that will fake HDCP support, can't remember where the hell I saw it though. Expensive at $400 though.

 

[Chadder007]

Originally posted by: KnightBreed
This sucks for those folks with a set that doesn't support HDCP.

If it's any consolation, these discs should look considerably better than your average DVD. The constrained resolution is a bit higher than DVD and you get an added advantage of higher color sampling (link).

Some people say it doesn't really look all that much better than Upverted DVD signals though....