Have you discovered the amazing IQ of Supersampling AA (ATI 5000 series)

[Phil1977]

I got myself a 5750 a while ago. My CPU is a Athlon II 250 (overclocked a bit) and 4 GB of RAM...

As some already know I play a lot of games and I have a 18.5" ACER LCD purely for this purpose. It has a native resolution of 1366 x 768 and allows me to get insane frames or up the quality settings all the way...

I read anandtechs review and they mentioned new AA modes for the 5000 series Radeons.

So I gave it a go. MSAA and Adaptive MSAA really looked identical to me. They only difference is how transparent textures look. This can be found often in trees and fences....

So then my attention turned to Supersampling AA.

From the research I gathered it is the best form of AA available. Whereas MSAA and adaptive MSAA only have your native resolution "to work with", Supersampling AA renders the image in a multiple of your native resolution...

It basically has more information to work with. It also doesn't have issues with transparent textures or textures in general... Everything gets AAed

The biggest difference in games is once you move. MSAA has the tendency to have shimmering textures or crawling lines. Its subtle but if you are a perfectionist (like I am unfrotunatly) you know what I am talking about...

Supersampling gets rid of this...

If your game has a setting for AA, just set it there and set the AA mode in the driver.

If the game has no setting for AA, just enable the desired level of AA inside the game and then set the AA mode in the driver...

Although my card is not the quickest, it is powerful enough to use this feature in many games...

In bioshock I could play 2x SSAA just fine. Mass Effect allowed to me use 4x SSAA and BF2142 is even playable with 8x SSAA enabled...

Especially if you have a smaller screen like I do, these new 5000 series cards are not getting pushed by many games. Also more and more games are console ports. And SSAA is a amazing technology to make these games look much better...

SSAA really makes the image appear less like a game rendered in realtime and more like a rendering done for a single image.

I am sinply amazed by SSAA and will try to use this feature as much as I can. I might even upgrade to a faster videocard, simply to allow me using this feature in upcoming games.

Interested im your findings / comments!

Take care!

EDIT: I took an image of Bioshock. This is W732 DX9 1024 x 768 4x SSAA 16AF

This one is Mass Effect under XP DX9 1366 x 768 4x SSAA 16x AF

I'm locking this necro'd thread because it references arguments that are no longer relevant.

Please start a new SSAA thread if you want to.

Super Moderator BFG10K.

 

[HurleyBird]

Oh yeah, it's so unfortunate SSAA only is working on DX9 at the moment, seems like a very artificial limitation. Right now, I'd take SSAA over DX10 any day of the week.

 

[nitromullet]

You might be interested in checking out some of our very own BFG10K's research into 5xxx series image quality at: http://alienbabeltech.com/main/?p=12648

 

[Phil1977]

Oh yeah, it's so unfortunate SSAA only is working on DX9 at the moment, seems like a very artificial limitation. Right now, I'd take SSAA over DX10 any day of the week.

Oh I didn't know that...

That explains why I got the same FPS in Clear Sky, no matter which form of AA I set in the control panel...

You might be interested in checking out some of our very own BFG10K's research into 5xxx series image quality at: http://alienbabeltech.com/main/?p=12648

Will check it out!

EDIT: Awesome article. Found the bit about LOD settings very interesting... I haven't noticed any AF issues, even when looking for it. I use ATI TRay Tools so its easy to make the LOD adjustment!

EDIT EDIT: Hmm I played around with 3D Center Filter test and could not see these dead zones...

 

[BFG10K]

That explains why I got the same FPS in Clear Sky, no matter which form of AA I set in the control panel...

You won't get any AA from the control panel in Stalker games because ATi hasn't implemented driver AA for Stalker's deferred renderer engine.

EDIT: Awesome article.

Thanks.

I use ATI TRay Tools so its easy to make the LOD adjustment!

Yeah, but unfortunately ATT didn't work for me at the time I wrote that piece.

 

[Phil1977]

Yup Stalker has ingame AA setting! Haven't tested Stalker yet, but all my other games that have ingame AA settings, when you set AA mode to SSAA in CCC then you get SSAA in the game...

Regarding the AF dead spot issue. I am having trouble identifying teh problem, but I believe this image shows it?

Is that the issue? That grey ring on the left image?

 

[soccerballtux]

You might be interested in checking out some of our very own BFG10K's research into 5xxx series image quality at: http://alienbabeltech.com/main/?p=12648

ABT has the worse site layout of any review sites I've visited-- the performance graphs are unreadable. And white text on black background? No thanks.

 

[SirPauly]

It's great to see a more ideal positioning for super-sampled and glad to see gamers enjoying this feature.

 

[Phynaz]

Funny how everything old is new again.

Didn't the original Voodoo cards us SSAA?

 

[Ben90]

Its subtle but if you are a perfectionist (like I am unfrotunatly)

lulz

 

[Phil1977]

lulz

Fail LOL

New drivers should be out on Thursday. Interesting to see what features they have added...

 

[Phil1977]

Funny how everything old is new again.

Didn't the original Voodoo cards us SSAA?

Yes they did! So did ATI in the early days. But then MSAA took over because it offered much better performance.

 

[zerocool84]

Yes they did! So did ATI in the early days. But then MSAA took over because it offered much better performance.

Yea I remember how big of a performance drop there was when enabling AA in games on my 5500.

 

[Phil1977]

Another pic from HL2 Lost Coast... Take note of the fence on the right side. This is usually an area where MSAA fails...

This is at 1024 x 768 4x SSAA 16x AF W7 32 DX9

 

[BFG10K]

Regarding the AF dead spot issue. I am having trouble identifying teh problem, but I believe this image shows it?

There are currently two issues with the 5xxx's AF: sharp mip transitions, and also texture aliasing. Your image shows both.

Another pic from HL2 Lost Coast... Take note of the fence on the right side. This is usually an area where MSAA fails...

The fence will also be AA'd with MSAA if you use AAA/TrAA. Super-sampling is mainly beneficial for regular surfaces that exhibit texture and/or shader aliasing.

 

[BFG10K]

ABT has the worse site layout of any review sites I've visited-- the performance graphs are unreadable. And white text on black background? No thanks.

I think my graphs look awesome. What part do you find hard to read about them?

 

[pcslookout]

I think my graphs look awesome. What part do you find hard to read about them?

As do I. Don't worry about it I think he is just envious he doesn't have his own hardware reviewing site.

 

[BFG10K]

Heh, thanks.

I actually spent a long time designing them with the goal of producing the best looking graphs on the internet. In my opinion, I've reached that goal.

 

[PCboy]

ABT has the worse site layout of any review sites I've visited-- the performance graphs are unreadable. And white text on black background? No thanks.

How old are you? Like 60? How is this unreadable?

That is the first time I've ever seen someone complain about a hardware resource site's visual aesthetic.

 

[x3sphere]

Yes Works wonders for cleaning up shader aliasing. Here are some screens of games running under SSAA on my rig (I have a 5970):

http://relm.exophase.com/ME2/SSAA/MassEffect2-2010-01-29-23-00-57-20.jpg
http://relm.exophase.com/bioshock-2010-01-30-00-51-43-00.jpg
http://relm.exophase.com/L4D2/4XSSAA/L4D2-4XSSAA4.jpg
http://relm.exophase.com/ME/MirrorsEdge%202010-01-09 14-50-23-48.png
http://relm.exophase.com/crysis/Crysis64 2010-01-02 14-40-55-84.png



Please don't inline 2560x1600 images. It ruins the forum view, including 2560x1600 users like myself.

Super Moderator BFG10K.

 

[Ben90]

Its better than a white background and light blue text.

Alright here is my question though: when forcing SSAA through drivers, yet the games settings already call for lets say 4xMSAA does the scene get two different passes of AA or does the driver override any game engine settings. If someone could explain to me what exactly happens when you force AA in the drivers it would be much appreciated.

*edit*

Wow those screenshots were not even 7680x3200. Next time we need to be wowed, a more respectible resolution would be apprieciated... Like the old saying goes: "if it takes less than 5 minutes to download a screenshot, your e-peen is less than 5 inches long"

 

[NoQuarter]

Its better than a white background and light blue text.

Alright here is my question though: when forcing SSAA through drivers, yet the games settings already call for lets say 4xMSAA does the scene get two different passes of AA or does the driver override any game engine settings. If someone could explain to me what exactly happens when you force AA in the drivers it would be much appreciated.

*edit*

Wow those screenshots were not even 7680x3200. Next time we need to be wowed, a more respectible resolution would be apprieciated... Like the old saying goes: "if it takes less than 5 minutes to download a screenshot, your e-peen is less than 5 inches long"

I think the driver overrides any game engine AA so you just get 1 AA pass!

 

[Phil1977]

Hey x3sphere!

Thanks for images! Stunning IQ. Really takes the games to the next level...

I find it really hard to play any game that doesn't have AA. E.g. I have Dead Space and it's an awesome game. But no AA. Not with Nvidia, not with ATI. And the jaggies now really stick out!

Mirrors Edge looks absolutely stunning. Could very well be out of a anime movie.

I couldn't get SSAA going in Crysis Warhead. Any tips?

I selected AA inside the game and AA mode in the CCC to SSAA, but I ended up with just regular AA. Same FPS as well...

Thanks for sharing!

 

[Zstream]

I think my graphs look awesome. What part do you find hard to read about them?

Just a thought but the colors are too light. There needs to be a clear distinction in a graph. Think Red/Blue/Green/Yellow.

And the site appears to be a horrible wordpress theme. That is just IMO ()

 

[x3sphere]

Hey x3sphere!

Thanks for images! Stunning IQ. Really takes the games to the next level...

I find it really hard to play any game that doesn't have AA. E.g. I have Dead Space and it's an awesome game. But no AA. Not with Nvidia, not with ATI. And the jaggies now really stick out!

Mirrors Edge looks absolutely stunning. Could very well be out of a anime movie.

I couldn't get SSAA going in Crysis Warhead. Any tips?

I selected AA inside the game and AA mode in the CCC to SSAA, but I ended up with just regular AA. Same FPS as well...

Thanks for sharing!

Indeed it does To enable SSAA in Crysis Warhead you'll need to force DX9 mode. Create a shortcut to the main executable, right click on the shortcut to edit properties, then add -DX9 onto the target parameter.